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I have cleared the game in inferno, killed inferno Diablo solo and dealt with all elite mobs in act 3 & 4.
I have 2 copies of Diablo 3, one i use for us server and the other i use for on non-us server (initial idea was to be able to use real money auction house for both servers that i play on). The following is one of my character on the non-us server.
You do not understand the description but if you do a quick mapping it is easy to tell my statistics. Not outstanding individually but not easy to get a high score on all of them. Act 3 and act 4 require a strong all round build and that is how i work towards my statistics.
Key statistics unbuffed:
- 9% Elite mob damage reduction (* hidden from statistics tab, derived from items desc *)
- 51% Block
- 26.26% Melee reduced damage
- 42% Total life bonus
- 19% Crowd control reduction
- 3790 Block amount
- 74% Overall damage reduction
- 18% Dodge
- 900 Life regen per second
- 2.0 Attack speed
- 8500 Armor
- 17,600 Dps
- 53,000 Health
- 600 All resist
- 617 Heal on hit
- 516 Thorns
- Frenzy (Maniac or Sidearm) - sword & shield build rely on attack speed and life on hit.
- Revenge (Provocation) - Must have
- War Cry (Impunity) - 100% up time, impunity is too good, must have
- Furious Charge (Dreadnought) - 10s CD 8% regen, must have
- Leap (Iron Impact) - low CD 40% up time of 300% armor, too good to past
- Threatening Shout (Falter) - Now this one we have a choice, either this or Ignore pain. Personally i perfer 100% up time of threatening shout over the ignore pain's longer CD. Act 3 & 4 mobs hit hard, i don't mind a 100% uptime of 20% reduction. I hate dying during ignore pain's downtime. 2 hander build may use ignore pain and try to kill things in 7 seconds, not me.
- Superstition - I need this for all the laser, fire, pool on the floor...etc
- Tough as Nails - Need the high increase in armor
- Nerves of Steel - this or if i am not doing group play act 3 or 4 I use Berserker Rage
Overall the most important factors that i consider when choosing skills are: low CD, high uptime & consistency in defense / performance.
With the gear i look like this: http://i.imgur.com/Kl9NJ.jpg, http://i.imgur.com/cWjUh.jpg
My gear break down as requested, i translated the important statistics best i can, hope it helps:
- The Helm of Command (60str, 86 vit, 8% block. +12% life)
- Vile Ward (59 str, 156 vit, 25 all resist, 158 armor)
- Blackthorne's Medal (37 str, 70 health, 15% attack speed, 445 heal on hit, +11% life)
- Immortal King's Soul Cage (147 vit, 58 all resist, 299 armor)
- Immortal King's Forge (41 str, 68 all resist, 4% melee dmg reduction)
- Strongarm Bracers (161 str, 56 all resist, +3% life, 82 armor, 2% crit)
- String of Ears (145 str, 19 all resist, heal on hit 80, 113 armor, 20% melee dmg reduction)
- Band of Fallen Heroes (71 str, 83 vit, 60 all resist, 2% elite dmg reduction)
- Justice Lantern (4-8 dmg, 42 str, 105 vit, 11% block)
- Blackthorne's Breeches (81str, 78 vit, 60 all resist, +3% life)
- A 1011 dps rare sword (155str, 108 vit, 24% attack speed)
- Stormshield (32% block, 89 str, 66 all resist, +13% life, 4% melee dmg reduction, 5% elite dmg reduction)
- Blackthorne's Boots (79 str, 12% movement speed, 2% elite dmg reduction)
All legendaries expect the ~1000+ dps one hand sword. Rare are sometimes better than legendaries. But in many cases (apart from weapon, true "A-grade" legendaries are better than rare because of the fact that it normally has a few more statistics). Not to mention the "looks" of legendaries are more bad-a@@ on your character model.
I do NOT claim i have the best gear in the game but i think it is fair to say my gears are good. I am no best player in the world but i would consider myself skillful and i pretty much know what i am doing.
Through this topic i would like to share with you information on:
How well a top geared Barbarian can performed in D3 (using the gear and build "allowed" by the game up-to-date). Barbarian being inbalance or not, you decide for yourself.
This topic is NOT about:
- How good or bad i am, if i have the skills...etc. I am not looking for justification or anything like that.
- How good my gear is and how much gold i spent in the auction house (a lot, let's just leave it at that)
- How i could do better if i change my statistics and build like this and that
With these gears how well do I perform (again, this is to give my fellow Barbarians an idea, there are people who play better or worse than me that's not the point):
*** Solo Act 2 ***
Trash, elite pack & boss: You destroy everything
*** Solo Act 3 ***
Trash, elite pack & boss: I can tank them all with ease, some of the elite pack takes a bit of time to kill due to the fact that i only have 17k dps. But overall no problem here.
*** Solo Act 4 ***
Trash, elite pack & boss: Trash and Diablo is no problem in tanking and killing. Took me around 15- 18 minutes to kill Diablo (again with my silly 17k dps). Elite pack i can tank but i need to focus and move away from the high damage spells, that is not the problem, but they take "forever" to kill. With my low dps and the fact that being melee i have to avoid the spells and at the same time chase them to try to get in a hit or two...you can imagine how long it takes and how frustrating this process is. At the end i can kill most of them yes, did i enjoy the process? Def NOT. I kill elite pack in act 4 just to prove to myself if i can do it with the gear and build i have, but after that, i do not bother fighting these dudes as it is not enjoyable and the drops are crap anyway.
*** Group Play of 4 People Act 2 ***
Trash, elite pack & boss: You are the god tank, people loves you, everyone adds you as friend and you will be able to enjoy the game. You perform pretty much the same as if you are doing solo. You tank everything and you are able to kill everything on your own when the others are all dead. At the moment, i have most fun doing act 2 group play.
*** Group Play of 4 People Act 3 ***
Trash, elite pack & boss: Trash and boss no problem as usual. Elite pack, you need the other dps classes to be very good and be able to survive and kill things for you. Our under power dps will take forever to kill things and some packs are even impossible. I give you an example. I was in a group fighting this pack. The other members keep dying and coming back to life and dying again...while i tank these f$ckers for like 20 mins, the elite just keeps splitting and mirroring and being melee i have no aoe and i kept trying to locate the real dude and hit him but my single target dps is so low...anyway you get the picture. No fun at all, most frustrating gaming experience even, at the end as you guessed it the only choice left is to just run past that pack.
*** Group Play of 4 People Act 4 ***
Trash, elite pack & boss: same story as above really, trash and boss are manageable. Even with my gear and build i am not able to tank the elite pack with ease, you will struggle and you will die. I don't bother doing group play in act 4. The game is broken here, may be it is the difficulties, elite mobs design or in balance whatever.
Some more thoughts on the class
Some claim a 2-hander build is viable. In act 3 and 4, running around waiting for 2 min CDs and hope for the best is not my play style. I do not enjoy doing that, being able to tank and kill things very slowly is not fun either but i still prefer this over the other. Videos may show you 2-handers can kill things but it does not show the "die 10 times" incidents.
Even with best gears the game has forced me into play a tank as many have said. No need to further mention our 15k dps vs DH 220dps case because others have already made enough noise on that.
I keep hearing players asking me where i get my gears from and where to find them...etc. The main purpose of my topic is to let people know what they can expect (performance wise) even after getting all the gears they dreamed for. I do not want people to spend hours after hours farming gold and be disappointed at the end. Is your time and effort worth it? It is up to the individual to decide. For me am i happy with the end game Barbarian's performance? I understand we may not be able to dps like the range classes (150k - 220k dps), but considering the much higher gear requirement of a melee class (much more effort, time and gold needed to get them), when i do manage to acquire a full set of god like gear, I did hope that i can tank well and be able to do decent dps. Meaning i am happy with my defensive statistics but considering the mobs high hp i do think our dps can be a bit more reasonable (up from 15k to 40k - 50k let say, not on the same level as range, but remember i am talking about end game "A-tier" gears here).
I hope to let players know what to expect and whether it is worth their time and effort or not. And i hope Blizzard sees this and hopefully make further improvement to our class in the ways they think suitable....
Edited by Zero#1230 on 6/7/2012 3:44 AM PDT
I know this wasn't meant to be a talk about your gear, but your resists are kinda low. Your block chance is ungodly high, your armor is about where it should be, and your health seems fine, but your resists and life on hit could stand to be higher. Might be why you have some trouble further down the line?
Like you said though, your gear isn't top-tier, so as you improve I'm sure you would have fewer issues, though it can be frustrating that ranged classes can go through without issue while barbarian is so gear dependent, a grind is required, not an aid.
Thanks for your comment. I used to have higher hp and 800+ all resist, i lowered that to become more all round with more block and dps.
Remember a lot of people saying they die easy even with 1000 all resist and 60k hp. My point is that you need all of them: resist all, block and hp for act 3 & 4. Then you can tank well and will not die easy.
I lowered my all resist on purpose because like my post mentioned i am now fine with defense, my problem is i only have 17k dps and it takes too long and boring to kill elites in act 3 & 4 and takes the fun out of the game. That's my point.
By the way 17k dps is by no means low for our tank build, considered how high my other statistics are, other people are talking about 8k, 10k to 12k when they mentioned they have 60k hp and 800- 1000 all resist.
Thank you for this, I really needed a bench mark for what "great" gear looks like.
I'm sitting at 4mil and I'm wondering what I should start buying and I don't want to waste what little gold I have.
I know you said you didn't want to discuss what you spent in the auction house but I am genuinely curious about that, it looks like mid tier items are depreciating rapidly but I can't really tell if gold is depreciating faster than top tier items.
Edited by Rhyno#1681 on 6/3/2012 3:29 AM PDT
Thanks for your feedback, top of the line legendary items pretty much cost the same as before with no price drop, not that i notice anyway.
Asia server and us server auction house items pretty much cost the same too. I spend quite a bit of time at the auction checking for good deals. You will be surprised sometimes you see really good deals. Often late night during off peak hours you see amazing things pop up onto the auction house, you need to get them immediately then, by the time you wake up and check again they are gone for sure! Good luck!
Thanks Zero for a very informative post, very good scale to have so that I can compare myself and my equipment so that i can choose what end i need to strive equipment-wise. I really do not have that kind of money, I currently have 400k available and cant even buy a small fracture of any of those items, so i will either have to grind gold or buy it for real money once it comes available on the EU servers. TbH, its a little demoralizing, because nobody with a "normal" schedule have that much time to find that amount of gold.
It seems i will have to do with the mid-end gear for good, and with mid-end gear, what should i focus on? Just dinged 60 last night. Done some research, and seems you need a lot of resistance?
Like i said, most of "my" benchmark statistics can actually be achieved with a full good set of rare. Yes the legendary items make you look more cool and has a bit of extra statistics, some of them needed some of them not so helpful.
If gold is an issue i would suggest focus on rare and get the must have legendary items. I can not tell you specifically what to buy, instead, my advices are:
1) Combination of all resist, block, vit and melee reduced damaged is the key. Like i said people with 1000 all resist and 60,000 hp are saying they die easy and i know that because i used to have these statistics also. Once block comes in you will notice the difference. Do not just focus on vit and resist all like many are doing.
2) Stormshield is a must.
3) I have 52,000hp, ~600 all resist, max block of 51% and ~26% melee damaged reduce. Once you have that you can tank elite packs with ease with the exception of a few in act 4 (for which is still not impossible just requires more care). These are the statistics you can work towards. I must make it clear, these are my statistics, i am quite sure let say if you have 40% block and 800 all resist instead you will do just as well. Meaning up and down it does not matter but the key is you need to combine them and only one of them will not work as well.
4) DPS. This is what I am working on now. I am quite comfortable with my defense, i am planning to slowly drop some defense for dps. But making sure i drop enough but not too much. You need dps for act 3 and 4, the game will be more emjoyable when you can tank effectively and be able to maximize your dps and kill things as fast as you can. Now that i have beaten the game, for me my fun will come from how i balance my build to get more dps. My goal is to try to be as effective in defense as before but have 30k dps unbuffed instead of 17k that i have at the moment.
It is no fun to just be able to tank in the game, an all round built is what you want. And i will further improve my statistics, an all round built is what will work in pvp too i think, so i am looking for a setup (statistics wise) that works for both pve and pvp.
I know what you mean but i have try that. I came from using a 2 hander like all others then switch to single hand and shield in inferno.
That is another purpose of topic is to send a message to Blizzard. I want to be a dps class but i am forced into playing a tank. I am sure we have made enough noise and they are aware of the issue and hopefully they will do something about it.
Back to answering the question. Why not 2-hander and no block? Because i don't want to die like a silly bit@h over and over again. What's the point in "you can kill me fast and i can kill one of you too if i am lucky". What's the point in running around waiting for 2 min CDs and with bad luck you die just when you active the buff (many of us have this experience and we all go WTF back to waiting for another 2 mins then).
Another valid reason (for myself anyway) for not going 2 hander route is: I would like to play in group and be welcome and wanted in a group. People love and very much need a good tank in act 3 & 4 (btw very few at the moment), they hate melee who die faster than them in group play. A lot of people leaves the group once they confirm the 2 handed melee cannot tank and just want to look good and waste their time. :)
Well... I disagree with a lot that you said, as I use a 2 hand and find that it works great. You say you are forced into being a tank but I think that is a self imposed limitation. Every time I join a public game, everyone is dying left and right. When I get to the zone, I usually have to solo some elite while everyone is dead and then carry the group. When I leave the group, the group disbands every single time and then I get messages asking if I can help them duo the quest that tehy are on.
But anyway, you can get much better gear if you dont get melee reduction and block gear. I think you will have no problems with a 2h.
I don't like the "end game" gear selection. While I get the point that the game seems to force us into tank or nothing, if for some reason I am still playing this game in a year, I will definitely be shooting for that 50k dps milestone. I realize the main problem is it appears we are "required" to select defensive passives. I don't have a solution, but I definitely imagine an endgame for a barbarian that involves killing lots of monsters quickly and decisively.
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