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I think he meant no offense to PaulNg's guide, and its obvious that he put in effort into this.
"Why you need only one item with PUR: because you need to control how you collect globes!
If you have a lot of PUR, when you first kill the first mobs you will immediately collect
all the globes, leaving nothing for later use, when they will be more valuable to restore
mana, health and increase EHP!"
I agree with this, which is why I run with no PUR! (Haha kidding I'd run with 6-10 PUR if I could, but I don't feel disadvantaged in any way though. Have a ToTD so I know what the full 20 feels like)
so many replies, thx a lot for the interes! I will try to reply to all:
for ppl that ask why axe or swords, i will use sirpandalot explanation:
The axe I want is either yours or proph's which is on sale on jsp atm I believe :DI like the 1.3aps because I can still hit 2.01 bp with 6 pieces of 9 ias gear OR even drop down to 1.501aps with 2 pieces of ias gear and maintaining 24% ms. So for me, it's like the Jack of All Trades. So does that make the 1.3aps axe the best ? No, but it is what I think is best for my own gear.
exactly because of this! It has the best control between AS, Mana management and high crits!
@Mugel: this guide is not for new player, did u read the title? The reason for inna and the EHP is explained a lot. Of course some people will not agree, thats why there are videos to proof that this set up works!
@gotcha: well there are different approaches. With shiled and 1H and 100K DPS you can tank everything ... but is it better to fight elties for 1 min? Imagine how many CC effects you will slallow? The method is concentrated on DPS and skills are designed for you to live in the spirit world - being invulnerable and inflict maximum dmg in short time to kill fast, reset CDs! For this you dont need EHP, 450K is the maximum, otherwise you start sacrificing DPS!
@Luffy: since you like numbers, PLease advise what EHP you need in order to survive 5 mln crit? Skorn is not a consistent solution to solve RD problem and will never reach the DPS of 1H, as explained in the first post. I can record a video to prove my point, because you need to see how much you sacrifice in order to tank RD - 1 affix that can happen that you dont meet in a whole run! In addition, with high enough DPS you can kill them during SW time+FA! Also SV is better solution then going 2H nd gimping your DPS!
@Kentlau: i dont agree, SW is almost never on CD! 350K EHP is enough to approach any group. Without inna u have same survivability, because you will need to take more DMG, because it will take longer to approach the elites and more time to kill them. MC solves the problem with ranged mobs ... almost ;)
@skywalker: exactly the reason i post it ;) Having different information and different approaches allow people to make better decisions. U have a lot of info for huge EHP and Skorn builds and very few about the 1H + high DPS
@Luffy second post :): i will record a video showing how the mitigation - DPS ratio is affected till u start healing on the RD and people can decide on their own, if its worth to go this way! IMO its A NONO! Before i posted i went against siege with weak skorn and pvp gear and you know what? I dont outheal ... i dont die, but i dont outheal without FA, so i imagine if i stand on arcances/plague vs RD skorn will not help. Killing fast is the best EHP and method to overcome RD!
@Paul: many thanks for the positive feedback! Again this guide is for advanced users and going CoB in act4 is not very efficient ... so much interrupting makes the skill much worse choice compared to ZB. I want to show maximum efficiency and not something average! Skorn is really very easy to complete the game, but here we talk about killing MP10 fast! Skorn is 20% behind good 1H+mojo, not only on sheet, but also for the hidden bonuses, which are explained! And yes its easier, but we are advanced WDs we need the fastest way to kill, not the easiest :)
@IMDKK: u have nice WD! Try to test the gearing setup from the OP, it will boost you a lot :)
@caiqian: its not personal preferenec! U need to move fast to farm fast. Inna gives you a lot of DPS which u need to kill fast! Your set up is not good! Just try the gearing with tals+inna and i bet you will never look back! U think that you kill fast, but actually u can kill much faster!
i would like to thx also to the noobs, that are posting (u know who u are) and i am sure you are learnign a lot!
I will correct any statement that is not true or its a personal preference and not a hard fact! Just post which one it is and i will immediately correct it!
Curious.You claim this guide is for advanced players,yet it's Paul's noob guide which explains CoB mechanic in very details like correlation with attack speed,damage snapshot etc.Very noob guide,indeed...
To be serious - you're outclassed by PaulNg hANNO.Deal with it.
@Master: Paul has much more knowledge and his guide is more detailed! I am not sure u understand english, when i say that his guide is for noobs (NEW WDs) because it covers general topics and explain the mechanics of the skills. Mine is for people that are familiar with all of these and need to take the gearing to the next level! His is for 2H and standard gearing, mine is for 1H and highest DPS gearing possible!
I didnt say his guide is noob, its a professional guide for noobs! Do u understand now?
updated the first post with links to the builds to come from us region (u can move the mouse over and see the skillset) and added at the end how to kill goblnis ;)
Updated with reasoning why this gearset is giving the highest DPS possible!
Edited by hANNO#2962 on 11/18/2013 12:40 AM PST
I'm pretty positive he was NOT calling the guide itself a noob guide, but rather a guide for noobs. A guide for noobs should be more detailed, because advanced players should have a good handle on the mechanics of the build. He is simply trying to improve the build to a way he finds suitable.
I honestly don't see what the big deal is here. Someone posted a build they think is superior to someone else's…ohnos! He didn't even say anything derogatory, most responders just took offense because a) they probably consider themselves to be advanced WDs, coupled with b) this isnt what they are using, gear or skill set.
Sometimes forums are funny. Errbody acting like Lil' Wayne and Drake fans…d!ck-riding knows no bounds.
Edited by ButteryNugs#1889 on 11/18/2013 12:30 AM PST
This goblin killing trick is actually good,I didn't knew that.Thanks,I have to check it out on my own!
Ah,and about Firebats cost reduction gear - search for posts here and on EU server where it is explained in details,from what I remember there is some kind of bug or sth so only 1/4 of the displayed value is used for reduction.
Edited by MasterBLB#1518 on 11/18/2013 12:42 AM PST
@ButteryNugs: thx for the support, really appreciate it!
@Master: its not a bug, its working as intended ;) Most imortant stat on the soj is the max mana, because the problem with cob is recasting, AS does not influence so much the mana management, you need enough mana untill u kill and max mana to be able to recast a few times when interrupted ;) Cob is basically difficult without soj and without mana passives/skills. SoJ + SV+Jaunt is by HUGE margin better than BR+HG+ any possible ring you can imagine :)
Edited by hANNO#2962 on 11/18/2013 12:58 AM PST
Certainly, to present one's build and gearing choices for a discussion as to it's strengths and weaknesses which leads to intelligent discussion is helpful for everyone and should be encouraged.
To pass one's build off as the be all and end all and call it an end game guide however is a totally different matter.
The Gentlemen on this forum are being gentlemen, as is befitting. I have had previous exposure to hANNO however and so have no delusions as to his motives.
@Luffy: since you like numbers, PLease advise what EHP you need in order to survive 5 mln crit? Skorn is not a consistent solution to solve RD problem andc, as explained in the first post. I can record a video to prove my point, because you need to see how much you sacrifice in order to tank RD - 1 affix that can happen that you dont meet in a whole run! In addition, with high enough DPS you can kill them during SW time+FA! Also SV is better solution then going 2H nd gimping your DPS!
...no no no.... MCP brought up the numbers..I just answered him with numbers... I play more with just my gut feeling...lol..
who's skorn? who's 1h?
This type of comments/comparsion always bothers me. (same thing like someone told me..... Microsoft windows has the most number of lines of code in the world... what is that?! LOL...)
Skorn WD can go over 300k dps, higher than a lot of 1h WD users. The top dps guy on the list is a 1h user. (then comes with the argument on how much ias is playable...sigh... i dont wanna go there)
and Skorn is not consistent solution to solve RD?! 0.o
So you are asking about mitigation of 5mil crits with skorn build....
Going back to your first post,....
"In my experience, when you start critting for more than 2-3 mln, then EHP becomes useless and does not save from Reflects, especially when you hit all of them at once!"
Why there is a jump from 2-3mil up to 5???
mitigation and vital are both very important...(your 53.7k hp is not going to work..)
88% with 68k can deal with most situation. Thats what I am at I think and what my experience on. I didn't try different combinations.
anyway, with my build, up to 4mil'ish crits is no issue with my mitigation and with my vital.
Beyond that, it's a bit iffy. Above 6mil to even 7mil crits, will have sudden death for sure.
How often do we see those crits?!?! LOL....
It happens mostly with monk buffs. cm wiz slow time can't even buff me up there to kill myself in uber games.
Just avoid using BBV on RD can solve most of the problem (tbh, I put down BBV anyway... :P )
I don't use FA with skorn. Dogs are with me all the time since day 1 I play WD.
No matter what,
Skorn is really the most consistent solution to solve RD.
5,000,000 * 10% = 500,000+ ehp required before lifesteal.
Then your mit vs ls ratio determines where your end hp ends up after lifesteal.
Soul harvest and gruesome feast both buff all resist and damage simultaneously, somewhat mitigating itself. Jinx and paranoia both interrupt reflect damage from going up. BBV ias doesn't do squat, but the damage buff from slam dance as well as ptp and ptv will upset the balance.
It's not about EU vs NA. Some of the very best, most knowledgeable players who have contributed the most to all the Communities eg Nubtro are EU players.
Proposing your own build and gearing for discussion is great. Passing it off as THE end game guide is not. I try not to be negative in posts, but the OP is one of the few players I have no time nor patience for.
And no, this guide is not for me.
@Jumba: dont discuss anything with morpheus he needs special attention ... as you can see i completely ignore him! Kindly ask you to do the same!
@Luffy: very brave statements ;) I would like to bet something, that you will oneshotyourself vs any RD pack, if using the gear on profile ;) FYI i made the following video test:
http://youtu.be/6VlsCmqmA3o - vs siegebrake, EHP test
As you can see, when using 1H and u have powerfull DMG (even withiout buffs) even with FA you will be loosing HP against Reflect. The stats in the test are self explanatory! My conclusion, as also stated in the OP is that its non-sense to go for more than 450K EHP, because u sacrifice a lot of DPS and even so, u cant tank RD with 1H! Proved! Now imagine if there are 4 targets and you are sitting on molten/plague: unless u kill them during SW u will never kill them!
Second test with huge EHP and 2H: again obvious and expected results: With FA u can tank, but without you cannot, because you cannot outheal! In addition this is a cheap skorn (sub 100 mln one), if you get good skorn, like yours Luffy you will oneshot yourself immediately! When ppl were talking that they tank RD, i made a mistake to buy skorn twice: 1410 DPS 190 crit and i never tanked: u need to use the same routine as 1H, time SW, use FA etc. The point is that sometimes you can meet a pack and survive the RD, but sometimes (quite often) you will not! And its always on the expense of huge DPS decrease!
Now there is no doubt that 2H are much better for RD, but only untill u have lowish DPS! If you want to build a tank WD 2H is prolly better, but your clear times will be much lower!
1H always give more DPS, as explained in the op, its pointless to argue without facts :) Even if somehow u get godly skorn to match the sheet DPS (i want to see that) you will lose the 3% fire bonus from tal and the elites dmg from mojo. So 2H will always kill slower!
Now because this is a contradictionary issue, i would kindly ask you to see the video and confirm my conclusions so i can include them in the op!
@hANNO - I don't really think you have to sacrifice DPS with your 2 hander to get enough ehp and mit to tank reflect. I have no problems running in guns blazing with reflect and any other affixes and I don't have to run FA. I do have jungle fort but meh I can stand through and tank explosions from exploding elites and be in very sticky situations while surviving and dealing damage.
I may not match 1 hander DPS but all this talk about being slower than you mojo users makes me angry haha. I would love to compare my clear time, or even Luffy or other Skorn users to yours. I am going to work on recording a video and we can see.
Until than, long live Skorn :D
Some of this troll's points I can agree with, however I don't really condone the manner in which he is going about it. Being rude and disrespectful to some of the nicest, coolest docs on either server will not garner you any kudos. That being said there are some unequivocal facts here.
Innas/SV will let you play a more of an aggressive, fast and loose style where you can afford to make mistakes and still come out alive. It's not for everyone but it can be made to work.
SOJ is bis, period. Much like with the barb class. Other classes maybe not so much.
1H+SOJ+high dps+RD pack=tough sledding.
Skorn easily can facetank RD every day of the week and twice on Sunday.
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