Diablo® III

yeah I've noticed this... annoying.
No wonder they said 'you will die'

I have high hoped that Blizz will fix the issue in a post release patch, to be at least like Diablo II. If they can make it more like Torchlight even better.

But yes, glad people are still drawing attention to this, it definitely needs to be fixed.

04/10/2012 09:09 AMPosted by D3BETA

do you really think that we should be getting hit when the monsters swing misses us by what looks to be 10 feet? do you really think its ok that scavengers will ALWAYS hit you even if ur running away from them?

Do I think it's good that you can't just run away from mobs? Yeah. Challenge. Fight or die. Hack n slash.

It kind of defeats the purpose of having avoidance skills if you can just run away.

If you never get hit it's not much of a challenge. Monsters aren't a threat.

I agree that it feels "lame" that you can't actually dodge attacks. I can only assume that it is done for some higher purpose. What that purpose is, I have no idea. Maybe they tried the game as you suggest, where you can actually dodge stuff, and it made the game way too easy yet less fun at the same time. I initially tried to dodge stuff in beta, but eventually stopped doing it and stood my ground because there was no point. Instead, I would get a skill like stomp/blind or some other stun/disorient to interrupt slow attacks like the grotesque has.

Is it really fun to be required to dodge slow melee attacks, or more fun to be forced to use a skill to interrupt an attack? If you can dodge stuff, suddenly the difference in play experience for someone with really high APM becomes very different from that of someone less skilled. It becomes different and also less fun? Can only speculate...

the problem with that, is doing so is using SKILL to surpass gameplay. this shouldnt be stopped. limiting skill by makign bad gameplay mechanics is foolish and gamebreaking

It's not SKILL to stack runspeed and run past everything. If anything that was an exploit in Diablo2 that broke gameplay.

It's not even a bad gameplay mechanic. It's likely that the hit is registered when the NPC swing animation starts, not when it finishes. They can either take increased movement speed out of the game or change mechanics so it doesn't break the game.

you cant stack runspeed. (boots only) i dont see how juking with movement is a metagame

04/10/2012 09:17 AMPosted by D3BETA

do you really think that we should be getting hit when the monsters swing misses us by what looks to be 10 feet? do you really think its ok that scavengers will ALWAYS hit you even if ur running away from them?

Do I think it's good that you can't just run away from mobs? Yeah. Challenge. Fight or die. Hack n slash.

It kind of defeats the purpose of having avoidance skills if you can just run away.

If you never get hit it's not much of a challenge. Monsters aren't a threat.

if you never get hit, its because you have good reflexes and are good at juking hits. thats like saying boxers shouldnt be able to dodge a punch, and shouldnt be allowed to train their speed

I agree that it feels "lame" that you can't actually dodge attacks. I can only assume that it is done for some higher purpose. What that purpose is, I have no idea. Maybe they tried the game as you suggest, where you can actually dodge stuff, and it made the game way too easy yet less fun at the same time. I initially tried to dodge stuff in beta, but eventually stopped doing it and stood my ground because there was no point. Instead, I would get a skill like stomp/blind or some other stun/disorient to interrupt slow attacks like the grotesque has.

Is it really fun to be required to dodge slow melee attacks, or more fun to be forced to use a skill to interrupt an attack? If you can dodge stuff, suddenly the difference in play experience for someone with really high APM becomes very different from that of someone less skilled. It becomes different and also less fun? Can only speculate...

In Diablo2 it was just too easy to run past all the content straight to the quest objectives. This mechanic is just a way to force you to fight through the content instead of running through it. It seems like you can still dodge attacks by staying out of range, but if you get in range you're guaranteed to take hits from everything around you. That will prevent you from running past anything.

04/10/2012 09:23 AMPosted by D3BETA

if you never get hit, its because you have good reflexes and are good at juking hits. thats like saying boxers shouldnt be able to dodge a punch, and shouldnt be allowed to train their speed

The NPC's aren't allowed to train their speed. It doesn't mean you have good reflexes, it just means you're moving 10x as fast as everything around you is allowed to.

Is it really fun to be required to dodge slow melee attacks, or more fun to be forced to use a skill to interrupt an attack? If you can dodge stuff, suddenly the difference in play experience for someone with really high APM becomes very different from that of someone less skilled. It becomes different and also less fun? Can only speculate...

yes it is actually, the most fun i have in path of exile (tho a worse game in every other aspect) was my ability to be able to juke swings. it feels smooth. it feels right. and it feels pro

and yes it is fun, both should be something we should be able to do (juke and inturrupt)

In Diablo2 it was just too easy to run past all the content straight to the quest objectives. This mechanic is just a way to force you to fight through the content instead of running through it. It seems like you can still dodge attacks by staying out of range, but if you get in range you're guaranteed to take hits from everything around you. That will prevent you from running past anything.

Yeah I agree here too. Late game with Vigor Aura on a paladin yielded very fast move speed. You could still run around packs, but getting within melee range landed guaranteed hits. Skills like teleport though could save you from hits, even after the attack animation started. You just needed to cast faster than they could attack to be invulnerable.

I don't remember how this worked for PVP - maybe you can juke hits in PVP but not PVE.

04/10/2012 09:23 AMPosted by D3BETA

Do I think it's good that you can't just run away from mobs? Yeah. Challenge. Fight or die. Hack n slash.

It kind of defeats the purpose of having avoidance skills if you can just run away.

If you never get hit it's not much of a challenge. Monsters aren't a threat.

if you never get hit, its because you have good reflexes and are good at juking hits. thats like saying boxers shouldnt be able to dodge a punch, and shouldnt be allowed to train their speed

Boxers can't blind people with magic or drop giant bells from the sky. It's a game.

There are skills in the game to avoid hits. Using movement to avoid all hits defeats their purpose, so why take them? Why even put them in the game?

This isn't a spectacle fighter where you can dodge everything and anything. Monsters are supposed to be a threat. You're supposed to be hit. It's kill or be killed. Not prance around like a ballerina (hey I can make ridiculous comparisons too!)

If you never got hit, you'd never feel threatened.

The NPC's aren't allowed to train their speed. It doesn't mean you have good reflexes, it just means you're moving 10x as fast as everything around you is allowed to.

have you once read any of the times i said you cant stack movement speed? its on boots only

first time i jumped into the beta i realized that you couldnt dodge their atacks like go in for a melee hit and then run out before their attack animation landed but every single time my character got hit. It felt like i was playing counterstrike with bots with auto aim... it just feels cheap to the player.

if you never get hit, its because you have good reflexes and are good at juking hits. thats like saying boxers shouldnt be able to dodge a punch, and shouldnt be allowed to train their speed

Boxers can't blind people with magic or drop giant bells from the sky. It's a game.

There are skills in the game to avoid hits. Using movement to avoid all hits defeats their purpose, so why take them? Why even put them in the game?

This isn't a spectacle fighter where you can dodge everything and anything. Monsters are supposed to be a threat. You're supposed to be hit. It's kill or be killed. Not prance around like a ballerina (hey I can make ridiculous comparisons too!)

If you never got hit, you'd never feel threatened.

without being able to juke, it makes said skills mandatory. and you still hafta make a conscious decision, and notice you are in trouble to start juking hits. path of exile has this same philosophy, same as torchlight. (and many other games) you can outmaneuver enemies and juke attacks. nowhere do you see people complaining about this. people still die. just because you CAN juke, doesnt mean you WILL juke everything, and doing so takes some pretty godlike skill (to outmaneuver all attacks)

and so, because its a game, things like this should be allowed to happen?

http://imgur.com/J5L3y
http://imgur.com/4UcaS
http://imgur.com/r7jMZ
http://imgur.com/6dPzS

do you really wanna be hit by melee monsters half a screen away from you?

also this last line:

"If you never got hit, you'd never feel threatened."

thats very illogical. to juke, you must first feel threatened

04/10/2012 09:34 AMPosted by D3BETA

do you really wanna be hit by melee monsters half a screen away from you?

So those monsters should just never be a threat at all? Because they take so long to swing?

If you're half a screen away how threatening can they be?

04/10/2012 09:23 AMPosted by Gigan

In Diablo2 it was just too easy to run past all the content straight to the quest objectives.

this was the case because of movement speed stack with auras or teleporting everywhere. thats already been handled and is a separate issue. if players really wanted to avoid everything (which makes no sense being that since bosses arent the end all be all of loot pinatas, and now everything esp champ/elite packs, there is no desire or reward for skipping anything/everything) they still could, in the games current iteration

Or here's a better idea. Don't get close enough to get in melee range if you want to avoid attacks.

do you really wanna be hit by melee monsters half a screen away from you?

So those monsters should just never be a threat at all? Because they take so long to swing?

if you are aware enough to see it coming, and move out of the way, we should be able to do that. whats wrong with that? thats like saying, getting out of fire from under our feet shouldnt be allowed because moving out of it makes it not a threat at all

in fact, thats the exact same thing

04/10/2012 09:39 AMPosted by D3BETA

Or here's a better idea. Don't get close enough to get in melee range if you want to avoid attacks.

heres a better idea - fix poor game mechanics that look and feel sloppy

04/10/2012 09:39 AMPosted by D3BETA

So those monsters should just never be a threat at all? Because they take so long to swing?

if you are aware enough to see it coming, and move out of the way, we should be able to do that. whats wrong with that? thats like saying, getting out of fire from under our feet shouldnt be allowed because moving out of it makes it not a threat at all

If you're aware enough to see them coming into melee range, move before they get into melee range. It's your fault for getting into melee range in the first place. You should be hit for getting in their range in the first place. You shouldn't get a get out of jail free card because you screwed up in the first place letting them get so close.

04/10/2012 09:40 AMPosted by D3BETA

Or here's a better idea. Don't get close enough to get in melee range if you want to avoid attacks.

heres a better idea - fix poor game mechanics that look and feel sloppy

Don't be bad enough to get into melee range in the first place. No get out of jail free card for you.

if you are aware enough to see it coming, and move out of the way, we should be able to do that. whats wrong with that? thats like saying, getting out of fire from under our feet shouldnt be allowed because moving out of it makes it not a threat at all

If you're aware enough to see them coming into melee range, move before they get into melee range. It's your fault for getting into melee range in the first place. You should be hit for getting in their range in the first place. You shouldn't get a get out of jail free card because you screwed up in the first place letting them get so close.

you cant do that for everything, like for instance scavengers. they move faster than us, you simply are forced into taking hits

its not a get out of jail free card, not any more than moving out of fire under your feet is