Diablo® III

Unattuned Runestone System not Feasible

09/28/2011 05:52 PMPosted by Iceybaby
Because this is TOTALLY analagous. Yup.


glad u agree how stupid your idea was.
The 1st step is always to admit you have a problem.


Maybe you should read the rest of the post, and you'd realize how bad you sound right about now. Maybe you should get a real argument, instead of knee-jerk reactions.
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Variance in stats, say +1 vitality, +2 vitality, etc..

Armor only needs maybe a lvl & slot filter.
Random stats will have far more variety than that. So in your system, if I'm looking for a lvl 60 helm, I'll have to look through a huge list that includes Barb helms, Wizard helms, WD helms, DH helms and Monk helms? Plus, what if I want a tank helm or a dps helm or a MF helm or a resource helm?

That's the point of having a filter. It makes it easy to find the specific type of item you need. Just a lvl and slot filter works for WoW, but WoW doesn't have randomized stats. You can't just cut and paste WoW's AH and expect it to work in D3.
Edited by Lucied on 9/28/2011 6:17 PM PDT
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This is what all those filters would look like,


Class 1
Class 2
Class 3
Class 4
Class 5 -> Skill 1
------------- Skill 2
------------- Skill 3
------------- Skill 4
------------- Skill 5
------------- Skill 6
------------- Skill 7
------------- Skill 8
------------- Skill 9
------------- Skill 10
------------- Skill 11
...


You realize the filters don't need to be a complicated tree of any sort. Simple pull downs or even a text box for you to enter your skill could drastically compress that. Again you are making it out to be some kind of monstrosity when it really isn't any more than a half dozen pull down menus. That isn't complicated. If the player can actually play Diablo 3 I think he can handle a few filter menus. In the hands of a good interface designer it can be very simple to use.
Edited by Steveman on 9/28/2011 6:18 PM PDT
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You realize the filters don't need to be a complicated tree of any sort. Simple pull downs or even a text box for you to enter your skill could drastically compress that. Again you are making it out to be some kind of monstrosity when it really isn't any more than a half dozen pull down menus. That isn't complicated. If the player can actually play Diablo 3 I think he can handle a few filter menus. In the hands of a good interface designer it can be very simple to use.


a text box is simple?

You've never seen a drop down box that allows you to type in so that it can quick select the option?
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a text box is simple?
It's a lot simpler than looking through a list of possibly 100+ lvl 60 helms because you're looking for a helm for a Barb tank build.
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It's really simple
Drop box: class choice (might even default to the last class you played)
Drop box: Skill (type in the first few letters and it will pick your skill)
Drop box: Rune color
Drop box: rank
Drop box: Stat (this is the default box already in place to filter items by a specific mod)

If you want to be that specific, it only takes 4 drop down boxes to filter out a precise rune. A fifth box (or more if runes can have more than one random mod) if you want a precise stat.
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90 Gnome Warlock
9565
I agree. I'm very cool with runes having random stats on them, but the whole randomness of socketing a rune just feels icky.

They're really pushing the skill customization as a selling point but it just doesn't feel good when the runes are random - you don't actually seem to have much control of the way your character progresses, which is really contrary to the whole point of being able to customize skills in the first place.


Bingo. THIS is why unattuned runes suck. Runes were advertised as THE answer to customization. They still are touted this way by Blizzard staff when defending against any complaint about customization. Then they turn around and take away customization by making them drop unattuned? Really? Whatever else Blizzard does with runes, they MUST drop with a color/type. Random affixes are fine, but the color/type must be known before choosing a skill or there is no customization. And no, I don't want to go to the AH to buy 1,000 runes in order to experiment. I want to find them myself.

Runes, I think it can fairly be argued, are the single most important mechanic in the game, which is why this worries me.
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Community Manager
We have no idea how the unattuned system is going to work. Or if it'll end up working at all. We're trying out some different options, but we're not likely to reveal much until we're more certain. Maybe it'll be something we feel comfortable discussing at BlizzCon? ... maybe not.

On a slightly related (?) note we're playing around with having skill swapping locked to being in-town only. We're definitely not sold on it, but it could appear at some time in a beta patch, so FYI. Just be aware it's only something we're trying, and not a permanent solution.
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barb tank lol
I guess that is better than melee mage though.
It doesn't matter what build I used as an example. The point is some items work better for some build than others. Some items are focused on dps, some on defensive stats and some on resource management. Do you really want to look through all of those, multiplied by classes in some cases, when you're looking for a specific type of item?
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09/28/2011 06:27 PMPosted by Bashiok
locked to being in-town only

+1
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We have no idea how the unattuned system is going to work. Or if it'll end up working at all. We're trying out some different options, but we're not likely to reveal much until we're more certain. Maybe it'll be something we feel comfortable discussing at BlizzCon? ... maybe not.

On a slightly related (?) note we're playing around with having skill swapping locked to being in-town only. We're definitely not sold on it, but it could appear at some time in a beta patch, so FYI. Just be aware it's only something we're trying, and not a permanent solution.


So this is still going through the works. I guess this takes time. Would have been nice to hear of some sort of progress. Thanks.

I am happy to hear of the restriction of town swapping. I don't think that the Beta will be the best testing ground for it though as I think it universally agreed that the town restriction is too much that early in the game. Until level 30 characters will want to be trying out skills and swapping quite regularly.
Edited by Steveman on 9/28/2011 6:32 PM PDT
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85 Human Death Knight
4180
09/28/2011 06:29 PMPosted by hunts
I really think skill swapping only in town would add a lot more dynamic and weight to your skill desicions. I really hope it goes thru, or at the very least is given some serious thought.


Here is the deal though and im sure most people who watched the beta vids probably noticed the same thing. Every force vid i watched before the skeleton king he stopped and switched out his skills to something else, the only difference that would make is for him to use his hearthstone (forgot what its called) then swap skills in town return fight the boss, then leave game and rejoin, that is already one way to get around that. So i do not see a reason at all in doing this.
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Maybe you should read the rest of the post, and you'd realize how bad you sound right about now. Maybe you should get a real argument, instead of knee-jerk reactions.


What for? If you think the completely random runes is good, then you are an idiot.
Therefore, it is pointless to read your post.[/quote]

Nice way to completely invalidate your own argument. If you wish to have a real debate, and prove someone wrong, you must attack their points. You've done none of that. All you've done is called me names, which proves nothing, except, perhaps, that you're just trolling.

I'll even make it easy for you: I made two points.

1) Your analogy was not applicable. D3 runes being random is not like 'randomly applying your talent points in WoW.' My analogy correctly compares D3 runes to WoW glyphs.

2) Being against the unattuned rune system because it 'makes it difficult to find the rune you want' is like being against the random item generation system because it also makes it diffuclt to find the item you want. Yes, when you attune a rune, it can come out as one you don't want. That's intentional. Just like when you get a rare sword and identify it, it can come out as one you don't want. Also intentional.

Until you can address one of these points, you have no argument, and everyone can plainly see it.
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09/28/2011 06:32 PMPosted by ßoogieknight
I really think skill swapping only in town would add a lot more dynamic and weight to your skill desicions. I really hope it goes thru, or at the very least is given some serious thought.


Here is the deal though and im sure most people who watched the beta vids probably noticed the same thing. Every force vid i watched before the skeleton king he stopped and switched out his skills to something else, the only difference that would make is for him to use his hearthstone (forgot what its called) then swap skills in town return fight the boss, then leave game and rejoin, that is already one way to get around that. So i do not see a reason at all in doing this.

The reason has been heavily discussed and it involves players taking advantage of skill swapping for unfair advantages in the field. Going back to town isn't a huge penalty but it is enough to discourage any gaming of the system and indicates to players that they should be making some sort of at least semi-permanent decision about their skill selection.
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We have no idea how the unattuned system is going to work. Or if it'll end up working at all. We're trying out some different options, but we're not likely to reveal much until we're more certain. Maybe it'll be something we feel comfortable discussing at BlizzCon? ... maybe not.

On a slightly related (?) note we're playing around with having skill swapping locked to being in-town only. We're definitely not sold on it, but it could appear at some time in a beta patch, so FYI. Just be aware it's only something we're trying, and not a permanent solution.


If the unattuned rune system goes through, is there a chance that we could have a separate rune inventory? I want to be able to have the option of switching my runes, even if its for a cost, but I cannot if I have to sacrifice a large portion of my shared stash or my inventory space to do so.
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