Diablo® III

Looking for arguments: Against life on hit

That's interesting. Good info, tenlaar. The problem for me is that I have no idea how many HPs a level 60 character actually has. I don't even know if I'll make it to 60. I'm just kind of duffing my way through and looking for a build I can figure out without having to use spreadsheet formulas. Not that I'm against spreadsheet formulas, I can see the fun in that style of play, it's just not my brand of fun. I'd rather read the results of the spreadsheet gurus and modify whatever edge they recommend to suit the look of my toon and the style of my toon.
Edited by Rinkydink#1796 on 5/29/2012 3:26 AM PDT
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Arguments against life on hit?

In D3 hardcore you have 2 classes of mobs.

A) mobs that don't matter (pretty much everything in normal diff if you are wearing half-decent gear)
B) mobs that may become dangerous because of affixes and/or because they take away >20% of your HP with one single hit.

It doesn't really matter how you kill type A. However, when facing type B I try to kill it without taking too much damage. If something is spamming arcane wards all over the place or vortexing me into pools of poison/lava, I will most likely NOT be willing to solve this issue by standing there and maximizing my life stealing DPS. I will try to minimize the damage they can do. So I will kite and maximize my DPS while they cannot hit me (because their abilites are on cd or because they are stunned). So I don't think sacrificing DPS and armor for additional tanking power is a good choice.
But that's theorycrafting, I haven't tried it. Might be viable to simply stand in that pool of poisonous lava and DPS/lifesteal away if geared properly. Especially for melee classes (who suck at kiting/avoiding damage anyway).

Apart from that:
Life steal % has some modifiers for higher difficulties, so you will get less from that on NM and above.
Life per hit does not have difficulty modifiers and is therefore superior. However life per hit is modified by the skills that use it. Frenzy's life per hit gives 80% of the weapons life per hit stat. Cleave gives 30% x Number of targets hit.
Edited by pazA#1741 on 5/29/2012 5:15 AM PDT
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05/28/2012 01:19 PMPosted by Rinkydink
Thanks Poach. Yeah, I pretty much just started NM and I'm seeing that the life on hit has lost its utility. I'm going to look into life steal or switch to a bow and shield and work on upping my dmg. I actually feel like I'm at square one again.


I found life on hit as still useful in later difficulties. It still seems to negate damage reflection in nightmare.

I never found it good for healing, but I did find it useful to avoid almost killing myself every time I faced reflect.

Still a decent stat if you can find a weapon with +30-60 life on hit in Nightmare. Just don't go overboard and prioritize it over damage stats.
Edited by Leliana#1393 on 5/29/2012 5:21 AM PDT
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Might be viable to simply stand in that pool of poisonous lava and DPS/lifesteal away if geared properly. Especially for melee classes (who suck at kiting/avoiding damage anyway).



My monk has enough life on hit to completely tank plague, and to buy me several extra seconds in molten and fire chains. Desecration is the only thing that i really have to get out of asap. Once you stack it high enough, its deffinitely viable.
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Hardcore brothers and sisters,

Thank you so much for your perspective on the matter. I think I see with clarity now.

  • Normal difficulty it seems very good but once your health pool gets very high say like 15k even with 100 health per hit you won't see much good.
  • If you get stunned or feared it does nothing.
  • If you are kiting it is doing nothing.
  • It is most effective with very fast rapid attacks. Once damage scales upwards percentage health leech is more potent.
  • .
    I think this is the full summary.


    actually this is not right, at least not according to kripp. like, you don't need super attack speed to make life/hit better. % life leech is so very hard to achieve an influential level acts 13-16 when difficulty cuts it so heavily

    it's more like.. enjoy that 1.8% life leech on your level 27 bow while you have it for cruising the end of normal difficulty while it's still 1.8%

    life/hit still the best, even act 16 of 16 (inferno a4) he says

    just wait on the higher numbers per hit; affixes need to improve just like 6% movement speed and +21 vitality don't cut it

    % life steal is cut heavily on the 3 difficulties NM / Hell / Inferno

    it's -30%, -50%, and -80%. (or 0.7x, 0.5x, and 0.2x, respectively)

    it also CAPS at 3%. so a leech stacker is going to work really really hard on many gear slots just to achieve 3% steal. a fast cleaving / frenzy swinging barb is going to get so much more back if you keep up with your life/hit affixes. (like 850 - 1000 hp per hit is a later tier of that affix)

    yes this is cut as damage is cut and skills may only use like "85% weapon damage"
    say you have 1000 life / hit, and you use a skill hitting for 85% weapon damage; you will have that same -15% on your life / hit. however, there isn't (at least not as influential of one) a cap on life / hit

    sorry to come in and try to disagree with the thread; not trying to at all. just spreading what i had seen. hopefully clarification comes out
    Edited by supafrench#1240 on 5/29/2012 6:47 AM PDT
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    ^^ What was posted above me.

    Basically restated. Good post!

    Recent video from Kripp being referred to:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=33UDzGZTHPI&feature=autoplay&list=UUeBMccz-PDZf6OB4aV6a3eA&playnext=1
    Edited by Mercurial#1191 on 5/29/2012 6:34 AM PDT
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    Might be viable to simply stand in that pool of poisonous lava and DPS/lifesteal away if geared properly. Especially for melee classes (who suck at kiting/avoiding damage anyway).



    My monk has enough life on hit to completely tank plague, and to buy me several extra seconds in molten and fire chains. Desecration is the only thing that i really have to get out of asap. Once you stack it high enough, its deffinitely viable.


    That's at what level/difficulty? I might try this.
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    There is a big reason why you don't play life on hit builds in hardcore.

    **You die when sh** hits the fan**

    For everyday playing on softcore life on hit is fine, but in hardcore, you'll die because of it.

    If you are finding some enemies too strong and you are a heavy resist/armor build and you run because, the sh** has hit the fan, you have a good chance of getting out. Your resist and armor will help you.

    If you are finding some enemies too strong and you are a life leech build and you run because, the sh** has hit the fan, you have a POOR chance of getting out. Your life leech will do nothing as you run for your life.

    When you create a build in hardcore there should be 2 questions that enter your mind:
    1) Can it be viable in most situations and
    2) How does it handle the "Oh Sh**" moments

    Don't forget 2. This is hardcore. In softcore 1 > 2, in hardcore 2 > 1.

    My 2 cents.
    Edited by Ucross#1702 on 5/29/2012 7:39 AM PDT
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    did I say prioritize it ever ever ever over heavy resist / armor?

    c'mon Ucross, tune in, c'mon Man /TomJackson

    you take life / hit over percentage life leech. that's it. a comparison of those 2 affixes more or less

    no cra p you're going to need resists and armor. LET ME GUESS HP TOO?!

    c'mon
    Edited by supafrench#1240 on 5/29/2012 7:49 AM PDT
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    Sorry supafrench, never meant to offend. Just wanted to really point out that a life on hit build doesn't do much for you when you are overwhelmed running with your tail between your legs.

    That's a big negative that a lot of people might overlook and on hardcore it's extremely important.

    Obviously resists and armor is important, but if you are RELYING on life on hit to keep you alive (at the cost of more vitality, armor, resists, etc.) you are in more trouble when things go wrong.

    Just wanted to shed some light.
    Edited by Ucross#1702 on 5/29/2012 7:42 AM PDT
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    Well I think it's important you mention the defensive stats in a way, yeah cause they all go hand-in-hand, ya know

    you need to be able to stand against 3 or 4 dust imps in a2 cleaving and getting 3 or 4 hits of life every swing; you don't want heavy damage and heavy leech. you want damage mitigation and enough nice and convenient leech (gotta kill the demons anyway) to keep you topped off during all the nq trash like shadow vermin and dust imps; then use your more meticulous skills, micro, and cooldowns for the elite monsters

    that's going to take lots of armor. probably 2.7k - 3.3k armor for barbarians by Belial on Nightmare even; go as close to 5 digits later on to really sit in there in the heat of things and use that life per hit. gotta hit to get the life, absolutely
    Edited by supafrench#1240 on 5/29/2012 7:54 AM PDT
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    With a monk in later difficulties you really need a shield...the main reason being you can reach +15% life with it - in addition to gaining an extra 900+ AR. This is huge. Stack a +15% life shield on a monk that already has 40K HP is 6000health...Thats a !@#$ton of health for 1 item.
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