Diablo® III

Boon of Protection Hotfix - 5/22

Posts: 427
This was the only thing that kept monks alive in hell hardcore. Taking this out will severely screw up hard core monk builds and probably create impossible scenarios for monks in hard core
It looks for me Blizzard's intent for healing was that your armor and resistance is your main healing stats. With the same amount of life healed (say 10 000), if you are being hit for 50k or for 5k - makes a huge difference. I can imagine that they want fixed numbers for healing (like each git/kill adds 400 amount of life) rather than damage percentage (2% per item? still does look sexy until you realize how much damage you should deal to reach that static value) and definitely not based on your HP total.

Unless you are, umm, barbarian, who heals like 1-5-8-10% per target hit/crit/per second and whatever. But barbarian healing works poorly, beacuase that large health pools/resistance levels do seem unreachable.

That is why they don't nef wizards - they do not have a scalable heal (haha), nor they have a heal based on their HP total.

I can understand why separate DPS, HP pool and healing stats is a good thing to do - you can't actualy scrap any one of these categories to the ground and start stacking the rest (or a single one, in case of wizards, hint hint). Also the way multiplicative oarameters work, you should be exponentially more effective with balanced and high stats in each of these categories. Which in theory should allow us to clear inferno in legit way - it scales exponentially, and so do we. Buuuut - it doesn't seem to work really well as of now.
Posts: 9
Balancing stuff off of how it works in Inferno is hilarious because everyone is so mad from dying 9 million times to a rare pack when they come to post.
realy i completely lost faith that they will ever fix the monk.

good thing my wizard is allready lvl 40, even if they fix force armor i can atleast kite and play with a group without beeing completely useless 80% of the time.

what was the beta for realy?
Posts: 42
well right now i am in hell act 3 and the only reason i am doing ok is because i have a 433 2 handed pole doing doing dmg .90 sec which for a monk is sllllooooowww but if i can get a few good swings they are down in about 3 hits and champions are down later (except those darn chain mobs which no resistance can handle, esp when they triangle you) because i am finding no weapons for my monk and vendors are stuck at 160 dmg. I went on auction house and noticed there is only 1 two handed monk weapon type (speed 1.2) and for single handed equal to the pole's 400 dmg the price is 400k ... please fix this. add more monk only weapons and look at the hell stats. i can only imagine act 4 and then inferno. make the two handed 1.4 and up single weapon dps and resistance, because we are melee it sometimes impossible to run back abit to give yourself room so i think dex should increase your movement and attack speed .5% the monk is supposed to be fast. Almost like a constant frenzy. (CAN A MONK GET SOME LEECH..LOL)

<----- AND A NEW AVATAR
Edited by iekoMedia#1709 on 5/22/2012 11:10 PM PDT
As a monk currently in using this currently in inferno, this needs to be changed. It is just dumb, and isn't compelling gameplay.

That said, the Force Armor rune and Demon Hunter smoke screen need to be right behind it. Wizards gear DOWN on life to be MORE survivable is outright retarded, and is reminiscent of early D2 days in backwardness. Smoke Screen should have some form of cooldown or other limitation besides just discipline cost. It should also just make the DH INVISIBLE not INVINCIBLE.
Indifferent. I cleared normal through Act 1 Inferno without it, and not even skipping elite packs I ran into. When this skill unlocked for me and I tried it, I knew it would've been nerfed. So I avoided becoming dependent on it. Thus, said nerf came to pass as a great many monks shed a tear and cursed the heavens.

In all seriousness, I don't like how the monk plays in inferno. I've been forced to shift from dps to a straight up tank role. Barbs are in a similar boat as well. I didn't know this was a trinity game...
05/22/2012 10:07 PMPosted by Zoure
Will monks actually have a way to survive Inferno now? It's already hard enough with pure resist / vit gear, and now we can't even do this? :\
Edited by Derpalator#1149 on 6/2/2012 8:10 PM PDT
OP made it pretty clear that other fixes have been and are being implemented. The outcry may be unwarranted. I'm just glad to hear they have been working on things since the game launched.

If you check my post history you will see I've been ripping blizz pretty hard so don't call me a blizz drone.
Oh goodie. So the World of Warcraft class balance experience is spilling over into Diablo 3.

Because you guys did so well with this approach in your previous titles.
Glad I quit playing my monk in A4 hell. Hopefully I can farm inferno a bit on my wiz before its nerfed.
Indifferent. I cleared normal through Act 1 Inferno without it, and not even skipping elite packs I ran into. When this skill unlocked for me and I tried it, I knew it would've been nerfed. So I avoided becoming dependent on it. Thus, said nerf came to pass as a great many monks shed a tear and cursed the heavens.

In all seriousness, I don't like how the monk plays in inferno. I've been forced to shift from dps to a straight up tank role. Barbs are in a similar boat as well. I didn't know this was a trinity game...


agreed too much WoW in this one
Wait, so you're going to take it out entirely?


It's essentially being nerfed to the point of obsolescence until we can implement a new rune in its place in a future patch.


Bashiok,

I don't want to be a rager or QQ here but, it may be incoming.

1. Where is a PTR? If you think things are broken, spend at least a day testing an alternative balancing measure, don't just hotfix blindly effectively removing an ability, ESPECIALLY when you don't have a viable thing to replace it with...that is just poor planning and laziness.

2. I have a strong feeling that this is being done to slow the progression into inferno, which is okay I suppose, but let me point out one little option: HARDCORE. As a hardcore monk (yes yes I know you touched other classes but as rhyno said, since you pointed out one change, i will talk about that ONE change) I can BARELY survive hell, using this mantra/rune in my rotation. 35khp, 2k damage, one group of champions with stupid affixes and I would die if not for this combo. If you think its broken because people can go longer amounts of time in inferno before having to 'corpse jump' their way forward thanks to this, then by all means nerf it for softcore...but in hardcore its what makes a monk viable. I've tried every possible build in a lot of situations since hitting 54, and trust me, this is what makes me feel like I can PROLONG my death.

3.
All great and dandy but now the Monk class is dead late game until some unknown time... Now what?


We've made a number of class changes (again, intend to post about all of them tomorrow) and we want to monitor how those shake out before we attack any content difficulty changes. Our intent is to get classes a bit more aligned, verify no new issues crop up from these hotfixes, and then considering all the factors we'll look at content. It's not a preferred method of operating, I'd say, but just because the game is so new we don't think quick decisions on overall balance is the right approach when the metagame is still shifting.


You make no sense here Bash. So you want to see how things are going, and align classes, make sure they are kind of aligned, then look at content to see if it needs adjusting. And you "don't think quick decisions on overall balance is the right approach..." Umm, you sir just contradicted yourself quite well. Also, I think as far as class balance goes, worry more about that once PVP is implemented. Again: See post 1.

4. This is why blizzard needs to allow more of the game to be opened during betas, allow MORE people for beta testing, and take a more active role in the discussion of beta issues.

5. I understand how hard it is to try to make something like this, with such a huge public forum, and try to cater to everyone in the most balanced way possible. I am a programming major at U of M, so I understand the dev team's workload right now, and overall you guys are doing a decent job with the release so +1 for that.

TL;DR

You are not taking Hardcore play ability into consideration on at least THIS issue, as in hell there are NO other viable ways to progress solo, or with a friend or two, as a monk. I barely survive now, let alone after this -REMOVAL- of an ability...

Edit: Still, overall an amazing job you guys are doing, keep it up, I just wanted to give you my feedback on this change. Please don't think I don't understand how HARD it is for a game like Diablo to be released, and the community control that will follow its release.
Edited by xcloakedx#1352 on 5/22/2012 11:14 PM PDT
nergy armor with force armor can absorb way more damage than the 15% that rune gives and this is the ability you decide to post a hotfix about. it lasts 2 freaking sec. energy armor lasts for 120? wow?

yes i know thats not whats being done with energy armor force armor but it can be
In case someone didn't GET my sarcasm - you're going to let us know about hotfixes you've been doing for days now without any client saying hey please hotfix this... and without any patch notes?

I've never had a blizzard title wonk this close to the door - EVER. But you guys seem hellbent on achieving that in just a few weeks.
Community Manager
Posts: 3,387
Let me follow up by saying that in general class balance is an ongoing investigation, and by no means do we believe the game is now perfect, but we're also seeing evidence that supports (with a few nerfs to wizard and demon hunter) the monk and barbarian are not as bad off as they seem.

A large part of the monk and barbarian designs are based on survival models that mimic the concept of the class itself. The idea of a monk is that he survives through being agile and difficult to hit, and his healing and survival scales particularly well by focusing on mitigation stats like dodge, resists, and armor. The concept of the barb is that he survives through a huge health pool, and healing himself through damage (%life on hit stats), which is potentially a bit obvious with all the life return skills but can't be overstated.

The game is young, there were some skills that threw things out of whack, and we expect the landscape to settle out a bit more evenly. Or at least change again so we can continue to monitor the impact. Maybe we're wrong, maybe there's no current chance for monk or barbarian to compete with ranged, but our current suspicion is that's incorrect and until we know for sure we're not going to turn any dials.
You are not taking Hardcore play ability into consideration on at least THIS issue, as in hell there are NO other viable ways to progress solo, or with a friend or two, as a monk. I barely survive now, let alone after this -REMOVAL- of an ability...


i never use mantra of healing so it is possible to solo hell without it that i know but the logic of it just doesn't make sense to me
Posts: 191
Problems I have with this entire situation:

A) You admit to nerfing a skill into the ground so that it therefore becomes useless. And this will stand till your company's usual standard of "SOON" to be had replacement.

B) This skill, up until now, at least as far as i can tell, has been required for any kind of Inferno progression as a group. Which is your endgame. Of which only ranged classes can see any kind of progression in cause your two melee classes get 1-3 shotted but in order to get their resource they need to melee things but they get 1-3 shotted if they go anywhere near a mob to strike it.

C) Addressing class imbalances before other issues of which would seem to be of more importance. Or at least a great big blaring eyesore. Such as the fact that melee can not survive in Inferno profitably. (30k in repairs just to get 1k worth of loot, if that [exagerated example but i'm sure it's fairly accurate)

This all seems like a very large poor management decision. This is not something I would expect to come from such an established company.

@ Bash: I am sorry you are left with this basket of BS but you guys should known better.
Edited by Siege#1879 on 5/22/2012 11:18 PM PDT
85 Human Mage
5290
Posts: 304
I'm disappointed by this, and I don't even play Monk.

By removing abilities like this, and Force Armor/Diamond Skin combo, and Smoke Screen/Preparation and so forth, you are effectively making it impossible to play Inferno solo.

I don't give a damn if you think we should group up. The pure and simple fact is that I don't WANT to. I want to be able to finish the game on my own. I want to be able to obtain the top tier gear, on my own.

Diablo 2 was brilliant. it allowed you to do MF runs ON YOUR OWN.

Inferno is already overtuned. If you're going to remove the only abilities that let us play it, you most definitely need to lower the damage/health pools of monsters to make it possible to play that level of content, and you need to do it at the SAME TIME as the changing of our abilities.

EDIT: @BASHIOK: I can understand the statement of "We believe it's this way and until we're certain we're not going to do anything." but what more do you need to see? The playerbase has reached out to you and expressed their concern and dismay over several things, with some of the loudest of the criticism being that Barbarians and Monks simply cannot progress past Act 2 with any reliability, even after continuous farming of upgrades that should, theoretically, help them to do just that.
Edited by Motrax#1785 on 5/22/2012 11:19 PM PDT
If you take that away. The monk is dead on Inferno :(:(:(
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