Diablo® III

Does the Witchdoctor seem out of place?

You know what would be awesome? Give us an Invulnerability rune for Zombie dogs. Or a Molten dogs rune. Or a fire link Zombie dogs rune. Or the Vortex rune, magma trails.

why do the bad guys get all the awesome skills? :(
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05/30/2012 04:15 PMPosted by PVStar
Is it because he's black?


No it is because of the way they have it wide legged running and hunched down all the time. It looks plain stupid IMHO. Atleast the female does this, not sure of the male character.
Edited by RipperNyght#1509 on 6/1/2012 12:32 PM PDT
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100 Dwarf Warrior
11285
Posts: 39
I want to make one, so tempted to name him Endugu :(


dats why mine is named :)

As a secondary response, I..LOVE the WD. I have played each class and explored a lot of their skills/builds and syles of gear and the WD doesn't feel out of place at all to me. They are actually a refreshing class to play. everything is different from other RPG characters, the other classes get stuffy after a while. How many different ways can you design a wizard/warrior/templar/ranger. Its basically the exact same thing in a new wrapper. this WD is very refreshing to a longterm RPG player like me


except that hell and beyond 90% of those builds that seem fun and cool go out the window, and you become pigeon holed into the same 6 or so spells, with little room for diversity.

i was excited to play wd after seeing all the pets and abilities they had. i loved my necro and druid in d2 because of the pets. and i used my wd pet spec thru most of nightmare, but after that it became very clear that they had little to no use beyond that. i understand the need to keep having to recast pets, but they should at least last closer to the cd of the spell, instead of being one shot on contact with anything. they should have a decent base durability, aswell as scaling like any spell so you can feel the impact of getting a new piece of gear.

but thats not all the witch doctor problems by any means.
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I find it ridiculous that people in this thread are suggesting that WD pets scale on things they already scale on.

They already scale with STr, Dex, Armor, Dodge, physical resistance, thorns, and can proc on-hit effects (burning dogs' aoe procs on-hits as well, generating a ton of hits). Players are still testing other defensive stats.

Note that this is not a comment on balance, but a recommendation that the people commenting on balance understand the dogs before they comment.

https://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/5271500086?page=1


some of that is obviously wrong

with nothing the garg died in 4 hits, and stacking vit died in 8 hits, but its said that the garg does nto scale with vit so... yeah... i dont really see that thread as viable

if they dont scale with vit, i very much doubt they scale with armor resists and dodge
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06/01/2012 12:28 PMPosted by Honor
ur spec prolly doesnt have a mana nuke, and ur prolly not in inferno where you actually hafta use the nuke enough times to make u go oom several times over


This is true, but my post was more in response to people suggesting that mana cost be removed from primaries. WD mana regen isn't that slow! Besides, that's part of the sacrifice of having a large pool of mana (compared with the fixed arcana/spirit/fury/etc. of the other classes), which is partly what makes WD a different playing experience.
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Posts: 1,666
06/01/2012 10:41 AMPosted by Adrenaline


While the intent is for witch doctors to re-summon Zombie Dogs and Gargantuan fairly often, we agree that pets aren't living long enough in higher difficulty levels. Of course, the harder difficulties are supposed to be more challenging, but we don't think it's fun gameplay to cast Zombie Dogs, watch them die almost instantly, wait for the cooldown to reset, re-cast Zombie Dogs, watch them die almost instantly...etc. And this is happening even when players are wearing pretty reasonable gear.

We're looking into ways to improve witch doctor pet survivability at later levels, but we don't have any clear plans to share just yet. One thing we're considering, though, is having pets scale with your Vitality (which they currently do not do).


Making them scale with vitality is a horrible idea with the state of Inferno the way it is. The WD gets two shot (SV) in 99% of most cases, so stacking vitality over intellect is not a good idea.

If there is a decision to scale them with a stat, make them scale with the stat that matters the most, intellect.


Really? I have crap gear and those spear guys in inferno act 3 hit me for 12-17k normally. I have a bigger issue with molten puddles instantly killing me than mobs killing me (and those damn soul lashers).

My Gargantuan survives quite nicely too. If you stack enough resists and armor, you can do pretty well. I also use jungle fortitude passive and I'm not having too much of an issue.

I think the issue arises with the lack of scaling of vit and the general weakness of 20% increase health on the zombie handler passive.
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I do think it was kind of stereotypical to make the only black character into a frog throwing witch doctor. Makes them seem somewhat primitive compared to the more refined wizard. Of course they did make white people into giant barbarians so maybe there is a fair amount of undeserving poop being slung around.
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2 Draenei Priest
0
Posts: 158
06/01/2012 10:24 AMPosted by Lylirra
I think you'd have less hating on the WD, in general, if our zombie dogs and gargantuan didn't require fairly specific and fairly rigid gearing requirements to be viable.


While the intent is for witch doctors to re-summon Zombie Dogs and Gargantuan fairly often, we agree that pets aren't living long enough in higher difficulty levels. Of course, the harder difficulties are supposed to be more challenging, but we don't think it's fun gameplay to cast Zombie Dogs, watch them die almost instantly, wait for the cooldown to reset, re-cast Zombie Dogs, watch them die almost instantly...etc. And this is happening even when players are wearing pretty reasonable gear.

We're looking into ways to improve witch doctor pet survivability at later levels, but we don't have any clear plans to share just yet. One thing we're considering, though, is having pets scale with your Vitality (which they currently do not do).


<3
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I hate this class right now. Inferno is such a PITA.
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After coming from a DH lvl 60 Inferno Act1, i started a WD HC, now lvl 17...the similarities are astonishing in how they stagger...Long range DPS for both with triple shot blowgun=fast attack Bows(similar enough),caltrops(+)=grasp of the dead(-),Smoke Screen(-)=Spirit walk(+), they both have a fear capability, WD uses bodies to keep baddies away, DH uses mobility to keep baddies away, WD have Int for resist, DH have Dex for Dodge, Offhands offer similar buffs for which build you are doing for each class...

there may be more but i am only lvl 17 for the WD ATM sooo...
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Posts: 416
have the pets scale w/ intel
boom
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Posts: 673
theres more to act 3 in D2 than durance of hate

shocking i know
Edited by Zelgo#1840 on 6/1/2012 12:51 PM PDT
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While the intent is for witch doctors to re-summon Zombie Dogs and Gargantuan fairly often, we agree that pets aren't living long enough in higher difficulty levels. Of course, the harder difficulties are supposed to be more challenging, but we don't think it's fun gameplay to cast Zombie Dogs, watch them die almost instantly, wait for the cooldown to reset, re-cast Zombie Dogs, watch them die almost instantly...etc. And this is happening even when players are wearing pretty reasonable gear.

We're looking into ways to improve witch doctor pet survivability at later levels, but we don't have any clear plans to share just yet. One thing we're considering, though, is having pets scale with your Vitality (which they currently do not do).


With the WD, I think that the intention of summoning pets is to have them take the damage, so wouldn't it make more sense for intelligence to buff the pets all around?


i think you (and everyone else suggesting they scale with int) mean to scale with resists

they already scale with our dmg, and there are other ways besides int to get resists

pets should scale with our max hp (not just vit bc there are other ways for us to increase our max life), resists, armor, and dodge (and obv wep dmg, but thats already happening)

doing it vit or int rules out viability of builds
Edited by Honor#1370 on 6/1/2012 12:52 PM PDT
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WD shaking look is awesome.
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Weak pets and too many close range skills for a class that doesn't feel designed to be viable at close range seem to be the standout problems for me so far. I don't care for the art/lore either, given that the class mechanics are the spiritual successor to the necro, which I much prefer over the WD, but I'm willing to overlook it if its fun. Also, listening to "AYAAAH, AAAAH, AYAAAH, AAAAH" turns me off of a lot of abilities; I won't use frogs because I get sick to death of hearing his "casting shout".

There's something else, mechanically, that doesn't feel right. Every other class seems to have this sort of feedback in the skills that makes it feel connected in a cause/effect relationship. It seems to me to be missing for the WD for most things. I'm not sure if it's that the incredibly polished audio and visuals in this game are perhaps not as well done for the WD, or if the WD skills in general just don't feel as good because they are so passive in nature, or if it's a combination of both. I don't even know if it can be fixed given the nature of the class.

Examples:
Spiders, frogs, dogs, garg, hex, BBV and fetish army all have a natural disconnect because you yell(or throw a jar) and they just come out and do their thing. This is really inherent to a pet class, but I'm pointing out that it takes most of the substance out of a lot of abilities. Not to mention that they aren't all that great at surviving and don't deal a lot of damage as has been discussed.

Many of the more effective skills are very indirect or ethereal which removes the feeling of having any impact; clouds, ghosts, swarms of bugs, and magic circles on the ground. Poison dart... it really doesn't matter how much damage this does or what effects it has, you're blowing darts out of a tube and that doesn't feel heroic at all. Some skills feel ok, but of what's left there are too many that don't work well due to dangerous range requirements or apparent lack of effectiveness.

I certainly haven't tried(and haven't even unlocked) every combo yet, but so far, it's just very lackluster. I thought for certain it would be my favorite class since the necro was, but it's turning out to be the least. I hope it gets better, as I really want to enjoy it.
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06/01/2012 10:24 AMPosted by Lylirra
We're looking into ways to improve witch doctor pet survivability at later levels, but we don't have any clear plans to share just yet. One thing we're considering, though, is having pets scale with your Vitality (which they currently do not do).


Its nice to know that pets are being looked at, but I think this feature should have been there from the start.
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I find it ridiculous that people in this thread are suggesting that WD pets scale on things they already scale on.

They already scale with STr, Dex, Armor, Dodge, physical resistance, thorns, and can proc on-hit effects (burning dogs' aoe procs on-hits as well, generating a ton of hits). Players are still testing other defensive stats.

Note that this is not a comment on balance, but a recommendation that the people commenting on balance understand the dogs before they comment.

https://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/5271500086?page=1


some of that is obviously wrong

with nothing the garg died in 4 hits, and stacking vit died in 8 hits, but its said that the garg does nto scale with vit so... yeah... i dont really see that thread as viable

if they dont scale with vit, i very much doubt they scale with armor resists and dodge

In order to stack Vit you need to put on armor.

Look at the stats he lists:

Lvl: ~33 | Str: base | Dex: base | Int: base | Vit: 574 | Armor: ? (39.78% DR) | Physical Resistance: 11 (6.03% DR)

Now look at the DR on his Dexterity test:

Lvl: ~33 | Str: base | Dex: 535 | Int: base | Vit: base | Armor: 1134 (40.75% DR) | Physical Resistance: 11 (6.03% DR)

Notice anything? They have the same DR (later he does actually confirm that pets can dodge by using a prolonged number of hits test). The pet is scaling form the armor in the Vit test not the Vit. His thread is as far as I can tell 100% accurate. Next time actually read some numbers.
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I play monk, but I think the witch doctor has the best flavor design. The way he moves around, variety and awesomeness of spell animations, the sounds he makes. His kit seems to offer a wide variety of game play styles but I guess most of them probably aren't viable in inferno unfortunately.

I don't see why pets wouldn't scale with all of your stats, not just vit... it only makes sense, diablo is so gear-centric it would be completely appropriate to have your pet remain about as effective at any stage of gear.
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I do not have much experience at all with the WD, however I made one the other day for some more temporary storage space. I Will end up playing her later, as they seem interesting from what I have seen whilst progressing up to inferno thus far (lol@ the wave of bears thing ;D).

One thing that I was thinking, while watching the intro WD scene, and when she sort of lurched up to the front gates of New Tristram and began talking to the guard was, "What, this guy doesnt think that this random, obviously out of place, witch doctor, is kind of weird to just be showing up out of nowhere, with no reaction whatsoever?" o.O

Just thought it was kinda funny. :)
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