Diablo® III

Rolling a monk?.. Don't..

05/23/2012 11:38 AMPosted by Bigjay
These threads are unnecessary stop feeding the masses false information about a class. The class works fine, the class plays fine, this is an L2p issue.

We have already established that you are only halfway through Nightmare and have not a slightest clue what everyone is talking about.

Monk is amazing and super fun from Act I Normal to Act II Hell. After that it's just slow, boring and stupid.
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@mechler: Great post, but I wonder how you came up with this figure:

40% dodge is a realistic end-game number


Maybe you're talking about unbuffed, but even then, I'm nearly that high already, and I would consider myself very poorly geared.


Sorry, I meant just what you get from your dexterity. I think anyone in inferno can eclipse 40% pretty quickly.

That starts to change when you realize that you can't realistically use the dodge mantra, you have to start sacrificing dexterity for vitality/reduction/etc., and you start replacing abilities that grant additional dodge because you can't get in range to use them without dying.
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05/23/2012 11:41 AMPosted by Alchemy
Or you could, you know, play the class you want to play regardless of the difficulty level.

I want to play a melee class. But there's no such thing in Diablo III past mid-Hell.

What the !@#$ happened to just having fun with the game?

Indeed, what did happen to the fun? Major design flaws happen.
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05/23/2012 12:09 PMPosted by Antharion
Awesome, now can I borrow 5mil so I can buy all those spirit regen items that have decent stats too?


Play the game and get 5 million? Wait till real cash auction house and spend real money on items? You have to assess what your time is worth here.

This game has been out for a week and you want to have the best gear and kill all the best stuff right away? I want a personal jet...I am working on it.
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05/23/2012 12:38 PMPosted by Kaje
And it's supposed to take ages. I don't think Blizzard intended for everyone to have the perfect gear setup within a week after the game out...


I don't think they intended for you to beat inferno within a week of release either...
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100 Human Paladin
16285
Posts: 15
Frustrated monk #149230985 here. Currently at Act IV of Hell.

Sums up how I feel:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u8CBbeSAjVo

The heals from MoH did not deserve to be nerfed. It's not as though millions of people we're facerolling inferno mode as monks.

I needed those heals to actually participate in the fight and contribute to cc'ing/damaging enemies as well as keeping the rest of my group alive.

Now I just run around cycloning/blinding people then running away while my 3 ranged friends kill everyone. AKA dead weight.

I don't understand nerfing classes to the ground in a Co-op VS AI game.
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Quite frankly i dont mind the high difficulty or the fact that other classes can clear inferno faster or better than me or the fact that i need to farm gear to do inferno. WHat really ticks me off its the fact that im forced to use a shield and build my character in a way that quite frankly is neither fun nor functional. We are forced to use one build to even have a chance to do anything in inferno and even then it boils down to attacking while serenity is up and then running away for 15 seconds till its up again. The rare mobs are also not difficult , since difficult usually entails a requirement of skill and/or knowledge ; they are cheap they have abilities that are deadly and they can spam them all day long , with no cooldown and seemingly with no apparent pattern a monkey can beat them if he runs and kites long enough so please stop telling me to learn how to play or that is supposed to be difficult.

Sincerely a very dissapointed lvl 60 monk

P.S srry for the long rant but its becoming quite ridiculous at this point.
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Here's a fun fact that all monks have to face.

We do not regenerate spirit.

We can take abilities and equip items that help to regenerate spirit. We can attack monsters to gain spirit, as well.

I just died to a pack of jailer desecrator waller fast monsters in Act I Inferno. Upon resurrecting, I have enough spirit to enable my mantra.

If I attack the monsters that I have died to 8 times now, I would have to do so without Sweeping Wind active, stop casting any other spells if I did manage to cast Sweeping Wind, or struggled to keep Sweeping Wind active so that I don't have to spend 75 spirit on it again. Why is that a struggle? Doesn't it refresh the timer if you attack? Yes, but I can only attack from melee range. If I'm in melee range and my options are attacking to gain spirit, and... well that's the list.

You get the idea.

Instead, I can turn on as much spirit regeneration as I can. This means giving up a passive slot that would increase my armor, give me health when I spend spirit, or cause my targets to deal less damage. I give up a passive slot. I gain 2 spirit per second. That's 1/25th of recasting my mantra which is my best stay-alive spell.

I can switch the rune on my mantra to give me 3 more spirit per second. This is also insignificant and comes with the opportunity cost of lowering how much I heal even more or taking away my ability to apply a shield that scales with my health pool (and thus the health pool of the enemies that I am facing).

I can put on a helm that I paid 400,000g for that has less vitality and no socket. This gives me another 1.97 spirit per second.

I can weild a weapon that gives another 1.83 spirit per second. It has less damage, sure, but I can't deal damage if I'm dead. I can't avoid being dead if I don't have spirit. I can't spend spirit unless I can melee. I can't melee because I'll die without being able to use abilities. The abilities cost spirit. I'm in a catch 22 but at least I'm generating...

I'd equip another weapon but I only have two hands and one of them has to hold on to this shield that is giving me a little less than 8% damage mitigation. I need that just for the chance that it will matter.

I'm up to 8.9 spirit per second. That's almost enough to cast blind (Blinding Flash) or invulnerability (Serenity) which are each on a 15 second cooldown. At 10 spirit, it's kind of a mystery why these abilities have a cost at all. They are on a cooldown and are the only way that we can get back in range and start getting spirit generated again.

No. You're right. This is fine. I'll just... uh... Let's see. I can try to kite s-- no that won't work. Maybe I'll just farm a few hundred thousand gold a day until I can afford an 8,000,000g piece of armor that will let me... oops, it isn't going to fix any of this. It will help to be certain.

I'm honestly flabbergasted at what I'm supposed to do. I'm willing to admit that I'm a lot worse than other players here. I could not be more sure that my gear is bad.

I just want some ideas. I'm not even quitting my class or trying to whine. I think I have a legitimate complaint and I am trying to give my sound reasoning so that other people can give me input on how to overcome my deficiencies.

Is any monk out there doing anything other than running away while their Mystic Ally attacks and only swooping in to cast Blinding Flash or get in a few hits when they can cast Serenity? Is anyone using neither of those? What about Mantra of Healing? What the hell is going on here?
Edited by mechler#1710 on 5/23/2012 1:33 PM PDT
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05/23/2012 01:26 PMPosted by mechler
Is any monk out there doing anything other than running away while their Mystic Ally attacks and only swooping in to cast Blinding Flash or get in a few hits when they can cast Serenity? Is anyone using neither of those? What about Mantra of Healing? What the hell is going on here?


Dump your sweeping wind critical hit massive spirit regen healer build and think outside the box. Let me give you an example...granted you will still need tons of life and tons of damage regardless.

http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/monk#agifhX!bYZ!ZYZYab

You can also swap around a lot of the runes here. Like sweeping winds...ever think to pick up the 10 second rune? 10 seconds = 80 spirit with regen items...just saying.
Edited by Immortal#1146 on 5/23/2012 1:35 PM PDT
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The sad thing about kids like OP are that some people won't decide to play as a monk because of topics like that.
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05/23/2012 01:39 PMPosted by Wilsonowy
The sad thing about kids like OP are that some people won't decide to play as a monk because of topics like that.


Sad for him, good for us.
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I cant understand why something being harder is worse somehow. Im sure the game is not meant to be beat in 2 weeks and for most of us hte time constraints impossed on us by life make this impossible anyhow. I agree that if you cant hack it go reroll and it will make the rest of us look better when we acheive it finally.
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80 Blood Elf Priest
2335
Posts: 7
05/23/2012 01:33 PMPosted by Immortal
Is any monk out there doing anything other than running away while their Mystic Ally attacks and only swooping in to cast Blinding Flash or get in a few hits when they can cast Serenity? Is anyone using neither of those? What about Mantra of Healing? What the hell is going on here?


Dump your sweeping wind critical hit massive spirit regen healer build and think outside the box. Let me give you an example...granted you will still need tons of life and tons of damage regardless.

http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/monk#agifhX!bYZ!ZYZYab

You can also swap around a lot of the runes here. Like sweeping winds...ever think to pick up the 10 second rune? 10 seconds = 80 spirit with regen items...just saying.


Have tried a dodge build, doesn't really work. Why, you ask? Simple: Desacrater, Plagued, Molten, and Arcane Enchanted. Any one of these modifiers on a blue mob will RUIN you. You can have 100% chance to dodge, and still die in 2 seconds from standing in the way or on one of these things.

Walk out of the way, you say? Jailer Waller Arcane Enchanted Desacrater blue mob has a few things to say to you.

Also, 10 seconds = 10 deaths if you're trying to deal damage to an inferno mob, just saying.
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im not complaining about difficulty. im still in NM. my only problem is, is this talk of me as a monk, going to have to use a shield/dodge guild to survive? is this completely true? if it is, im gonna re-roll. i didnt roll a monk to become a tank. i want a melee DPS, with the mantras and a sprinkle of healing. thats it. D...P...S. not meatshield for ranged chars.
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90 Night Elf Druid
9180
Posts: 194
poster is right I want to reroll mine as any win button ranged class in the game. This toon at 55 will go no more. Really I mean what the hell are you guys doing?? If you barke a class that bad gave them something else our damge is the lowest BY FAR IN THE whole game and now we cant even help keep the groups alive WHY would any one want to group with one?????
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Walk out of the way, you say? Jailer Waller Arcane Enchanted Desacrater blue mob has a few things to say to you.


You knew what was coming... walk out of the way...when you get jailed, use your serenity.
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To be sure, I'm not complaining about difficulty, either. I am really happy that inferno is challenging me. I feel like the tools that I have don't answer the questions that the game is posing, though. I know there must be more to it and that's why I'm here laying out my thoughts as clearly as I can so that someone can help me break on through to the other side.

I'm not re-rolling either. I love monk. I'm here to solve this, not complain until we get buffs.

I appreciate the call to think outside the box. I've been trying out Sweeping Wind [Master of Wind] lately and enjoy the flexibility it gives me in running away but being able to keep my Sweeping Wind active because I have four more seconds to get back in and get it going again.

Here are some builds that I've tried, for the record.

http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/monk#UdiXQY!YcX!ZbacZa

The idea here is that I'm running around and chain casting Mantra of Healing as often as possible so that I keep regenerating life.


  • Way of the Hundred Fists [Blazing Fists] - I like this ability because I don't have great boots with movement speed and this helps me keep moving. It also increases my damage a bit and gives me more damage out of the short time that I can be in attacking out of each cycle of cooldowns.
  • Dashing Strike [Quicksilver] - This helps me get back in when the cooldowns are up without having to creep closer. It is also a way of darting to the other side of a group of chasing elites so that I can start kiting in the other direction and use a smaller area so as to avoid pulling more camps. The rune is because I need more spirit. I should also mention that I play with another person often and this is my best ability for peeling enemies off of t hem.
  • Sweeping Wind [Master of Wind] - This is my favorite ability on flavor. That said, it is also good at dealing damage while you sweep around kiting and helps to clean up trash that may accumulate. I use the duration rune because it can be difficult to keep active with only 6 seconds of uptime and spending 75 more spirit is not an option.
  • Serenity [Ascension] - Not having this has been tough when I've tried it. In Inferno difficulty, there are inevitably going to be times when you're having an otherwise great run on a pack of elites but you just get caught in the wrong spot by a waller or jailer or a set of phasebeasts with knockup start to juggle you. This is a way out of that mess. It is also necessary as a way to get back in and generate more spirit since you can always generate more than the 10 that it costs.
  • Mantra of Healing [Circular Breathing] - I just don't understand how people get by without this. Spirit is such a difficult resource and standing and going toe-to-toe just isn't an option. This is the best heal that we have, low as the amount might be, and it does a great job of helping to keep me alive through it's active bonus. I would use any mantra that generated me more spirit, to be frank, but I haven't been able to use the other ones that do without dying countless times.
  • Blinding Flash [Self Reflection] - This is a second functional serenity, but it also does wonders to get your kiting started or help reset the situation that the kite has gotten to. Dashing Strike followed by Blinding Flash lets you quickly regain control of a kite that may have run in to trouble. This also helps with peeling enemies off of the demon hunter that I duo with.
  • Passive: Transcendence - This is present to act as more healing. With Mantra of Healing costing 50 mana, it heals for an additional 3100 each time you cast it and gives you a bit of survivability since you have to continue chugging spirit anyway.
  • Passive: Chant of Resonance - This is just +2.00 spirit regeneration per second for me. I would use it if it did not have the duration at all. This build focuses on spirit throughput and this just works toward that end.
  • Passive: Seize the Initiative - You have to lower the incoming damage somehow. Dodge from dexterity isn't helpful when the attack is going to kill you.


I think it was helpful to write that out. In writing Chant of Resonance especially, I realized that my build focus has centered almost always around spirit throughput. I am just churning through spirit as fast as I can in an effort to stay alive. I'll try to write out another build that I've been trying that focuses on staying in the fight and mitigating damage through short buffs granted by abilities. This is probably an obvious build, so don't look forward to it, but writing it out has been a helpful exercise if nothing else.

Anyone have thoughts on what I'm doing here?
Edited by mechler#1710 on 5/23/2012 2:38 PM PDT
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85 Worgen Rogue
4015
Posts: 112
you realize that you can find gear with spirit regen right?
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85 Worgen Rogue
4015
Posts: 112
the only change id make is to swap sieze the initiative for one with everything, then stack a bunch of one resist... resist all form armor + resist all from resists + dodge chance = survive.. ive also tried out a dodge oriented build. am able to bring it up to around 70% with diminishing returns, though i think blizz needs to have that only affect dodge from dex.
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05/23/2012 02:34 PMPosted by Khadaj
you realize that you can find gear with spirit regen right?
I'm wearing 4 spirit regeneration on gear. I would love it if that felt like enough. It has not. :(

05/23/2012 02:38 PMPosted by Khadaj
the only change id make is to swap sieze the initiative for one with everything, then stack a bunch of one resist
I have 200 physical resist right now and have tried using One With Everything. I do like it, especially in principal. It is an interesting way to focus a build, etc. I've been through Skeleton King on Inferno and was actually using One With Everything in place of Chant of Resonance during that valor buff.

200 is low, I know, but I don't have a lot of gold and I don't know how to work on getting a lot more, frankly.
Edited by mechler#1710 on 5/23/2012 2:42 PM PDT
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