Diablo® III

Since life steal is gone at level 70

Does that mean that reflect damage is gone from the game?
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Last time I looked at the datamined info I noticed the majority of skills changed to LoH. It also looks like the lean to more life regen and globes bonus with some pickup radius. This might fit into paragon point also.

I've played some builds with more globes pickup and was pretty good. It's a primary setup for my 0 dog build and I think they were looking to buff globe drops for elite packs.

My guess is it will be fine but will have to be more strategic and not mindless standing there.
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We're keeping a close eye on all of the systems since changing any one element will likely have a ripple effect of some sort. However, Wyatt has specifically mentioned the Reflects Damage affix in the past.

Regarding the existing monster affixes. We'll be keeping an eye on these. For example, Reflects Damage internally has been changed to a flat amount rather than a percentage. I don't know if it's going to ship this way but that's the current internal version.


If you'd like to read Wyatt's full post, you can find it here.
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MVP
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I've been linking those posts like crazy in other threads, Grimiku.

I think the main thing here is everyone needs to calm down a bit. Wait until beta to see what changes are coming and then make your judgments then. There's no way for us who aren't internally testing to see how these changes affect the meta game until we get our actual hands on it.
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Calm down?
No, we should party like it is 2011 (as in before D3 released and crushed our dreams :P), since the game seems to be moving in the right direction.
Edited by Shadout#2849 on 10/11/2013 11:12 AM PDT
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Regarding the existing monster affixes. We'll be keeping an eye on these. For example, Reflects Damage internally has been changed to a flat amount rather than a percentage. I don't know if it's going to ship this way but that's the current internal version.


These are wonderful news!

This has been suggested so many times already. I'm glad that it is getting Blizzard's attention.
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MVP
Posts: 16,906
Calm down?
No, we should party like it is 2011 (as in before D3 released and crushed our dreams :P), since the game seems to be moving in the right direction.

Well, if you want to get excited for the changes that's A-OK by me. =P

I'm specifically speaking of those freaking out over the changes like it's going to be impossible to play the game now.
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If there is one lesson I've learned, wait and see and don't buy this until you see a fair evaluation of what the game is like.
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Well Im with droth there in the wait and see.. although I really REALLY crave for any new content T_T its like having months without rain in the desert..and you are triying to grow a flower ( my monky).

Btw droth wich is your main d3 class ? or wich is your fav? how well you fare on mp10 ? :D just curious.
Edited by Colt#2370 on 10/11/2013 11:45 AM PDT
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Calm down?
No, we should party like it is 2011 (as in before D3 released and crushed our dreams :P), since the game seems to be moving in the right direction.

Well, if you want to get excited for the changes that's A-OK by me. =P

I'm specifically speaking of those freaking out over the changes like it's going to be impossible to play the game now.


Who is freaking out I was actually asking a random question. Glad to see a blue responded.
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Doubt he meant you. There are just people who try to use scare-tactics, arguing that the game will be unplayable and you will die every 2 second without life steal, as if Blizzard would release the game in such a state. Not even release-day Inferno was like that.
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I can understand a nerf to life steal - obviously as DPS goes up it will outclass every other sustain affix.

BUT

What about skills that gave life steal? (Wizard Magic Weapon, Witch Doctor Vampire Bats, etc). What about mighty belts? What about L 60 legendaries that roll with this affix? The Butchers Sickle, Manajuma's Carving Knife, etc.

What about player's who invested lots of gold to get a life steal weapon/belt? Seems like an unreasonable penalty to those players.

As always, I think it is a bad idea to make item affixes useless. This game needs MORE items to be viable, not less.
It would be far better to add elite affixes like "undead: Immune to life steal" and/or reduce life steal's effectiveness even further than 20%. But eliminate it? Just wrong.

When Attack speed was OP, it was not eliminated, just reduced.
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I can understand a nerf to life steal - obviously as DPS goes up it will outclass every other sustain affix.

BUT

What about skills that gave life steal? (Wizard Magic Weapon, Witch Doctor Vampire Bats, etc). What about mighty belts? What about L 60 legendaries that roll with this affix? The Butchers Sickle, Manajuma's Carving Knife, etc.

What about player's who invested lots of gold to get a life steal weapon/belt? Seems like an unreasonable penalty to those players.

As always, I think it is a bad idea to make item affixes useless. This game needs MORE items to be viable, not less.
It would be far better to add elite affixes like "undead: Immune to life steal" and/or reduce life steal's effectiveness even further than 20%. But eliminate it? Just wrong.

When Attack speed was OP, it was not eliminated, just reduced.


Life steal is being reduced to life on hit. Look at the changes. Pretty much every skill that was life steal is becoming life on hit. And it follows the change to reflect damage that is no longer a % but a set amount of damage on hit. Bottom line is life on hit is more easily managed so as to not be OP without having to worry about inflated dps.
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I'd still like to see the DH get more lifesteal on a 2h weapon. Since they are planning to half the amount on level60, the 3% will be extremely weak. (It's just fine now, not too OP, not too UP, except against reflect elites, since you need 6+% lifesteal against them on DH)
I think that wearing an offhand should double the healing effects from your weapon (so if you have 900 loh on amulet, that doesn't get boosted), so people have more choice in items and not use only Skorn on WD like 85% of the time, etc.
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As always, I think it is a bad idea to make item affixes useless. This game needs MORE items to be viable, not less.
It would be far better to add elite affixes like "undead: Immune to life steal" and/or reduce life steal's effectiveness even further than 20%. But eliminate it? Just wrong.


You will still be able to use lifesteal if you are not level70. So if you have a level 60 character with lifesteal now, you will still be able to play that character with lifesteal, just don't convert it to expansion character.
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I've been linking those posts like crazy in other threads, Grimiku.

I think the main thing here is everyone needs to calm down a bit. Wait until beta to see what changes are coming and then make your judgments then. There's no way for us who aren't internally testing to see how these changes affect the meta game until we get our actual hands on it.

to be fair, many of us have been burned in the past. And that quite a lot. nerf to attack speed for example? That alone has cut the DPS of a lot of people in half, but not the content ... loosing power in a situation that is already very difficult isnt easy to compensate. Then the overdone nerfs to Wizard and DHs and the changes to Barbs.

is it really a surprise that people have some ... reservations?

10/11/2013 11:58 AMPosted by Shadout
Doubt he meant you. There are just people who try to use scare-tactics, arguing that the game will be unplayable and you will die every 2 second without life steal, as if Blizzard would release the game in such a state. Not even release-day Inferno was like that.

thats not the point. Of course the game will not be "unplayable", to even think that would be silly. But its fair to assume that the gameplay might change a lot with the new content. The question is what ever those changes are good or bad.

Think about it like that. Are people right now very happy with the cap on attack speed for example? No? Why?

A lot of the stuff in D3, despite the fact that it is an action RPG, feels A LOT slower compared to D2. And not in a good way. The gameplay as whole. And for some of us it just looks like they want to lower the pace of the game even more, when a lot of people actually would want to see a speed up, nothing is worse to kite mobs to death chasing down health globes while low on health waiting for your cool downs to be ready again. It simply feels very strange when your character, despite of using very good items, has STILL to kite the mobs like crazy or like it doesnt even matter that he is lvl 70 or lvl 1. I mean just one example, how many games do you know where your gear becomes WORSE the better your character gets? Like Life Steal beeing less effective with each new level up ... maybe it is to strong as stat in the game ( I dont agree with that, but thats a different story ), but making it outright useless for a lvl70 character?

I want to belive that RoS is the saviour of D3. I really really want that the game is great. But I will remain critical and try to form my own opinion.
Edited by CrniVuk#2227 on 10/11/2013 1:15 PM PDT
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And for some of us it just looks like they want to lower the pace of the game even more, when a lot of people actually would want to see a speed up, nothing is worse to kite mobs to death chasing down health globes while low on health waiting for your cool downs to be ready again. It simply feels very strange when your character, despite of using very good items, has STILL to kite the mobs like crazy or like it doesnt even matter that he is lvl 70 or lvl 1. I mean just one example, how many games do you know where your gear becomes WORSE the better your character gets? Like Life Steal beeing less effective with each new level up ... maybe it is to strong as stat in the game ( I dont agree with that, but thats a different story ), but making it outright useless for a lvl70 character?

I want to belive that RoS is the saviour of D3. I really really want that the game is great. But I will remain critical and try to form my own opinion.


That is fine and all.

But some of us are really looking forward to exactly that scenario.
Slower combat. More tactical combat. Combat that isnt balanced around unlimited healing and oneshotting monsters. Gameplay that sometimes does indeed ask you to kite or chase down a health globe.
Life steal doesn't have a place in such a game, because of the way it works.

Life steal being slowly removed from lvl 60 to 70 might sound weird. But if the alternative was to just remove it totally, this seems like a better solution, as it doesn't ruin a lot of peoples gear the moment they log into RoS. Now they will have time to find replacements in-game.
Edited by Shadout#2849 on 10/11/2013 1:29 PM PDT
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That is fine and all.

But some of us are really looking forward to exactly that scenario.
Slower combat. More tactical combat. Combat that isnt balanced around unlimited healing and oneshotting monsters. Gameplay that sometimes does indeed ask you to kite or chase down a health globe.
Life steal doesn't have a place in such a game, because of the way it works.

Life steal being slowly removed from lvl 60 to 70 might sound weird. But if the alternative was to just remove it totally, this seems like a better solution, as it doesn't ruin a lot of peoples gear the moment they log into RoS. Now they will have time to find replacements in-game.

More tactical combat? Are we playing the same game? Diablo 3 at least the way how it works now simply doesnt offer enough debth to be even CLOSE to tactical combat. Its about killing stuff as fast as possible. Its supposed to be a hack and slay game after all! And so far, it doesnt seem like RoS is going to change that really, for example your skills still depend on weapon DPS.

People will simply go out and find that "sweet spot" you have to achieve to play the game with the right defence. And from there they will be stacking DPS again.
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