Diablo® III

Legacy Nat's Set Viable After Expansion?

Just wondering if the fast discipline regen will still outweigh the relatively low stats when level 70 items become available. Any thoughts?
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Here's my 2cents I posted about in another thread a few times about this subject.

Mystic currently is not able to reroll anything on any crafted gear period, wether boa or not. So sorry to burst your bubble on that lol really sucks I was looking to beef up my Amy or something but I guess it isn't gonna happen in its current form.

Also the whole point of rerolling on a good legacy Nats would be to reroll the mainstats mostly if your other random rolls are good. Keep in mind legacy in terms of CC CHD and ASI is pre legend buff and close to the current nerfed trifecta stat projections so those rolls are fine as is. Since Mainstat is where most our damage is coming from that's what your going to want to beef up, ontop if wearing all the new gear in ever other slot and weapon. The discipline regen + new item passive bonuses in other slots + mystic Mainstat rerolls if possible to open spots + major paragon points will make it quite formidable in my opinion. Especially keeps nightstalker off our passives an that opens up room for more builds and the new and improved beefed up passives.

I also look forward to the reduced skill cool down gems and stat points to bring SS back down to a beast level for pvp lol

Also if the proc rate buffing discussion also rebalances and returns our caltrops jagged spikes proc expect that to power a powerful oldschool tank DH build with legacy Nats again and LOH freeze etc like the old days ontop of nightstalker and punishment cluster bombs spam. O how I look forward to tanking harder than a barb again lol

See that's just it at a certain point Mainstat paragon points will make changes to the players DPS and mitigation that will become inconsequential. The end result being legacy Nats and any new Nats would be on par in DPS and EHP except the legacy player will have the 4 set bonus ontop of any other new passive gear bonuses on the other slots. The end result becomes less about gear stats and more about bonuses and dmg + bonuses like SOJ for example like you said.

I think it's a good idea to hold onto items that have certain skill bonuses and cold soj's etc because they might not exist in loot 2.0 or operate the same way and even if they are weaker perse in the Mainstat department that is all mitigated after a certain level of paragon points anyways and the special bonuses the gear provides become much more important.

It is a bandaid fix but what it does is it creates a means for any and all gear combinations to work somewhat after enough gameplay is put in opening up more options for gear choices and special bonuses rather than the huge Mainstat bonuses they provide. Which leads back to the item bonuses being more important as build changers like thy said they want to do and less about large gear stat numbers by shifting us towards paragon character stats more as enough time is put into a character since there is no cap on Mainstat point allocation. In the Short term it means new players with low hours can swap on some new gear and feel powerful but the players who have the hours put in can use even legacy Nats and jus substitute the weaker gear stats with massive paragon point stats and be on par in EHP and DPS. Which again leaves is to making gear choices based more on special bonuses rather that state numbers alone. Build changers
Edited by METATRON#1945 on 10/2/2013 6:19 PM PDT
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NO legacy is junk so you should give them to me
...
..
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If it is viable NOW it will continue to be viable, with those status cap it will be even more~

limit yourself on 4 slot does not kill your character, and if you can make resource generation a positive gain in "dps" then how can you be losing on the long run?

BUT really give me your legacy piece if you don't want them, gives me more item to do trial and error with the mystic

EDIT
I lose 25% dps with my l4n compare to those 4ns on my DH. Its your choice after alll
Edited by KirusAlufras#1739 on 10/2/2013 7:07 PM PDT
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The questions comes down to whether discipline regen is still worth the dps / ehp sacrifice. We skill changes and new items / affixes, we will have to wait and see.

However, you must keep one thing in mind. New Nats or innas or mempo will surely be obsolete by the time xpac comes. So you can take chance with L4N, if it works out, you won't have to upgrade, if it doesn't, then you will have to upgrade like the rest of the players, DH or otherwise..
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OP trust me. It will be entirely new ball game when the xpan is released. Sell off you L4N now if you can get a good deal and keep the gold for future crafting. If you trust me, I m willing to give you my DH set (ranked top 40 in the server) come xpan because I know they will no longer be good compared to lvl 70 items. New gears will drop to replace the existing gears. Blizz has given you 6 months as a transitional period for the major overhaul.
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I think defensive skills will not be as important as now when RoS release.

Remember the nerf of monster damage which indirectly nerf our defense without gloom, and a slight buff in 'duration/DR' when gloom activates.

From Data Mine, Gloom reduce 10% less damage, and all Shadow Power become LoH instead of Life steal. Life steal is only obtainable in weapons, and at max 6% not counting the reduction in inferno. LoH , however, can easily be achieved in weapons, socket, and other gears. More over the amount of LoH the new SP gives. The addition of cooldown to smokescreens. Legendary affix that gives free SS, Caltrops, mark4death etc

I don't think you have much stuffs to use your disc on. Even nerfed ToC have an affix which change the cost to hatred instead of disc. Don't tell me you want to spam disc for wolves.

The L4N basically will be a white elephant. I'm keeping it for novelty.
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Keep it just in case. I personally have 3 sets in storage.
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10/02/2013 08:48 PMPosted by HachiKumo
I don't think you have much stuffs to use your disc on. Even nerfed ToC have an affix which change the cost to hatred instead of disc. Don't tell me you want to spam disc for wolves.


L4N + SP:Night Bane + CtW = Permanent 20% bonus damage to all enemies in 30 yard radius.

Seem pretty GG
Edited by OhHellzNo#1945 on 10/2/2013 10:29 PM PDT
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it will be useless once lvl70 gears come out.
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been out of the loop.. when is this exansion supposed to be coming?

o/
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been out of the loop.. when is this exansion supposed to be coming?

o/

I predict after they shut down AH so March 2014
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I'm sure L4N will still be somewhat viable until we find the most efficient builds and gear sets. The only way I really see the new sat sets be better than L4N is if the new nat pieces are able to proc certain skills like cool downs or something. Like what ohhellznaw said nightbane permanent 20% dmg is awsome no way can the new nat set be able to do that unless 4pc nat set can offer more discipline bonus.

But either way the L4N will have different builds compared to everyone else. It would be pretty crappy if the L4N are superior to the 3rd go around of our nat set. I can See QQ in the future if this happens.
Edited by DaRkCroNo#1494 on 10/4/2013 7:47 PM PDT
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I'd keep it. Since the new expac allows you to reroll stats on items you own, you could always try to boost the Nats. Honestly it's amazing fun to use regardless. Pretty sure once you get all the Lv70 items, you would have enough damage to run L4N on lower MP's just for kicks. I do that now on MP5-8 with L4N and have another set for higher MP's.
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You guys are forgetting something.. the new set might not be called "Natalya's"

Nata + discipline as major resource bonus when you complete the set

blizz could easily make a new set that grant you "Hatred" as the major resource bonus (I do want to see a set like this).

Any new item piece by piece will always be better do to the fact they have a higher roll of core attributes.

cd might be gone, cc could be lock at 4.5% on rings, we will not know until we pick them up. But any thing good will always be "good" but you can always find better stuff or there wouldn't be a point of this loot hunt.
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Hmm, very differing opinions here. I'll keep my L4N set or even upgrade them. I've been away ever since Tank DH got killed and Train of Cinders got nerfed.

The DH has become an unfamiliar class so... what's a good amount of DPS to make this character playable and can I get there with 100m gold? I don't want to spend too much when the patch is coming. What gear should I upgrade or change? If Nightstalker isn't needed, what should I use?

Thanks everyone!
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10/02/2013 08:51 PMPosted by Phantom
Keep it just in case. I personally have 3 sets in storage.


Woah ur rich huh?! LOL!
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nightbane permanent 20% dmg is awsome no way can the new nat set be able to do that unless 4pc nat set can offer more discipline bonus.


But do you guys realize that the new set or new items already offers 20% more dmg than l4n?

It is strong in brawling and most of the game because of 'infinite' discipline, which allows you permanent shadow power or smokescreen. With the new cooldown on ss, LoH on SP the reliant on defense skills weakens.

I'm thinking that the moment you are not in mode of any def skill, you died, considering the ehp which L4N provides.

The purpose is gone when SP shift from defense to offense. Nobody uses L4N with offense as priority.
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10/06/2013 02:18 AMPosted by HachiKumo
The purpose is gone when SP shift from defense to offense. Nobody uses L4N with offense as priority.


Nobody uses L4N with defense as a priority either.

I use L4N when I want mobility. Perma gloom is whatever, you can get enough disc with Calamity + Nightstalker if that's what you're after. Infinite vaulting OTOH.....

Perma nightbane with L4N has the potential to provide L4N more DPS parity with newer gear while still providing the mobility I like.
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10/06/2013 04:34 AMPosted by OhHellzNo
The purpose is gone when SP shift from defense to offense. Nobody uses L4N with offense as priority.


Nobody uses L4N with defense as a priority either.

I use L4N when I want mobility. Perma gloom is whatever, you can get enough disc with Calamity + Nightstalker if that's what you're after. Infinite vaulting OTOH.....

Perma nightbane with L4N has the potential to provide L4N more DPS parity with newer gear while still providing the mobility I like.


=.=

You use L4N for mobility means nobody uses it for defense? I, for start, uses it for defense.
If you want to counter argue my statement of 'nobody' using it for offense, you should use an example to show that some uses that for offense.Two wrong doesn't make one right.

Anyway, keep the L4N, since they are considered out-of-print items, and we shall see if we still need to use it to attain MAX possible mobility.

I'll still give it a benefit of doubt for L4N being usable since from the data mine, mystic only change the 'random affix'. That is to say, the default roll of dex, attack speed(nat mark), weapon dps cannot be re-rolled.
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LOL
@HachiKumo &OhHellzNo

You guys are funny, the natalyas was made for you to "perma gloom"

4pc Natalya's Solace (50 dis)
50 -14+5 = 41 and you repeat so you have 25~30 seconds with Gloom up for you to kill the elite.

The "old" stuff will be inferior compare to the "new" ones on damage dealing. Our 4pc Wrath or Solace will be out of the picture if you do not know how to translate that discipline bonus into dps when you compare with a ilvl70 set.

What does this mean.

I use it for offense which adds on top of the defensive and mobility it provides

btw Smoke had a cooldown for more than a year, they just never written it on the tooltip.
Edited by KirusAlufras#1739 on 10/6/2013 6:54 PM PDT
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