Diablo® III

Can any weapon combination wear a quiver?

Yeah?

Can a 2-hander also use a quiver? Can a dual-wielding DH use a quiver?

?
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Your choices are:

Bow(2h) + Quiver
Crossbow(2h) + Quiver
Hand crossbow + Hand crossbow
Hand crossbow + Quiver
Hand crossbow + Shield
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Looks pretty fair. I hope there are some sexy shields that add a ton of precision :)

Thanks.
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85 Troll Druid
3535
I would doubt that you can equip a 2h ranged weapon and a quiver being that quivers are offhand. Unless quivers are in beta and able to be equipped with them, but I haven't seen it.
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09/25/2011 10:35 AMPosted by Dahippee
I would doubt that you can equip a 2h ranged weapon and a quiver being that quivers are offhand. Unless quivers are in beta and able to be equipped with them, but I haven't seen it.
I've seen it in... I want to say Force's DH vid in the beta.
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09/25/2011 10:35 AMPosted by Dahippee
I would doubt that you can equip a 2h ranged weapon and a quiver being that quivers are offhand. Unless quivers are in beta and able to be equipped with them, but I haven't seen it.


I think the idea here is that no matter what weapon configuration you want, you have the opportunity to use two items. That way if you dual wield, or use a 2-hander, or just 1 1-hander, you can have two items giving you bonuses and stats, etc.
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85 Troll Druid
3535
I thought the idea behind the quiver was that if you wanted to single wield a 1h xbow, a quiver would make it viable. You may ask, "why would you want to single wield a hand xbow" and the reason is that if you DW two xbows, they have to be the same quality or you lose damage. This is because attacks alternate between the two hands.

The advantage to DW'ing is that you get an attack speed bonus. I figured the quiver in the other hand would provide bonuses to equal this so that you could single wield a 1h. I guess not.
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Gosh you're all so negative. You don't lose damage when one of your crossbows is weaker. You gain damage when one of your crossbows is stronger!
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The reason to use 1 hand crossbow + quiver vs 2h bow/crossbow + quiver is basically attack speed. The hand crossbows have just as much dps as the 2h bow/crossbows and much higher attack speed. Typically its 1.8 for hand crossbows vs 1.4 for bows and 1.00 for crossbows.

Of course you will see bigger numbers with the slow 2h weapons but the new resource/skill system helps a lot for the faster weapons, the slow weapons no longer dominate and it now comes down to more of a personal choice.
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The reason to use 1 hand crossbow + quiver vs 2h bow/crossbow + quiver is basically attack speed. The hand crossbows have just as much dps as the 2h bow/crossbows and much higher attack speed. Typically its 1.8 for hand crossbows vs 1.4 for bows and 1.00 for crossbows.

Of course you will see bigger numbers with the slow 2h weapons but the new resource/skill system helps a lot for the faster weapons, the slow weapons no longer dominate and it now comes down to more of a personal choice.


I beg to differ.

Late in the game, which is really all that matters, Hand crossbows have about the same attack range, but better speed, or bows and crossbows. I would use x2 Hand xbows if I got two that were good, because you'd fire faster than if you had just 1. It might not seem that way with just 1 hand crossbow in the beta, but it will be faster with IAS buffs, player buffs, and self buffs later in the game.

Plus you'll look super badass. And that's what matters second.
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09/25/2011 02:32 PMPosted by Dahippee
The advantage to DW'ing is that you get an attack speed bonus


Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought it was actually a penalty not a bonus...?
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I beg to differ.

Late in the game, which is really all that matters, Hand crossbows have about the same attack range, but better speed, or bows and crossbows. I would use x2 Hand xbows if I got two that were good, because you'd fire faster than if you had just 1. It might not seem that way with just 1 hand crossbow in the beta, but it will be faster with IAS buffs, player buffs, and self buffs later in the game.

Plus you'll look super badass. And that's what matters second.


I was comparing 1 hand crossbow + quiver vs 2h bow/crossbow + quiver not dual wielding hand crossbows.

09/26/2011 12:30 PMPosted by HRP
Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought it was actually a penalty not a bonus...?


You are wrong, it is a bonus.
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90 Human Paladin
7085

Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought it was actually a penalty not a bonus...?


Your probably thinking of other games which use dual wield penalties to compensate for cumulative dps.

In diablo dual wielding works by alternating fire between mainhand/offhand, hence dps is not cumulative but rather averaged between your two weapons. The provision of an attack speed bonus in this situation makes sense as it mimics the increased attack speed you would have from alternating weapons.

It means that if you dropped out the offhand xbow for a shield during a difficult boss fight, your dps wont drop quite as dramatically. Logically it would make dual wield 1-hand xbow dps roughly equal 2-hand xbow or bow dps (of equal weapon quality, etc), the former with quicker small hits, the latter with slower big hits.



Late in the game, which is really all that matters, Hand crossbows have about the same attack range, but better speed, or bows and crossbows.


This is incorrect, I think you are confused because many D3 items currently display a dps range, with damage range in brackets. When comparing 1-hand and 2-hand items of any weapon type (of equal quality, no +min/max damage, no +attack speed), the 1-hand will have a higher Attack per Second (e.g. commonly 1.8 for 1-hand xbows) with a lower damage range, and the 2-hand will have a lower Attack per Second (e.g. commonly 1.0 for 2-hand xbows) with a higher damage range.

Comparing dps range is more complex, as 1-hand xbows seem to have a much wider dps range than 2-hand xbows. With RNG, would make 1-hand xbows feel bursty and 2-hand consistent.

For example:

Crosslock
Hand Crossbow
31.5 - 45.0 Damage Per Second
(3-8) to (32-42) Damage
1.80 Attacks Per Second

Siege Crossbow
Crossbow
35.5 - 43.0 Damage per Second
(34-39) to (37-47) Damage
1.00 Attacks Per Second

Both are level 30 items, 1-hand has a lower (and much wider) damage range with quicker attack speed, 2-hand has a higher (and narrower) damage range with slow attack speed.

And yes these may just be placeholder items, but I would bet the comparative itemisation is accurate.
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For example:

Crosslock
Hand Crossbow
31.5 - 45.0 Damage Per Second
(3-8) to (32-42) Damage
1.80 Attacks Per Second

Siege Crossbow
Crossbow
35.5 - 43.0 Damage per Second
(34-39) to (37-47) Damage
1.00 Attacks Per Second

Both are level 30 items, 1-hand has a lower (and much wider) damage range with quicker attack speed, 2-hand has a higher (and narrower) damage range with slow attack speed.

And yes these may just be placeholder items, but I would bet the comparative itemisation is accurate.


Before the recent Demon Hunter changes, this would have been a serious problem. But now with the addition of Hatred builders and spenders, folks who opt to use a faster one-handed crossbow will be able to simply use more builders and spenders than the Hunters using slower weapons with higher damage values. Comparable damage in the end, just a different way of getting there.
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90 Human Paladin
7085
Agreed. With the implementation of spammable Hatred builders, there should be no reason to continue using normal attacks unless you build around the fundamentals passive.
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