Diablo® III

A Simple Solution/Compromise To Runeskills :)

Posts: 7,159
So, at the moment we seem to have two camps.

The first dislike the new system intensely due to:
- Death of leveling theme builds.
- Massive impact on Hardcore mode.
- Arbitrary level requirements.
- Lack of control/choice over unlocks.

The second either likes the new system, is willing to accept it or just doesn't want the game delayed again (which I totally understand).

I believe that there is an easy way to satisfy both camps, keep the game as newbie friendly as before and allow us at least some control over our characters in a way that will take minimal time to implement.

Basically - Every 9 levels the player gets one 'free' unlock and can choose *any* runeskill to unlock and use regardless of level requirements.

This means:
- Casuals and Newbies are unaffected, since runes will continue to unlock at normal pace.
- Those of us wanting to level as theme builds will be able to do so *much* more effectively.
- We have much more control over our character's progression
- There is still something to look forward to.
- This should be very simple to implement with minimal delay.

Thoughts?
Edited by Starbird on 2/26/2012 5:28 PM PST
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Posts: 7,159
Yes. The existance of other suggestion threads does not preclude me making a suggestion of my own. Thank you for the productive reply.
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Posts: 2,660
So, why every 9?

Not sure if I like it, because then you would need some kind of re-spec skill rune system, for people who accidentally picked the wrong runes.

As well as, this gets away from the original system of more customization and freedom.


I think it has to be in the middle grounds, where at level 30 we have access to all runes. After level 30 there is some other compromise.

Maybe runes gain level as you use them, giving benefit to sticking with builds.

Or after level 30, you get the talisman, which can further alter skills. Say every 10 levels after 30, you unlock a new slot.

This way you can either further alter what a skill rune does, or possibly gain the use of multiple skill runes.

Not sure if thats any good.

I just think that sacrificing early (heck even late) game customization, just so something is unlocked at every level is...i dont know, lazy?

The new system isn't terrible, but they need to change something.

Because how it currently is, it is the same as D2"s skill progression....only now some skills wont be unlocked until after hell....and they aren't even more powerful.

Could you imagine in Diablo 2 unlocking a new skill right after you beat hell...buts its not even more powerful...just, different.

Just seems weird that the customization in D3 will only start at Inferno. It would make more sense if it started at the beginning of the game, and got heavy in the middle. I tend to like to have my builds down once I reach "endgame" in video games.

It just seems like backwards thinking. Unless Blizzard fully intends for everyone and anyone to be able to make it through Nightmare and Hell and on to Inferno.

Which is kinda disappointing to me. Not that I can be the only to fully beat D3, but I don't like the fact that EVERYONE and Jays grandma can. Don't shy from difficulty people, life isn't easy, neither should your video-games be.
Edited by randomtask on 2/26/2012 5:43 PM PST
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Posts: 70
Agree with the OP.

Later rune unlocks aren't necessarily more powerful than earlier unlocks, just different.

Allowing choice in rune unlocks would be great, allowing us to tailor our builds to suit as we level.
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Posts: 7,159
So, why every 9?

Not sure if I like it, because then you would need some kind of re-spec skill rune system, for people who accidentally picked the wrong runes.

As well as, this gets away from the original system of more customization and freedom.


I think it has to be in the middle grounds, where at level 30 we have access to all runes. After level 30 there is some other compromise.

Maybe runes gain level as you use them, giving benefit to sticking with builds.

Or after level 30, you get the talisman, which can further alter skills. Say every 10 levels after 30, you unlock a new slot.

This way you can either further alter what a skill rune does, or possibly gain the use of multiple skill runes.

Not sure if thats any good.

I just think that sacrificing early (heck even late) game customization, just so something is unlocked at every level is...i dont know, lazy?

The new system isn't terrible, but they need to change something.

Because how it currently is, it is the same as D2"s skill progression....only now some skills wont be unlocked until after hell....and they aren't even more powerful.

Could you imagine in Diablo 2 unlocking a new skill right after you beat hell...buts its not even more powerful...just, different.

Just seems weird that the customization in D3 will only start at Inferno. It would make more sense if it started at the beginning of the game, and got heavy in the middle. I tend to like to have my builds down once I reach "endgame" in video games.

It just seems like backwards thinking. Unless Blizzard fully intends for everyone and anyone to be able to make it through Nightmare and Hell and on to Inferno.

Which is kinda disappointing to me. Not that I can be the only to fully beat D3, but I don't like the fact that EVERYONE and Jays grandma can. Don't shy from difficulty people, life isn't easy, neither should your video-games be.


This one goes into issues that I won't go into in this thread (difficulty, customizability). Basically, the new rune system is going live and to me it's about damage control :)

Original system of customization and freedom is dead. This actually aims to get a *little* bit of it back.

This would not need respecs - since runes will unlock eventually anyway. All this means is that you can access one early, every 9 levels. I picked that number since it means there will be 6 unlocks total (9,18,27,36,45,54) which is pretty much the number of skills you would be using.

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So, at the moment we seem to have two camps.

The first dislike the new system intensely due to:
- Death of leveling theme builds.
- Massive impact on Hardcore mode.
- Arbitrary level requirements.
- Lack of control/choice over unlocks.

The second either likes the new system, is willing to accept it or just doesn't want the game delayed again (which I totally understand).

I believe that there is an easy way to satisfy both camps, keep the game as newbie friendly as before and allow us at least some control over our characters in a way that will take minimal time to implement.

Basically - Every 9 levels the player gets one 'free' unlock and can choose *any* runeskill to unlock and use regardless of level requirements.

This means:
- Casuals and Newbies are unaffected, since runes will continue to unlock at normal pace.
- Those of us wanting to level as theme builds will be able to do so *much* more effectively.
- We have much more control over our character's progression
- There is still something to look forward to.
- This should be very simple to implement with minimal delay.

Thoughts?


Excellent thread Starbird, but I think it will just get lost in the sea of crap suggestions or people suggesting things that Blizzard will never do. This offers a sweet spot between those of us who want customizability and those who don't.



So, why every 9?

Not sure if I like it, because then you would need some kind of re-spec skill rune system, for people who accidentally picked the wrong runes.

As well as, this gets away from the original system of more customization and freedom.


I think it has to be in the middle grounds, where at level 30 we have access to all runes. After level 30 there is some other compromise.

Maybe runes gain level as you use them, giving benefit to sticking with builds.

Or after level 30, you get the talisman, which can further alter skills. Say every 10 levels after 30, you unlock a new slot.

This way you can either further alter what a skill rune does, or possibly gain the use of multiple skill runes.

Not sure if thats any good.

I just think that sacrificing early (heck even late) game customization, just so something is unlocked at every level is...i dont know, lazy?

The new system isn't terrible, but they need to change something.

Because how it currently is, it is the same as D2"s skill progression....only now some skills wont be unlocked until after hell....and they aren't even more powerful.

Could you imagine in Diablo 2 unlocking a new skill right after you beat hell...buts its not even more powerful...just, different.

Just seems weird that the customization in D3 will only start at Inferno. It would make more sense if it started at the beginning of the game, and got heavy in the middle. I tend to like to have my builds down once I reach "endgame" in video games.

It just seems like backwards thinking. Unless Blizzard fully intends for everyone and anyone to be able to make it through Nightmare and Hell and on to Inferno.

Which is kinda disappointing to me. Not that I can be the only to fully beat D3, but I don't like the fact that EVERYONE and Jays grandma can. Don't shy from difficulty people, life isn't easy, neither should your video-games be.


Huh?

> Grandmother can finish normal. Nightmare and Hell likely not. Beat Inferno and then we will talk.
> Everything unlocking at 30 will never happen. This takes us right back to 30-60 gap which they introduced this system to beat.
> I agree that it's crap to lock us out of customization until Inferno, but what can you do? Blizzard aren't going to back down at this point.


Actually, is your post supporting the OP, disagreeing with the OP or is this talking about the rune system in general?

...My head hurts.
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02/26/2012 05:49 PMPosted by Loading
HEY LOOK ANOTHER RUNE THREAD! Dang havn't seen 500 of these today.


Someone didn't bother reading?

Until they introduce the suggestions forum this is the only way to do it. If you don't like the thread, don't bump it.
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02/26/2012 05:56 PMPosted by Flummox
Yes. The existance of other suggestion threads does not preclude me making a suggestion of my own. Thank you for the productive reply.


That's unfortunate because they won't change anything according to any of the suggestions posted by you or in the other threads. It's exhausting and irritating having to constantly see these pop up in General Discussions. It's practically spam. My reply was productive.


No, your reply was yet another flashbang of stupid. So...no one should bother giving any feedback ever, on anything? Where else are we supposed to submit suggestions? OPs idea is actually pretty good.
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Posts: 7,159
Yes. The existance of other suggestion threads does not preclude me making a suggestion of my own. Thank you for the productive reply.


That's unfortunate because they won't change anything according to any of the suggestions posted by you or in the other threads. It's exhausting and irritating having to constantly see these pop up in General Discussions. It's practically spam. My reply was productive.


Your reply was off topic, non-constructive and basically trolling.

Blizzard do change things according to suggestions. They also want feedback. If I had a beta key, such feedback as I have would go in that forum. If there was a suggestion box, they would go in there. In their absence, I will continue to post here. If you disagree with my suggestion, feel free to say why. Otherwise don't post.
Edited by Starbird on 2/26/2012 6:04 PM PST
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90 Draenei Priest
6645
Posts: 10,221
02/26/2012 06:03 PMPosted by Starbird


That's unfortunate because they won't change anything according to any of the suggestions posted by you or in the other threads. It's exhausting and irritating having to constantly see these pop up in General Discussions. It's practically spam. My reply was productive.


Your reply was off topic, non-constructive and basically trolling.

Blizzard do change things according to suggestions. They also want feedback. If I had a beta key, such feedback as I have would go in that forum. If there was a suggestion box, they would go in there. In their absence, I will continue to post here. If you disagree with my suggestion, feel free to say why. Otherwise don't post.


02/26/2012 06:00 PMPosted by Rainbird


That's unfortunate because they won't change anything according to any of the suggestions posted by you or in the other threads. It's exhausting and irritating having to constantly see these pop up in General Discussions. It's practically spam. My reply was productive.

No, your reply was yet another flashbang of stupid. So...no one should bother giving any feedback ever, on anything? Where else are we supposed to submit suggestions? OPs idea is actually pretty good.


Troll gains +1000 satisfaction points. Troll is now level 3!

Seriously though, stop feeding it. Ignore, report and go about your lives.

OP - Nice suggestion and I hope it gets read, but I think that it will be ignored.
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Posts: 499
why is everyone offering suggestions to change to rune system, it's fine, and it works well, everyone's ideas are either terrible, or just unnecessary

people don't understand that blizz doesn't want you to have a static build while leveling, they want you to experiment and find other ways to play than simply using the same skills for 60 levels
Edited by sonofabeck on 2/26/2012 6:26 PM PST
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90 Draenei Priest
6645
Posts: 10,221
why is everyone offering suggestions to change to rune system, it's fine, and it works well, everyone's ideas are either terrible, or just unnecessary
people don't understand that blizz doesn't want you to have a static build while leveling, they want you to experiment and find other ways to play than simply using the same skills for 60 levels


But this new system doesn't encourage experimentation until much later. Most new players will go 'ooh, new skill/rune', try it and then go back to the original one they liked. Old system allowed us to play with all rune effects before the end of normal.

...Why is it that the people who think the new system needs work for the most part are polite, offer suggestions and respect the viewpoints of the other side, while those who support it generally respond like this ^ ?

Basically "I think it's fine, so shut up".
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Posts: 7,159
i often don't like repeating myself Starbird, so you can read my solution here:

http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/4081814631

But am with you that the current system needs attention.


Thanks :) Also a nice thread.

why is everyone offering suggestions to change to rune system, it's fine, and it works well, everyone's ideas are either terrible, or just unnecessary

people don't understand that blizz doesn't want you to have a static build while leveling, they want you to experiment and find other ways to play than simply using the same skills for 60 levels


Because...we disagree? Other people may have different viewpoints to you. This does not mean they are wrong.
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Posts: 499
why is everyone offering suggestions to change to rune system, it's fine, and it works well, everyone's ideas are either terrible, or just unnecessary

people don't understand that blizz doesn't want you to have a static build while leveling, they want you to experiment and find other ways to play than simply using the same skills for 60 levels


But this new system doesn't encourage experimentation until much later. Most new players will go 'ooh, new skill/rune', try it and then go back to the original one they liked. Old system allowed us to play with all rune effects before the end of normal.

...Why is it that the people who think the new system needs work for the most part are polite, offer suggestions and respect the viewpoints of the other side, while those who support it generally respond like this ^ ?

Basically "I think it's fine, so shut up".


Because you're offering suggestions to change something in a game, that isn't even out yet, and it gets annoying when these are the only threads you come across

besides, I don't see your logic, either way they're going to pick the rune they want right? so what's the difference if they get it early in the game or later? experiment, you might find something you enjoy more
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