Diablo® III

You are not entitled to get the gear you want

There is this misconception that if you play x amount of hours you are entitled to get the gear you want, this is false, rng is rng which is the very core mechanic of the Diablo series, so don't complain why low paragon lvl players get super rare legs while you don't, rng is rng plain and simple.
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The game is play the gear you have. It's remarkable that after two years some still haven't realized the implications of the design. You might get the gear you want someday. Meanwhile use the skill/rune system to make the best of the gear you have. It's fine if you enjoy swimming upstream against RNG. That's a choice.
Edited by Eschaton#1854 on 7/12/2014 2:29 PM PDT
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07/12/2014 02:28 PMPosted by Eschaton
It's remarkable that after two years some still haven't realized the implications of the design.


Two years? BoA has only been around for a few months.
D1, D2, and D3V had ways of mitigating RNG only my means of trade and an economy.
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BOA is the worst thing they did to the game. GJ Blizz on removing all replay value by removing trade.
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07/12/2014 02:31 PMPosted by Goodbrew
Two years? BoA has only been around for a few months.


OK. Point conceded on the time frame.

Although the implication of the design from the beginning was to turn D2's design upside down. You don't build skills to some specific end. You use the flexibility of skills to best use the gear you have whether or not you found, bought it for gold or straight-up went the pay-to-win route with the RMAH. That's been there from the start.

As I've said elsewhere today though and and DirtyGerd can pay attention as well: Trade for the most important items in the game is not gone. It's alive and well with people that play in groups. Just saying it was removed is quite wrong.
Edited by Eschaton#1854 on 7/12/2014 2:54 PM PDT
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07/12/2014 02:53 PMPosted by Eschaton
As I've said elsewhere today though and and DirtyGerd can pay attention as well: Trade for the most important items in the game is not gone. It's alive and well with people that play in groups. Just saying it was removed is quite wrong.


Trading is removed except under specific conditions.

For all intents and purposes, it's removed.
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07/12/2014 02:53 PMPosted by Eschaton
You use the flexibility of skills to best use the gear you have whether or not you found, bought it for gold or straight-up went the pay-to-win route with the RMAH. That's been there from the start.


But you could always work toward a desired end before. The items you found but you didn't use had value to work toward that end. Eventually, you could play the build you wanted to.

Now, there is no way to work toward it other than cross you fingers. The game is an interactive slot machine.

"Boy it would sure be nice to have a pet build for my WD."
"Sorry! You get these items instead!"

"Man, I've been farming RORG for weeks."
"That's cool. I got 2 last night without even trying."

When the game is 100% rng based, statistically the game is designed for some players to have a bad experience with no recourse.
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07/12/2014 02:56 PMPosted by poochie
For all intents and purposes, it's removed.

Yeah, it is if you always play solo. The game has strong social incentives to group up with people. That's one of them. It's your choice to play solo. The others play in groups as often as possible and can trade just fine. So no, it's not removed. It's only removed by your own choices.
Edited by Eschaton#1854 on 7/12/2014 3:07 PM PDT
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07/12/2014 03:01 PMPosted by Goodbrew
When the game is 100% rng based, statistically the game is designed for some players to have a bad experience with no recourse.


Actually this is also true pre RoS and D2,D1

Statically someone will never find anything valuable to build up enough wealth to trade for desirable items.
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07/12/2014 02:24 PMPosted by SirDerp
There is this misconception that if you play x amount of hours you are entitled to get the gear you want, this is false, rng is rng which is the very core mechanic of the Diablo series, so don't complain why low paragon lvl players get super rare legs while you don't, rng is rng plain and simple.
This is so wrong on so many levels...

First off, you aren't entitled to get the gear, you should however be entitled to be able to WORK towards the gear, but now that there is no trading and no loot tables what so ever, you can't work towards anything, its all just random dumb luck.

Second, RNG is NOT core to the diablo series... RNG is core to D3, and even here it was a bad idea when trading was still a thing, now there is ZERO control over what you get, you cannot work towards anything. RNG is a horrible thing, just go back to D2 and play it for a while, you arent :"given" anything, but you can farm certian enemies to work towards items you want to get.

The current state of D3 is pretty bad. Personally i would be happy with it if i could just trade between my friends, but for some reason, we cant even have that.
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07/12/2014 03:06 PMPosted by Eschaton
07/12/2014 02:56 PMPosted by poochie
For all intents and purposes, it's removed.

Yeah, it is if you always play solo. The game has strong social incentives to group up with people. That's one of them. It's your choice to play solo. The others play in groups as often as possible and can trade just fine. So no, it's not removed. It's only removed by your own choices.


I didn't say it's removed.

I said, for all intents and purposes, it's removed.
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I don't get the whole concept I see tossed around on these forums.

Let me give an incomplete representation of how I see the threads/posts about it: If in life, you don't get the one job you want, do you complain incessantly about fairness or do you move on and do the best with what comes your way? I work hard to get what I want, but when life doesn't go my way, I make do with the best that does.
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Given that the game is gear-based, not having the right gear makes certain parts of the game inaccessible to you. That in itself isn't a bad thing. What's bad is that getting that gear and thus the access is largely independent of the effort one puts into the game.

RNG should be used to add flavor and as a shortcut, not as the only way to acquire gear.
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I understand the frustrations of having many hours dumped into the game, and having someone come along with much less hours getting your coveted drops.

Maybe we could have bounties worked on to where if you finish within certain parameters (time, efficiency, kind of like the cursed chests), then you would be guaranteed a certain legendary drop.

If within the game we can have guaranteed carrots mixed in with the slot machine carrots, it would give a more positive experience all around. I'm not saying to GIVE things to people. I'm saying let us earn them, but have a definite light at the end of the tunnel here and there.

For the record, I think cursed chests are not even worth it right now, except for maybe the experience if you're trying to level your paragon.
Edited by ArcticShadow#1928 on 7/12/2014 3:23 PM PDT
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At some point, there's too much RNG involved and it becomes stupid. "RNG is RNG" is a stupid excuse.

Hellfire Amulet:
1: *Random* spawn location in a fixed map
2: *Random* chance to obtain a key
3: *Random* chance to obtain an organ
4: *Random Passive*
5: *4 Random primary affixes*

If #4 or #5 rolls poorly (random), then step #1,2,3 are wasted. Let's not forget the hypothetical step #6, the freaking Mystic --- another layer of RNG.
Edited by DoomBringer#1994 on 7/12/2014 3:27 PM PDT
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07/12/2014 02:24 PMPosted by SirDerp
There is this misconception that if you play x amount of hours you are entitled to get the gear you want, this is false, rng is rng which is the very core mechanic of the Diablo series, so don't complain why low paragon lvl players get super rare legs while you don't, rng is rng plain and simple.


+1, Im not entitled to get a RoRG. Its ok though I hope RNGesus would give me one someday
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07/12/2014 02:24 PMPosted by SirDerp
There is this misconception that if you play x amount of hours you are entitled to get the gear you want, this is false, rng is rng which is the very core mechanic of the Diablo series, so don't complain why low paragon lvl players get super rare legs while you don't, rng is rng plain and simple.


You don't find it ridiculous that players dump a good amount of money into a game and are not able to get the full experience out of it such as finding the gear they would like to use.

Trading enabled players to get the gear they want to try numerous builds. If trading is never implemented than there should be a way to farm gear in a more streamlined fashion such as certain rift bosses or story mode bosses have a chance to drop such and such item, it could be a ridiculously low chance to drop but at least players know the item is right there and could drop at any time through targeted farming.

You are pretty much advocating paying for a game to not get the full experience out of it, that is ridiculous.
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It's like he's not even trying at being a decent troll anymore. He's just drawing inflammatory buzzzwords and topics out of a hat and throwing them together in a semi-coherent topic.
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07/12/2014 03:27 PMPosted by Logos
It's like he's not even trying at being a decent troll anymore. He's just drawing inflammatory buzzzwords and topics out of a hat and throwing them together in a semi-coherent topic.


I usually don't reply to Mr. Derp but on this particular topic I felt it necessary.
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07/12/2014 02:24 PMPosted by SirDerp
There is this misconception that if you play x amount of hours you are entitled to get the gear you want, this is false, rng is rng which is the very core mechanic of the Diablo series, so don't complain why low paragon lvl players get super rare legs while you don't, rng is rng plain and simple.


The game did it to itself.

people feel entitled to certain gear yes....but that's just as stupid as the quality of they adventure in the game.

the gear everyone is wanting is no mystery. its what...5 or 10 items? for all the classes combined?

RNG is certainly not in this game in the places it can be or maybe should be. they MUST weight the randomized tables.

thats why certain items are more rare.....because everyone wants them and they just throw the rest away. so blizzard must make those items more rare..its not just true random dice rolls other wise everyone would have RRoG and furnace and shard of hate and this and that.......and the rest of the garbage items would NEVER never be used.

and blizzard is to stupid to tweak the game so that more items are desirable...they drag the process on for YEARS....

same with re-rolling stats like a socket.....Because everyone wants them and they just throw the rest away. so blizzard must make those stats more rare.....

so yes players are stupid to whine and demand a short list of items and a simple to plan hard to assemble build...

but the game is even more stupid for making that the only avenue....

the players have no choice but to stare at a stupidly limited choice of gear, choice of skills etc....

so.....thats what they do....
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