Diablo® III

WF seems more efficient; no Shadow Power

Leveled young beauty DH, dressed her up in secondhand gear was lying around, stripped WF of the Scoundrel and way you go! DPS in 150k-170k range WF does a good damage and feels more efficient compare to Calamity and Manticore.

I'm going trough the acts, A3 Inferno MP8 right now rarely dying. Ghom went down no worries. Enchantress follows me most of the time equipped with Maximus, switching to Azurewrath.

For reflects I swap to Blackthorne pants and belt gaining in life regen and a few points in LoH.

Inspired by Rav1n's "MP10 no Shadow Power" topic and surprisingly amazing survivability I'm running an agressive build http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/demon-hunter#bcYXQk!dXe!Zbbcaa DPSing in every 6 skill slots (Rav1n, man, I love Chocking Gas!!!) I do some skill adjustments on my way depending who I'm facing too, ignoring 5nv (who cares). My main concern is to survive and dps. Again, inspired by HC play.

So, my vision: compare to other classes with in-built DPS modifiers, Demon Hunter utilise external DPS boosters, which is "hard to read" sort of thing. And that makes class feels weak and brings EDPS type of topics and discussions.

May be we have to learn to play DH properly? :)
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Finally. Choking's getting attention. Back then, I was the only one using it.. WAY BACK. Like pre-1.03 >_<

Reasons why they aren't used..

Shadow Power is better.
They don't like it at all.
It's a waste of Disc for them

and bla bla blaaa :))

EDIT:
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/demon-hunter#UeYXlk!UXT!Zcbcab

This was my build back then..

Also, you can only use 1 Sentry then but it CRITS(only Chain of Torment), so it gives me a chance to get Disc upon crit.

Jagged was used as a main source of LoH
Dark Cloud adds both as LoH and Disc source
Choking Gas also crits
Cluster/Gas Grenades for obvious reasons.
and Shuriken Cloud for passive damage.

I was able to kill pre-Inferno Nerf Azmo and Diablo without much of a problem. It takes time though because I have tons of mitigation and only 20k-50kish DPS then :P
Edited by Chrizzle#1390 on 9/29/2013 7:56 PM PDT
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Choking gas is awesome, just the area bit too small.

If only evasive fire - parting gift has the same choking gas effect.

I remember how DH tanks with grenades pre-nerf inferno, and it looks ridiculous.
Caltrop that trap freeze enemy is cool, however.

Sobs, damn the nerf to ground.
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Choking gas is awesome, just the area bit too small.

If only evasive fire - parting gift has the same choking gas effect.

I remember how DH tanks with grenades pre-nerf inferno, and it looks ridiculous.
Caltrop that trap freeze enemy is cool, however.

Sobs, damn the nerf to ground.


I can still "perma" freeze but not as much since they did also implement that system in which monsters gains some sort of resistance per CC effect incurred.

I can get up to 10% CtFreeze and 10% CtStun..

Using Grenades - Gas, yeah, not Cluster + 3 CoT + EB spam + Marked of Death-Enemy and just.. any other build I usually run when doing melee runs.

Anyways.. seems we're talking about WF and stuff.. I love using WF with Sentries. use WF on Scoundrel and you'll just be golden.

Scoundrel with Fear KB and Fear or KB Star of Azaasdjarhwenmfkwfhi will help too.
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WF = synergy
there is no debate on that because it has a very high knockback chance
knockback = stun

btw if you have a LS weapon (2~3%) you don't need LoH, life regeneration, or SP for healing, given you have enough dps. I don't know how many people know about that but you are 11 months too late. But LS was useless when I started the game and went from LoH because I had low dps.

The devs are removing LS from the game because it is OP. I was hoping they dig it out of items (after reading Mr. Cheng's response in July) but it seems they are removing it from skills as well. Got a bit overreacted back when I saw the first RoS datamined about the change to SP. It no longer serves as a burst healing method.

Doesn't matter now, I already tested with 180k dps I can go mp6 without any
life on hit
life steal
life regeneration
even against RD packs.

ah forgot to add... 75% damage reduction and 145k ehp, no gloom ofc XD
Edited by KirusAlufras#1739 on 9/30/2013 2:12 PM PDT
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I've lived without SP.. and will continue to live without it.

The fun you get on playing "smart" rather than robotic(no offense to anyone doing RF-SP) is much more welcome to me.

It's already boring to play monotonously, why not kick the activity a notch up and make it a "dangerous" play :)

and yeah Kirus, the changes, regardless if they are good or bad, DHs tend to overcome those and still come out as FUN to use.

And if given the chance and resources, bugs or loopholes, we DHs can bring something to the team.
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The Windforce, in my opinion, is one of the most underrated weapons in the game.
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09/30/2013 06:19 AMPosted by Tropicalypso
The Windforce, in my opinion, is one of the most underrated weapons in the game.


Nyan slaps players who uses it with him :D
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09/30/2013 06:21 AMPosted by VocaloidNyan
The Windforce, in my opinion, is one of the most underrated weapons in the game.


Nyan slaps players who uses it with him :D


Nyan.. join me in a game.

I'll use..
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/demon-hunter#bljUiV!bXf!ZaaZbZ

with Fear WF, Fear Star and Nat's Helm :3

Please? ^_^
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09/30/2013 06:21 AMPosted by VocaloidNyan
The Windforce, in my opinion, is one of the most underrated weapons in the game.


Nyan slaps players who uses it with him :D


Lol, ironically, gaming with you is why I went with the Calamity.
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eww wf. played with a wf user one time. felt like i was wasting all my hatred. i think there was also a EF barb or something. i was cursing them under my breath..
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Wow, TY for the shout Defender and props on coming up with a real solid WF build. I've been saying for a year now nothing beats a WF for a Sentry build- except for a godly 6-prop rare bow, and even then it is a close call. I'm glad I could inspire someone. Mission accomplished.

I never had "proof" that the WF can out do other higher DPS weapons (other than my own math that is) until a couple months back when someone (Worx I think) with a DPS meter was in my game. At the time I was 210K sheet DPS with a Manticore, and their DPS meter said that my eDPS was ~600K. I swapped out for the Windforce and 150K sheet DPS, changing Caltrops JS for Gloom and Brooding for Vengeance. With this setup the meter said my eDPS was ~1450K. I lost ~30% sheet DPS and gained ~115% eDPS. Not the 2-3M eDPS a 150K WD or Barb puts out, but none too shabby either. It might be that high if I worked Choking Gas into it, but that extra 0.5s for LF is crucial in HC.

@Chrizzle- my pre 1.04 build: http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/demon-hunter#UcYdXV!ZcV!cYbccb My trifecta stats then were LoH, MF, and GF; nothing else mattered.

@HachiKumo- Agreed the AoE on CG needs a 2 yard buff. And IMO the gas should trail behind you too, dealing 1/4-1/2 the damage that the central cloud currently does.

@KirusAlfus- I have to disagree about your assessment of LS. By my calculations at 500AR/5K Armor you would need ~6.3% LS to heal 100% of reflect damage from a single target on a 250-300K hit. Trust me, even with all my regen and 3% LS when I run into Horde/Reflect it is a serious situation. If you watch my MP 7 Rakkis run you will see when I run into the first reflect pack and all 3 reflect at the same time while I was strafing my health dropped to ~30%. I had to stop dealing damage, smoke, and grab a globe. That was with 3% LS @ 170K DPS and ~5% HP regen/sec @ 88K HP; 550AR/4200 Armor.

@Nyan- you are the only reason my SC DH is rocking a LS Manticore. I can play WF around the CM wiz, not easy but doable. A 4 WF DH party is a lot of fun, and really potent when you have a good Cyclone Monk in game too.

@Tropicalypso- Agreed, been saying it since they buffed the WF in 1.05; one of the best weapons in the game when properly wielded.
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@Chrizzle- my pre 1.04 build: http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/demon-hunter#UcYdXV!ZcV!cYbccb My trifecta stats then were LoH, MF, and GF; nothing else mattered.


Mine was LoH, AR, AS :) things that makes me attack fast, last long. >_<

If you'll do a quick search regarding TankDHs, you'll see my posts there. Haha.
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Rav1n

I understand how much you need to recovery from reflect, but that was not my point :)
- over 3% LS is only necessary when you are hurting yourself
- RD is nerfed so they proc on/off
- drink potion if you are using a channeling skill on RD really helps
- be careful if you are dealing aoe = more edps against RD

no LS is need to play the game, you only need it if you decide to keep attacking without fleeing. SP was doing very good on this sense as a short burst. But NS (the problem) give players perma SP and right now LS is available to every class it is getting removed...

I'm playing this right now Act2
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/demon-hunter#PbXkjl!Zbe!cYbZb
pickup yard + some life regen

only in mp3 right now tho~ well you will know when you look at my HP

My problem has always been shielding and waller. RD is easy when I don't play with traps that explode over and over until I die
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any videos?
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Rav1n

But NS (the problem) give players perma SP and right now LS is available to every class it is getting removed...


Not only NS was the problem actually since there are some other skills that regenerates disc as well, in fact I see you're using multishot - suppression fire. That actually playing along with the other skills you have for that build to regenerate hatred SS - Breath Deep and Entangling Shot - Justice is served you have enough hatred regenerators to abuse and keep your multishot up all the time regenerating perma disc as well.

Basically you have a "hidden" NS without the passive skill. Is that going to be a problem too?

Please don't get me wrong, I know you were talking about SP, I just wanted to say that actually NS wasn't the only problem since there are many ways to get the perma disc needed for SP or SS

Oh yeah and I forgot vengeance with hatred regeneration and disc regeneration.
Edited by Woogmoog#1877 on 9/30/2013 12:54 PM PDT
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Wow, TY for the shout Defender and props on coming up with a real solid WF build. I've been saying for a year now nothing beats a WF for a Sentry build- except for a godly 6-prop rare bow, and even then it is a close call. I'm glad I could inspire someone. Mission accomplished.

I never had "proof" that the WF can out do other higher DPS weapons (other than my own math that is) until a couple months back when someone (Worx I think) with a DPS meter was in my game. At the time I was 210K sheet DPS with a Manticore, and their DPS meter said that my eDPS was ~600K. I swapped out for the Windforce and 150K sheet DPS, changing Caltrops JS for Gloom and Brooding for Vengeance. With this setup the meter said my eDPS was ~1450K. I lost ~30% sheet DPS and gained ~115% eDPS. Not the 2-3M eDPS a 150K WD or Barb puts out, but none too shabby either. It might be that high if I worked Choking Gas into it, but that extra 0.5s for LF is crucial in HC.
.


Told you so... :)
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Wow, TY for the shout Defender and props on coming up with a real solid WF build. I've been saying for a year now nothing beats a WF for a Sentry build- except for a godly 6-prop rare bow, and even then it is a close call. I'm glad I could inspire someone. Mission accomplished.

I never had "proof" that the WF can out do other higher DPS weapons (other than my own math that is) until a couple months back when someone (Worx I think) with a DPS meter was in my game. At the time I was 210K sheet DPS with a Manticore, and their DPS meter said that my eDPS was ~600K. I swapped out for the Windforce and 150K sheet DPS, changing Caltrops JS for Gloom and Brooding for Vengeance. With this setup the meter said my eDPS was ~1450K. I lost ~30% sheet DPS and gained ~115% eDPS. Not the 2-3M eDPS a 150K WD or Barb puts out, but none too shabby either. It might be that high if I worked Choking Gas into it, but that extra 0.5s for LF is crucial in HC.
.


Told you so... :)
LMAO heck yes you did. Lent me some 1093 DPS strength roll that was -50% of my sheet damage. 30 minutes later I bought a 1275 DPS OS for 70K. A week later that same caliber bow was 20M. You are the OG WF DH.

@Kirus-
Copy that. You can play around RD, I like to plan to take that damage if I need to. Never know when a RD pack is going to find that missing Spike Trap you planted in the corner at just the wrong time. Yea RD got nerfed and nerfed again. And now it's getting nerfed again. They're making this game way too easy.
09/30/2013 12:00 PMPosted by GodIike
any videos?

Original MP 10 video referenced by OP
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=niZWyR8NKhY
MP 7 Rakkis run
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=71SQjSQrt9o
MP 7 Siege Breaker
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1UeBZxWyeP8
MP 10 Softcore
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JHL3vdi2UYU
Edited by Rav1n#1381 on 9/30/2013 1:54 PM PDT
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Told you so... :)
LMAO heck yes you did. Lent me some 1093 DPS strength roll that was -50% of my sheet damage. 30 minutes later I bought a 1275 DPS OS for 70K. A week later that same caliber bow was 20M. You are the OG WF DH.

@Kirus-
Copy that. You can play around RD, I like to plan to take that damage if I need to. Never know when a RD pack is going to find that missing Spike Trap you planted in the corner at just the wrong time. Yea RD got nerfed and nerfed again. And now it's getting nerfed again. They're making this game way too easy.


How can you say this when RD is clearly a gear check affix.

Just put on the requirements gear-wise or rune-wise to where RD is no longer a threat, then the game is easy enough as is.

It's a persistent gear check that does absolutely nothing else.

The truest way of avoiding RD is to keep the pack outside of elite affix proximity, as once RD turns off it won't turn back on unless you cross that "line of scrimmage" or they force it past you.
Edited by ActionKungfu#1184 on 9/30/2013 1:54 PM PDT
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09/30/2013 12:48 PMPosted by Woogmoog
Basically you have a "hidden" NS without the passive skill. Is that going to be a problem too?

hidden NS?
the problem NS brings up is resource on crit. It is the core problem to a lot of 100% uptime play style
perma WotB, infinite hammer, etc.
perma freeze, infinite diamond skin, etc.
perma gloom, infinite RF, etc.

those method I have on the bar are legit ways to generate resource. Blizz is testing and reducing them so far from what I know of the datamined stuff.

Yea RD got nerfed and nerfed again. And now it's getting nerfed again. They're making this game way too easy.

Mr. Cheng was saying they are testing flat damage return, I guess that is to go with LoH which means we will still see a lot of people standing on plagues and passive over arcane sentry and fire-chain when they are attacking reflect mobs.
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