Diablo® III

Magic Find: A preventable Issue

Let me preface this by saying that I am not against magic find.

That being said- I do see major issues arising in the future as a direct result of the system in place that I can see. What motivated me to write this is in light of the item listings that have recently surfaced and their stats.

So I'm looking at some of these items with upwards of 50% mf a piece thinking to myself. Alright, this isn't as bad as it was in D2, and these are pretty high Tier items, but what happens from a realistic standpoint once there's an individual going around with powerful items that all have upwards of 50% bonus to them? Boots, Gloves, Helm, Ring, Ring, Armor, Bracers, Shoulders, Weapon, Weapon.

Assuming we could get the stat on all of them, that's around 500%. This is a little troubling to me because if the items are relatively balanced in drop rates over time, that amount would certainly create a significant difference. More importantly for the Min/Maxer types you can imagine that everyone would first and foremost try to make a character that would have this particular gear setup to find for all of their others.

And we're back to square one. . . Same issue as with D2 minus the location. I suppose in all reality it's not the worst thing in the world if someone finds gear faster than everyone else, but I do find it a bit disturbing to imagine that there's a motivation to create a build set since it again artificially creates a "Path of least resistance" that essentially takes out all variances as far as items are concerned.

I don't know how well this thought process holds up in the hardest modes, it may not really be an issue. But I thought I'd bring it to light for the community to examine and if there is an issue with those I would ask that the final released version have a hard cap on Magic find to something significantly less than that- like maybe 200% at most. Any thoughts?
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You'll notice the level requirement for some of the highest MF % items are far below 60. The items you will need to finish Inferno wont have MF. I predict true "farming" of end game content will not be very realistic. At least until the game is out for a year ++
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Oh and MF will never have a cap because that is the entire purpose :D
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Why not just get rid of MF to begin with? I really don't see the need for it.

What MF does is it encourages players to wear a fairly limited set of equipment (I know I'll make my char with high MF in mind), which discourages us from using all the different items the developers have created.

Late game, it may be that one class has an inherent advantage in MF over another. Maybe it won't be the case, but if it is, that's a bad thing. Jay of Blizzard agrees with me if his interview counts for anything.

So, again I ask, why do we even need the MF stat in the first place? Get rid of it. Problem solved.
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31 Worgen Druid
170
I dont know.... sure MF for items to sell is going to go through the roof especially with an AH. Me I use MF to outfit my toons to the best gear I can get..... and I generally have multiple toons. Other than that? not so much farming is a boor for me.
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85 Goblin Warrior
1660


What MF does is it encourages players to wear a fairly limited set of equipment (I know I'll make my char with high MF in mind), which discourages us from using all the different items the developers have created.
.


It makes players choose whether they'd like to breeze through the difficulty or wear weaker gear with more chance to find rare items...

Assuming Inferno is as difficult as they say it is; It probably won't be a cake walk to just burn through bosses in MF gear unless you have some exceptionally geared support...so MF is a double edged sword...

Who knows; You might be able to kill 3 bosses in normal gear in the same time it takes you to defeat 1 in MF gear...

So unless you have the absolute top tier of MF gear; You will likely need to strike a balance between your gear to complete inferno difficulty.
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What MF does is it encourages players to wear a fairly limited set of equipment (I know I'll make my char with high MF in mind), which discourages us from using all the different items the developers have created.
.


It makes players choose whether they'd like to breeze through the difficulty or wear weaker gear with more chance to find rare items...

Assuming Inferno is as difficult as they say it is; It probably won't be a cake walk to just burn through bosses in MF gear unless you have some exceptionally geared support...so MF is a double edged sword...

Who knows; You might be able to kill 3 bosses in normal gear in the same time it takes you to defeat 1 in MF gear...

So unless you have the absolute top tier of MF gear; You will likely need to strike a balance between your gear to complete inferno difficulty.


uhhhh... non magic find gear equip > grind to boss > equip magic find gear > boss dies. What now?
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A lot of these responses are also still assuming that a boss will drop more than say the same amount of mobs you could kill in the time span it takes to kill the boss. Since this isn't necessarily true, it's somewhat a moot point.

That aside, it is difficult to tell what kinds of issues will be prevalent having never experienced hell or inferno or anything of that nature. So long as there is a directly equivalent comparison between (Build one with nothing but power gear) and (Build two with nothing but slightly weaker gear with MF) these in item finding efficiency there is no issue.

My main concern is that on the off chance I had 2 really high tier items to choose from on a character, I would truly hate for my decision to be swayed by "I'll find more items this way."
Edited by swordadpt on 9/24/2011 9:51 AM PDT
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09/23/2011 11:56 AMPosted by sparrow
Why not just get rid of MF to begin with? I really don't see the need for it.


Its a signature aspect of diablo, and increases drop rates. Why get rid of it. I think complaining about people in your group not pulling there wait because of MF gear is ridiculous. It is not a large enough sacrifice of other attributes to make that much of a difference. A lot of good items have an increase to magic find.
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Diablo is all about min/maxing your character. And then min/maxing all other characters. Magic find grinds and item acquisition is the signature gameplay staple of the franchise.

Yes the story is excellent and the fights are fun. Yes the characters are graphically pleasing and have some awesome abilities with lots of customization.

But the factor that gives the game it's longevity and survivability is the fact that people had to build a MF set, then go use that to find the stuff they wanted or something they could trade for what they wanted.

That player-based economy based around ridiculously rare items.

To make an MF cap (esp around 200) would mean that items would have to be significantly more common than D2 or that they would be significantly more rare. Both of which options seem utterly silly. It's a balancing act that shouldn't sway one way or the other from the precedent IMO.
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To be honest, I do see a problem with this, primarily concerning the auction house. If magic-find gear is all that anyone wants, you'll probably see people decking out their characters with the stuff so they can find items that do other stuff, and of course, sell the other stuff. But you can sell massive numbers of more commonly found magic-find items on the auction house by working towards a full set of magic-find gear, and in this way, actually turn out a profit. I say "a problem" because I want to see fare prices for items that are actually valuable, but I suppose such isn't possible. The market will shift inevitably.

I suppose my point is that the economy is going to be extremely different from WoW, which is perhaps the closest comparison I can think of (besides all the illegitimate ones from D2). Having a hard-cap on magic-find creates a bit of a hole in this system, and magic-find becomes something FAR less valuable. Instead, finding a ring with the highest percent of the stat on it would be the most economically sound idea, and having other gear on your character with stuff that makes it even remotely possible to do Inferno.

(With this, I assume Inferno is going to be nearly impossible without the proper gear / skills, and that entirely magic-find builds won't kill be able to kill Leoric without significant back-up.)

I think that the issue boils down into people taking the route of risk = reward on later difficulties. I'm sure there'll be some crazy support builds like a healing magic-find monk or some such a thing, but putting a hard-cap on magic-find would detract from allowing players to fully realize what they want out of a character. The system functions just fine as is, and will probably end up with a crazy economy, but I suppose there is some fun in that.

Yes, you will have to choose between having magic-find and good statistics for your character, but that has always been in the case in D2. With a legal in-game economy, it will probably be magnified by 1,000%.

Also, for math's sake, I'm going to say this: You have .02% chance to find a "Stone of Jordan" (hypothetically of course). With 100% magic-find, you now have a .2% chance. With 500%, you have a 1% chance.

What I'm wondering is if certain items *require* levels of magic-find, so that they only drop when above a certain percentage of the stat. That would completely change the makeup of any Inferno run to NEEDING a support character, not to mention an effective one.
Edited by Bockin on 9/24/2011 2:28 PM PDT
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Does anyone know how MF works in a group? If i kill something or open something does my MF apply to the drops that are going to come out for people in my party?
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One thing that people are forgetting is that Unlike Diablo 2 being in a group of four does NOT raise the monster drop rates. So this extra magic find will make up for that slightly but not completely. A group of 8 people in the game was way better to kill a boss in D2 with 100 mf. Than killing a boss with 300 mf solo.

Also to answer Tbash's question, I don't know for sure but from the information i've gathered it does not matter who kills the monster. Everyone has their own random loot drop so it seems everyone has their own mf applied to their own drop.
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I got 75 MF with a wizard and it doesn't seem to be working at all. I get way more magic drops with a Barbarian with around 25 MF.
Exemple: The wizard gets 1 magic drop most of the time on SK kill while I get 3 most of the time with the barbarian.
It just looks unreal to me.
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I read the post, trying to figure out if you understood the actual mechanics behind MF during D2? 500% MF during D2 really wasn't anything respectable. To call yourself a real Magic Finder, you were pushing 700%, and if you were serious you capped 800% and up. Hell mode wasn't exactly possible to complete with that gear anyhow. People rigged out barbs, sorcs, and necros with gear that pushed them over 1000%. Diminishing returns are a !@#$%, and it only increased your odds of getting magic and rare quality items. Uniques were not guaranteed.

Anyone that's read the releases already knows, you aren't going to be killing bosses for loot, you are going to be killing the mini-bosses. These are rare spawns.

I believe they are going to simply reinstate the formula for magic find, and if they do they will be making thousands of people happy. The system was misunderstood by millions of noobs, and thousands of us understood how to make it work and how it worked.

I think running Inferno with pure MF gear is going to be a real challenge. Not like D2 became when they augmented your gear with more resistances through unique charms to make Hell mode into Breeze Mode for MF. You're going to have to work at it. Working as intended and bring it on.
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