Diablo® III

Hungering Arrow vs Entangling Shot vs Bola

One thing to keep in mind i believe, is that Hatred generators tend to be supplemental damage to spender skills. Pay less attention to the pure damage output of your generator, such as Entangling Shot's paltry weapon percentage, and more attention to its use.
When facing strong packs, i dont intend to open up with ANY of the generator skills unless i have to, as the damage potential for spenders can be so much greater. It is nice, however, that when i do need to recover hatred, i can do so while still dishing out damage. In this regard, skills like Hungering Arrow are great. But you want to switch back to your spender as soon as possible in the fight, and thats where something like Entangling/ Justice comes in handy. Add in Bat with Templar spec'd for +1 htred regen and Rapid Fire/ Multishot is ready for another barrage in seconds.

So it really depends on what the generator brings to the table. Are you waiting on Hatred often? Are you looking to bank shot at range to sort of do recon work before actually going around that corner? Consider the benefit of what the generator does a little more closely than its damage potential.
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One thing to keep in mind i believe, is that Hatred generators tend to be supplemental damage to spender skills. Pay less attention to the pure damage output of your generator, such as Entangling Shot's paltry weapon percentage, and more attention to its use.
When facing strong packs, i dont intend to open up with ANY of the generator skills unless i have to, as the damage potential for spenders can be so much greater. It is nice, however, that when i do need to recover hatred, i can do so while still dishing out damage. In this regard, skills like Hungering Arrow are great. But you want to switch back to your spender as soon as possible in the fight, and thats where something like Entangling/ Justice comes in handy. Add in Bat with Templar spec'd for +1 htred regen and Rapid Fire/ Multishot is ready for another barrage in seconds.

So it really depends on what the generator brings to the table. Are you waiting on Hatred often? Are you looking to bank shot at range to sort of do recon work before actually going around that corner? Consider the benefit of what the generator does a little more closely than its damage potential.


This guy knows what's up. Get elemental arrow with NT (Lightning ball pre-60 for me), Entangling with chain gang or the + hatred rune for slow or devouring arrow for extra dmg/offscreen shooting. I use bat with NT, so it's hard for me to even run out of hatred. Spam NT, use the others when you need to slow/fast attacks.
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I've never found a use for bola shot ever


Just wow.

So when bitter pill was the only ability that let you perma SS it was useless?

So when Volotile explosives does good damage, is sufficient AoE damage to take out trash in inferno and let you regen hate quickly at the same time it is still useless?

So when imminent doom is statistically one of the best auto-attacks in the game it is still useless?

Please, stop misleading people and just tell the truth. You don't like Bola because you don't use Bola, simple. The drawback for bola is in the delay, other than that it is statistically better than the other abilities and frees up space on your skillbar where AoE abilities would have been. Now you get to add mark of death or some !@#$ and use all your rage for Impale. Works for me in act 3 inferno at least.


I've killed diablo on inferno, and you never needed perma SS for anything. The reason I don't use bola for aoe is because NT > bola in basically every situation except for small mobs that dart around, in which case hungering arrow would deal with them just fine.
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huh... am i the only one that uses grenades with tinkerer?

also, covering fire is awesome.
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Posts: 1,591
05/29/2012 09:26 AMPosted by Barghest
Evasive Fire/Covering Fire rocks, try it out. Never seen anyone using it, though. People don't like 125% damage across 3 mobs, 4 Hatred returned, instant hit (no missile), goes through Waller walls and more? Their loss :p


It does !@#$ damage against single targets and when you are kiting something around and accidentally backflip into another mob because you were slightly too close to the one you were attacking... you'll take it off your bar. It also uses up discipline that I would rather just spend on SS or Vault.
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Posts: 1,591
One thing to keep in mind i believe, is that Hatred generators tend to be supplemental damage to spender skills. Pay less attention to the pure damage output of your generator, such as Entangling Shot's paltry weapon percentage, and more attention to its use.
When facing strong packs, i dont intend to open up with ANY of the generator skills unless i have to, as the damage potential for spenders can be so much greater. It is nice, however, that when i do need to recover hatred, i can do so while still dishing out damage. In this regard, skills like Hungering Arrow are great. But you want to switch back to your spender as soon as possible in the fight, and thats where something like Entangling/ Justice comes in handy. Add in Bat with Templar spec'd for +1 htred regen and Rapid Fire/ Multishot is ready for another barrage in seconds.

So it really depends on what the generator brings to the table. Are you waiting on Hatred often? Are you looking to bank shot at range to sort of do recon work before actually going around that corner? Consider the benefit of what the generator does a little more closely than its damage potential.


That is also the exact reason I still use HA over any other generator. The side-effects on the rest of them are just too bad.

Entangling Shot gives a slow, sure, but that slow is useless in Inferno when fast mobs will still move twice as fast as you with its slow and it requires you to turn and shoot them instead of being able to lay Caltrops mid-run.

Never was a fan of the delayed explosion on Bola which pretty much killed all its usefulness for me. Doesn't give that much discipline back with the rune and the stun is useless past NM.

Evasive Fire tends to waste all your discipline and takes too much coordination to make sure your backflip isn't going to get you killed when you're facing a tough mob where every millisecond counts. It also isn't goingto help you dodge a ranged mob when you have nothing to backflip as you try to avoid a missile. Also the backflip is super short unruned so it's just going to be a discipline drain against faster mobs.

Grenades generates a lot of hatred but they are very delayed in having to bounce out, especially at long distances, and tend to spread out way too far along with dealing inferior damage.

That leaves Hungering Arrow which does great damage and, best of all, can be shot around corners or off the map to hit mobs that you can't even see. It is so nice, especially during the Belial fight, to watch mobs die as soon as they appear on your screen because HA was already eating them when they were too far to see.

Now, all of these generators still have their utility at low levels/easier difficulties, but that's to be expected. When slows actually work, you don't need to save your disc to hit SS at a moments notice, a delayed hit isn't going to kill you, or you can sacrifice the poor damage of grenades for hatred - then they're all still fine. Those utilities just aren't worth it in Inferno.
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Posts: 1,591
Hm from 15-60 I used bola shot. Never even played with hunger once I got bola. I love watching the explosion animations of things dying and flying into the air and get split in half and heads roll all over the place.

Not to mention the 180% weapon dmg + 150% damage aoe makes it fantastic single target damage. In conjunction with impale with chemical burn, this is how I down bosses. Bola w/ imminent doom and impale w/chemcial burn.

In normal/nightmare the stun was great. In hell/inferno it doesn't seem to stun things as often for some reason, almost like they have resists. When they do get stunned it's not for very long. Would be viable if you had 4 DH all tossing stun bolas at a boss I guess.


Blizzard made mobs super resistant to stuns in Hell+ because of this very reason (along with barbs bash) because spammable stuns would wreck the fun of bosses. You could just sit there holding left-click and laugh while the boss died. Also Elemental Arrow + NT is going to be better than Impale/CB for bosses because of its OP double+ hits.
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Im sure this thread is buried by now, but i would like to add just one more thing regarding Evasive fire. Alot of players use Vault in their builds, for its mobility and escape characteristics. You can rune this skill with "Tumble" and reduce its Discipline cost on a successive use by 4 Discipline, from its initial cost of 8. So Vault for 8, then within 5 seconds Vault for 4 discipline.

The skill itself does nothing other than transport you to another location, 35 yards away.

Evasive fire can be rune'd with Displace, which increases the distance covered to 30 yards. Again it will do nothing other than transport you to another location, 30 yards away.

So its of course player discretion, as always, but is noteworthy as you can free up a Skill slot, have a somewhat limited Vault skill that moves you 5 less yards but always cost half the discipline of Vault, and is tied to a damage dealing generator that regens 4 hatred per shot, with a near instant travel projectile.

You do have to practice setting up attack angles, however, as with Vault you can mouse to your destination, Evasive Fire will always send you opposite direction, i.e. backwards. Flanking can be tricky, but even if you are rapidly firing and burning Discipline, by the time you spend 8 discipline, you will have traveled 60 yards. Thats the cost of a single Vault, and almost doubles the distance traveled for the same points.
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Thank god I'm not the only one using Evasive + Covering Fire... I've found this combo AMAZING. There's definitely room for more than one "best build" with DH, but for me Evasive+NT has been working great, it may not be the best DPS wise, but it's added benefits more than make up for it:

A) It defies the laws of physics, it shoots through walls and obstacles, and most importantly it shoots through those annoying walls that Champ and Elite mobs can throw up, this has saved my a$$ many times

B) It defies physics AGAIN, it's got no travel time, so especially when paired with a slow moving shot like NT or Ball Lightning, the ability to throw out an instant damage shot has again saved my !@#

C) It throws out more than 3 projectiles (or if it only throws three, the width of those shots is much greater than the animation makes it seem) I've fired it into a crowd where the three animations line up with three enemies, those three enemies got hit, but so did a couple between the arcs, it's like having a multi-shot that generates hatred instead of eating it

D) the jump back has saved my life FAR more times than it has killed me. With proper care (not just firing willy-nilly) you can really use it to your advantage (EX: throw down a caltrop or spike trap, fire off some NT, if something gets close fire Evasive.. you jump back, fire a few NT, enemy hits the trap, gets hit by NT and in the meantime you've thrown down another trap... rinse, repeat) If you do get trapped where you can't (don't want to) jump back just use NT.

The only time I switch out Evasive is against some bosses where there isn't room to, or you don't want to jump back (Butcher with the fire floors etc). But I find Evasive is great for clearing out mobs, especially once you loose the AOE from Ball Lightning when you get NT.

*Caveat* I'm currently on Act IV Hell and this build is working like a charm, I may revise when I get to Inferno... we'll see
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86 Blood Elf Warlock
12030
Posts: 1,717
I used Bola from the level i got it until I hit inferno.
I continued using it for the first half or so of act 1 and then realized that it just wasn't cutting it, the delay can and will make a difference between life and death.

which is too bad since hungering arrow is the only real option in inferno, so much for blizzard creating a game that doesn't force us to play a certain way in order to beat it fully.
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85 Gnome Mage
3940
Posts: 127
05/29/2012 09:26 AMPosted by Barghest
Evasive Fire/Covering Fire rocks, try it out. Never seen anyone using it, though. People don't like 125% damage across 3 mobs, 4 Hatred returned, instant hit (no missile), goes through Waller walls and more? Their loss :p


^This guy has it 150% correct, I use this same build... it's freaking nasty and I'm completely owning everything from normal mobs to rares and champion packs with this build in inferno... it is your loss if you are not using this. This should be a cookie cutter skill for every good DH build... nuff said.
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Posts: 547
I use hungering (devour) exclusively because it is homing. This is almost essential when kiting mobs off screen.
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Posts: 150
This is what I used until I caved and switched to Displacement, the 30 yards makes a huge difference when kiting with Tactical Advantage. :\ Otherwise, Covering Fire is an amazing rune.
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Hungering Arrow is my favorite because it allows you to easily hit enemies off-screen, and it auto-aims. While I do have good aim, it's also nice to have the luxury of being lazy about it. I used Entangling Shot with the 4 slows rune for the longest time, but that was before I turned on the detailed tooltips that showed the damage. If you want the slow and are willing to kill monsters more slowly, then use it. Bola Shot... I don't know. I tried it only a little bit, but I didn't like the delay on the damage.
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