Diablo® III

"Loss of a feeling of a leveling achievement"

Posts: 454
I get the point of the thread. On the surface, you want Bashiok to address one sentence from one post from 3 years back, about replacing some vague lost feeling you get when leveling up. The fact that you would honestly expect that comes across as ridiculous, to me, at least. You really want a statement about a statement from 2008 regarding, not a feature, but a feature that is supposed to give the same "feeling" as a feature they have removed?

If that is your genuine intent, then ok. But I have news for you, you aren't going to get one. Ever. Not only does Blizzard discourage directly asking them questions on the forums, they aren't going to announce that they won't be able to deliver on a "feature" that never existed.

That is why I assumed you were actually !@#$%ing, because the above sentiment is too ridiculous to actually believe.

And if that is true, allow me to translate that Blizzard statement for you. "We are taking out the stat point system because we realized it was pretty terrible. If you liked it, too bad. Don't worry about it though, because the game will be solid, we know what we are doing, and you will like it anyhow."

Which I would largely agree with.


Lulz. At no point in this thread have I requested blue commentary, nor do I expect any. I'm certain you didn't bother to read the other 56 posts in the thread that weren't specifically addressed to you, but people actually had worthwhile input on the subject and I have gained a better understanding regarding what kind of leveling incentives D3 has to offer in the current build. It's a forum for discussion of a game under development, and if you feel it is inappropriate to discuss the issues that the developers themselves have provided commentary on in the past then I have no idea what you're doing posting on the D3 forums.

There are questions that only Blizzard can answer and that's fine. I don't really care if they choose to answer them or not. Based on the responses others have provided I see a couple of things that I had overlooked to this point. That's great for me - seems like a fairly constructive discussion from my end.

In your opinion there was very little 'sense' of achievement or reward when leveling up in D2. That's great for you, you won't notice a difference in D3. Others will. This discussion is geared towards 'others'. I'm sorry this thread took up precious forum space on your screen that could have otherwise been filled with endless moaning and trolling, which it appears is more up to your standards and expectations.
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Posts: 454
10/25/2011 01:38 PMPosted by Savior
Stop needing a carrot to stay focused.


Love carrots. I hear they're good for your eyes too.

See post #10 and #34. I'm too lazy to type it again.
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80 Blood Elf Mage
0
Posts: 13
Another issue I see with this is in pvp , there will obviously be build for each class but realistically they will all be the same along as you have the same or close to gear I dunno it just won't seem as fun as d2 when you put so much time into a build that you needed to own in pvp lol anyway I haven't thought too much into it but this is the first thing I thought of after reading this post

Ps. great post I hope it gets to the right people
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I don't know, having played the beta a lot, I'd say there's plenty of reward for leveling up. Skills keep getting added for the first 30 levels, which will carry a player an act or so into Nightmare mode.

Having skill slots unlock actually was one of the better motivators to level up, because limited skill selections kept me focused on the combination of skills that would be great to have if only I had that extra slot open.

Leveling up to get into a much improved gear item is also a motivator -- over the level range in the beta, gear improves quite a bit.

And, of course, the stat increases and combat mechanics when fighting different-leveled creatures ensure that one's character gets more powerful with level regardless of gear or skills.

Overall, the rewards for leveling are pretty much the same as in any other RPG I've ever seen.
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Posts: 110
Your post touches on a similar 'issue' as my post:
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/3082209959#1

Blizzard is almost certainly creating a new game with disposable max ranked characters for us to trade, kill, or shelf as we see fit; I'm just not sure what/where all the playing/leveling incentives are coming from (or if I'm even in their target demographic anymore!).

Enjoying the thread, thanks.

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90 Night Elf Priest
6675
Posts: 1,895
Another 4-month old necro.

Does no one else mouseover thread titles to see the preview, where you can clearly see the original post date before clicking?
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90 Night Elf Priest
6675
Posts: 1,895
By that argument almost every single thread on these new boards is relevant, and so bumping them at random should be just fine. In reality, it disrupts the normal thread flow on the front page (which is what the majority people look at, since it's the most fluid), making it less usable as a whole.

It wouldn't be so bad, except that people respond to comments and thoughts from months ago--not only have several things changed in that time period, which can make some of the statements opinions meaningless, but there's a good chance a lot of the original responders aren't even frequently the boards anymore.

Most forums have rules against necroing threads for this very reason; it makes the forum less usable. It's also why particularly timeless/pertinent information gets stickied. Most threads are supposed to drop off the first few pages, and stay there.
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Your post touches on a similar 'issue' as my post:
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/3082209959#1

Blizzard is almost certainly creating a new game with disposable max ranked characters for us to trade, kill, or shelf as we see fit; I'm just not sure what/where all the playing/leveling incentives are coming from (or if I'm even in their target demographic anymore!).


Well first, your post seems to presume that drops won't be used to advance one's character, when the rune system will be based on drops and is going to be the focus of the post-level-30 game.

The second thing is that having an achievable level cap and a difficulty level that's tuned to be challenging at that cap improves replayability rather than making it less so, because it's not possible to level past all the content. That content will *always* be, to some degree, challenging for a capped character.

Also, the design for Inferno is for a steep difficulty ramp from beginning to end, and a wide range of gear quality across that range, so that a max-level character will take time and effort with significant stat improvement and lots of gear replacement to get through it.

There will be plenty of replayability -- it's just that that level number won't be the sole measure of a character's strength.
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02/12/2012 10:48 AMPosted by Sense
It wouldn't be so bad, except that people respond to comments and thoughts from months ago--not only have several things changed in that time period, which can make some of the statements opinions meaningless, but there's a good chance a lot of the original responders aren't even frequently the boards anymore.


That's certainly true, but I think the aspects of the game that provoked the original comments in this thread haven't changed much since August, and why it won't be an issue is still a reasonable topic for discussion.
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Posts: 659
Honestly I think something as simple as having to visit a Class Trainer, like in WoW, could feel like a reward without requiring too much of a change in the game (obligatory "I am not a programmer and I have no idea about how much of a change it would be, but it SEEMS minor enough :-p").

The fact is that levelling doesn't require me to do anything, and that's something I actually miss quite a lot from both WoW and from D2. The "Clicky Clicky" you mentioned is very important because it's tangible, and even if that click was really just me sinking 5 more points into Vitality, or just me putting 1 more point into Skeletal Mastery (loved zookeepers), the fact was that levelling didn't "make me stronger" - it was my choices and my actions that "made me stronger".

Here, the fact that everything is automated is convenient, but feels less rewarding.

There is also no choice in levelling - even in WoW, when you gained a bunch of new skills, it was your choice to train them (and it was expensive, so back in the day, you had to choose sometimes, rather than just spam the train button). In D2, obviously you choose stat points and skills. Here, not so much.

As levels and skills unlock, I would like to see them make level 8 unlock the 7, 8, and 9 skills, but you're only allowed to unlock one at a time per level. So rather than automatically getting 7 8 9 as you level, at 8, you would have to make a choice (at the skill trainer?!?!) that would affect you for the next 3 levels. This would make minimal difference/punishment at lower levels, but provides at least SOME form of a choice, and at later levels, when you're not levelling every 5-10 minutes, the choices could affect your gameplay/build for an hour or more.

This system provides choice and "temporary permanency", without being as punishing as "Aw man I accidentally clicked on energy and leveled Golem Mastery, now I have to remake my char".
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Posts: 659
Another 4-month old necro.

Does no one else mouseover thread titles to see the preview, where you can clearly see the original post date before clicking?


-_- damnit
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