Diablo® III

UI Suggestions, please, share your thoughts.

This thread is about weapons and items general user interface.

Item data screen is growing out of control, there's too much stuff going on there, wqaaaay too much stuff. You got your Damage per second marker, you actual damage, you magic or non magic marker, your estimated changes, your one hand-two hand-off hand marker, damage reduction, + or - damage, Oh Lawdy, it's too much!!

When I get a new item, I'm not really sure where to look to understand what my item does!
First of all, I dont like that the main marker is the Damage per second. I want to know the Damage Per Hit of the weapon.

Come one! We dont think our life as actions over seconds!
We want to know how hard are we going to hit the monsters, that's the idea of a weapon!

*"2.1 Damage per second, right... and that is....hum... with good speed is like... uhu... yeah, damage."

OR

*" Oh Yeah! 3-5 Damage, gonna bash some monsters with my club!"

Dont get me wrong, Damage per second is great for spells, like poisoning and other damage over time oriented skills. But not for Weapon Hit Damage.

So, I made this little mockup here, to illustrate some of my ideas.

http://img51.imageshack.us/img51/2231/fixx.jpg

-This is MY personal point of view about this issue- So don't start with the obvious "You're an idiot, Hurr Durr! Quit Whining! Durr Durr!! No one likes your idea, so go home, Derp Hurr Durr!!

If you like my idea or the current Weapon/Item UI, please, share your thoughts, I would love to hear different points of view about this matter.
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11/23/2011 05:39 AMPosted by Thunderballs
I prefer the way blizzard has it...
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90 Troll Shaman
12795
The color on the damage amount on the last page of your pic makes me think that yellow = lightning damage. I donno why, but I guess that's how my brain processes it.
I think you might have a point with it getting out of control with the numbers. It used to be that we just needed to know how much damage the weapon did. Damage per seconds really only sounds like beneficial information when you are fighting a boss (like in WoW) for 5+ minutes. Otherwise, look at the actual damage the weapon does and go for the big swings and big damage modifiers on your abilities.
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Yeah, in my opinion, right now I feel like I'm holding a "thing" that increases my damage over time, rather than a weapon with solid hit damage.
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DPS is a better way to understand what damage your weapon does. If the tooltip says your weapon does between 3 - 5 damage and has an attack speed of 3 seconds, exactly how much damage is your weapon doing per swing?

As the game progresses, battles will take longer and longer, don't be fooled by Beta, everyone who has played Diablo before knows that normal mode is like a walk in the park.
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Yeah, but you can always check the dps in your item box, or in your character sheet.
DPS marker is great, it's very useful, and it's probably the most viable way to get maximum efficiency. But it doesn't FEEL right.
This game has been crafted to FEEL right, they've stated this many, many times. And to me, this is not working as it should.

Come on! even in WoW, where DPS is the most important thing, Damage per Hit is featured first on items.
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I'm just scared that this may happen one day: http://img717.imageshack.us/img717/8867/betterdi.jpg
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First of all, I dont like that the main marker is the Damage per second. I want to know the Damage Per Hit of the weapon. Dont get me wrong, Damage per second is great for spells, like poisoning and other damage over time oriented skills. But not for Weapon Hit Damage.


No, it's like that on purpose because you shouldn't care about weapon hit damage because you're not naked striking with your weapon, you are using skills and your skill damage is based off DPS.

This is on purpose to ensure that fast weapons are just as viable as slow weapons and we don't have a situation like WoW where we throw out everything but the slowest speed weapon possible.
Edited by PlanetXpress on 11/23/2011 1:39 PM PST
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I dont know. As a visual artist, I find that the actual design of the UI is not working.
Play with me for a while:

-Most of the actions in game are click to hit. You click, you hit.
-You see an item, and want to know how much your click is worth.
-You dont get that, instead, you find a value of how much would your click be worth if you keep clicking non stop for a perioud of time, and then you have to find out the speed of the attack to calculate how much every single click is worth spending on each enemy.

That, is not the most practical way for displaying clicks effectiveness.
It works perfectly on a game like WoW, or Lineage II, where you select an enemy, and your character keeps autoattacking until stopped. Since you can't control the ammount of attacks per second, the dps is always the same.

In a game like diablo (click and hit), the most natural human response is to look for a hit on click value.

That's why, in my opinion, Hit on Click value should be the First and most Noticeable value of all.
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11/23/2011 05:29 AMPosted by Executor
This thread is about weapons and items general user interface. <br /><br />Item data screen is growing out of control, there's too much stuff going on there, wqaaaay too much stuff. You got your Damage per second marker, you actual damage, you magic or non magic marker, your estimated changes, your one hand-two hand-off hand marker, damage reduction, + or - damage, Oh Lawdy, it's too much!!<br /><br />When I get a new item, I'm not really sure where to look to understand what my item does!<br />First of all, I dont like that the main marker is the Damage per second. I want to know the Damage Per Hit of the weapon.<br /><br />Come one! We dont think our life as actions over seconds!<br />We want to know how hard are we going to hit the monsters, that's the idea of a weapon!<br /><br />*"2.1 Damage per second, right... and that is....hum... with good speed is like... uhu... yeah, damage."<br /><br />OR<br /><br />*" Oh Yeah! 3-5 Damage, gonna bash some monsters with my club!"<br /><br />Dont get me wrong, Damage per second is great for spells, like poisoning and other damage over time oriented skills. But not for Weapon Hit Damage.<br /><br />So, I made this little mockup here, to illustrate some of my ideas.<br /><br />http://img51.imageshack.us/img51/2231/fixx.jpg<br /><br />-This is MY personal point of view about this issue- So don't start with the obvious "You're an idiot, Hurr Durr! Quit Whining! Durr Durr!! No one likes your idea, so go home, Derp Hurr Durr!!<br /><br />If you like my idea or the current Weapon/Item UI, please, share your thoughts, I would love to hear different points of view about this matter.


11/23/2011 02:16 PMPosted by Executor
I dont know. As a visual artist, I find that the actual design of the UI is not working.<br />Play with me for a while:<br /><br />-Most of the actions in game are click to hit. You click, you hit.<br />-You see an item, and want to know how much your click is worth.<br />-You dont get that, instead, you find a value of how much would your click be worth if you keep clicking non stop for a perioud of time, and then you have to find out the speed of the attack to calculate how much every single click is worth spending on each enemy.<br /><br />That, is not the most practical way for displaying clicks effectiveness.<br />It works perfectly on a game like WoW, or Lineage II, where you select an enemy, and your character keeps autoattacking until stopped. Since you can't control the ammount of attacks per second, the dps is always the same.<br /><br />In a game like diablo (click and hit), the most natural human response is to look for a hit on click value.<br /><br />That's why, in my opinion, Hit on Click value should be the First and most Noticeable value of all.


I agree, like in D1 and D2 right?

Then they can display DPS if they wanted to signify the actual damage over time, but I agree that the click value should come first, even if it does not signify your true damage.
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-Most of the actions in game are click to hit. You click, you hit.
-You see an item, and want to know how much your click is worth.
-You dont get that, instead, you find a value of how much would your click be worth if you keep clicking non stop for a period of time, and then you have to find out the speed of the attack to calculate how much every single click is worth spending on each enemy.


Yes, I get your point, but once they start breaking it down so that it shows dmg per click, YOU KNOW, that JUST LIKE Gearscore in WoW, anything under the highest possible click will immediately be flamed and thrown out, regardless of the merits of the build/items.... or regardless of the fun value...

"why do we want to invite barb A with 98 dmg per click, when we can get barb B with 99 dmg per click" that type of thing.... even though functionally the difference is irrelevant, it will screw over a lot of people, just like Gearscore and other quantifying mechanics.... by other a$$holes.
Edited by ZeroGhosT on 11/23/2011 2:26 PM PST
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90 Troll Druid
15845
I dont know. As a visual artist,
Lawl.
I find that the actual design of the UI is not working.
Lawl.
Play with me for a while:<br /><br />-Most of the actions in game are click to hit. You click, you hit.<br />-You see an item, and want to know how much your click is worth.<br />-You dont get that, instead, you find a value of how much would your click be worth if you keep clicking non stop for a perioud of time, and then you have to find out the speed of the attack to calculate how much every single click is worth spending on each enemy.<br /><br />That, is not the most practical way for displaying clicks effectiveness.<br />It works perfectly on a game like WoW, or Lineage II, where you select an enemy, and your character keeps autoattacking until stopped. Since you can't control the ammount of attacks per second, the dps is always the same.<br /><br />In a game like diablo (click and hit), the most natural human response is to look for a hit on click value.<br /><br />That's why, in my opinion, Hit on Click value should be the First and most Noticeable value of all.
These aren't the droids you're looking for.

You're putting the information int he wrong place, because raw attacks aren't used. Weapon:Weapon comparisons are basically just that - weapon to weapon. The UI for items exists by and large to provide a basic understanding of how good something is compared to other like items, and how it'll impact your character at a glance. Since actual output damage is dependent on so many factors that aren't weapon damage per swing putting that information front and centre just muddles the actual value comparison.

Many classes don't use /hit damage in a direct way, only within the DPS equation itself, and putting weapon damage up front disguises the equally important element of weapon speed. Because the final output for most skills in the game is based off (damage per hit) * (attacks per second) DPS is actually the important number.

For hard damage results you're looking at the actual skills, where everything has been included from raw weapon damage to swing speed to precision to attack rating to skill multiplier.

Skill multipliers alone undermine your entire thesis.
Edited by Krystle on 11/23/2011 2:32 PM PST
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11/23/2011 02:31 PMPosted by Krystle
For hard damage results you're looking at the actual skills, where everything has been included from raw weapon damage to swing speed to precision to attack rating to skill multiplier.

Yeah, you're right. That sounds just like a fun game.
If this is what the company is aiming to, I'll just go play with my abacus and save $60.
Edited by Executor on 11/23/2011 2:53 PM PST
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11/23/2011 02:50 PMPosted by Executor
For hard damage results you're looking at the actual skills, where everything has been included from raw weapon damage to swing speed to precision to attack rating to skill multiplier.
<br /><br />Yeah, you're right. That sounds just like a fun game.<br />If this is what the game is aiming to, I'll just go play with my abacus and save $60.


LOL
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90 Troll Druid
15845
11/23/2011 02:50 PMPosted by Executor
For hard damage results you're looking at the actual skills, where everything has been included from raw weapon damage to swing speed to precision to attack rating to skill multiplier.
<br />Yeah, you're right. That sounds just like a fun game.<br />If this is what the company is aiming to, I'll just go play with my abacus and save $60.
No, you moron, the final value. You're trying to display damage per attack on the weapon when that value belongs on the skill tooltip because that's what you actually click. No wonder good design escapes you. There are flaws with the tooltips as is, but your suggestions make them worse.
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11/23/2011 02:56 PMPosted by Krystle
No wonder good design escapes you.


Good design means having all the data chewed up for you?
Yeeaahhh I don't think so

- I correct myself.
Maybe it's good design. But not fun.
Not at all.
Edited by Executor on 11/23/2011 3:01 PM PST
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The thing I find strange is why they're putting grey text on a black background. You make a good point about colour.
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