Diablo® III

"I want HC to be less punishing" pros/cons

That's what I love about HC community. Such an amazing attitude to the game. Almost no one unreasonably blames Blizzard.

To me HC is just how it should be.

I really hope the HC community grows and develop soon.
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hc needs to be just like SC except dead is dead. There is only one change I would make.... let us have our old gear off the corpse. In SC, the gems & uber items never die. You buy an item, use it for a few levels, sell it back, another person buys it, uses it, sells it.... the best items will just keep coming around. In HC, the constant drain of good gear, gems, etc make it exponentially harder to get good gear, and earning millions to buy a set just to lose it is pretty frustrating. Also, the gems are skewed: no one wants anything but amethysts (and one weapon ruby), making the green & gold gems worthless in HC (in SC full bore dps builds can use these but few would do that in HC).
Edited by Jonnin#1861 on 6/6/2012 6:52 AM PDT
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Posts: 1,840
Three lives is a Horrible idea. There would be no thrill to leveling and getting 60 would be way easier.
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hc needs to be just like SC except dead is dead. There is only one change I would make.... let us have our old gear off the corpse. In SC, the gems & uber items never die. You buy an item, use it for a few levels, sell it back, another person buys it, uses it, sells it.... the best items will just keep coming around. In HC, the constant drain of good gear, gems, etc make it exponentially harder to get good gear, and earning millions to buy a set just to lose it is pretty frustrating. Also, the gems are skewed: no one wants anything but amethysts (and one weapon ruby), making the green & gold gems worthless in HC (in SC full bore dps builds can use these but few would do that in HC).


That's...pretty much one of the main features of Hardcore: less ridiculous economic inflation. You already get to resell every piece of gear you use in the process of advancing your character; not being able to resell the ones you die in seems fine to me. Sure, it sucks to die in expensive equipment, but otherwise the top loot would just keep getting cheaper and cheaper until everyone could easily afford what it takes to breeze through Inferno (even as-is, this will probably still happen eventually, since the gear people die in is only a small fraction of the total gear they acquire throughout the game).
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We can agree to disagree there. Losing your stuff just adds a grind factor to the game in hardcore. Its bad enough that one of my HC characters will not be leaving hell, it will be inferno geared and will farm hell (or lower if I want) for $$ and startup loots for the rerolls after a death....

Yes, the economy is healthier. I see that. But I can live without the grind that is a side effect to a healthy economy.
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We can agree to disagree there. Losing your stuff just adds a grind factor to the game in hardcore. Its bad enough that one of my HC characters will not be leaving hell, it will be inferno geared and will farm hell (or lower if I want) for $$ and startup loots for the rerolls after a death....

Yes, the economy is healthier. I see that. But I can live without the grind that is a side effect to a healthy economy.


Now that is a good idea. A permanent Hell Farmer. SO, what is the best class/spec for SAFE hell farming?
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Sometimes people get hit by cars. Sometimes planes crash, and lots of people die. Sharks eat people. There are earthquakes. Young and healthy people sometimes just drop dead from a heart attack. Nobody knows the ubicity of their tumulus. Sometimes the internet disconnects.
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The only character on hardcore that I lost in hardcore so far is a lvl 23 Witch Doctor... and it was because my housemate reset the bloody router (yea i !@#$ing shat on his face after dying)

Both my 55Barb and 60Wizard died, painfully normally... and I LOVE HARDCORE MORE AND MORE because of it

the feeling of imminent death with my Wizard (I knew 2 minutes before hand that i wasn't gonna make it out alive, and had no way of getting away... well maybe 30-50 seconds? it sure as hell felt like ages) and the sudden death of my barb (died in less than 2 seconds) made the game PURE GOLD.

I had given up on this game... softcore was a pushover, and inferno was just an endless grind which was just cheap and boring...

I was so glad i tried out hardcore... it made the game worth its money for the first time.

(though i gotta admit after my 23 WD died, training another one was so boring, so i feel for you... totally gay when death is from lag)

PS: I'm in Australia, with REALLY REALLY BAD PING, if I've done so much in hardcore... I cant imagine how the americans can be complaining about lag issues.... be a man!
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85 Night Elf Druid
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Posts: 82
I have to disagree. What happens when your third life is lost due to a disconnection? There wil always be lost characters in HC and having more than one life simply takes the thrill out of it. I love my HC toons as much as the next HC gamer, but it is simply part of the HC experience. It is called HARDCORE because of the undiluted finality of it. It is not for the fainthearted. It is a place where you get no second chances. Period.
Edited by magus38#1579 on 6/6/2012 12:08 PM PDT
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Posts: 66
Another common suggestion is to have blizzard come up with some kind of complex or high-tech disconnect protection system. Things like pausing the game automatically when the servers detect your client not responding, having the server force your character to run towards the nearest exit automatically, etc etc.

These are a bit unrealistic, and would require some pretty crazy time investments and innovations by blizzard. I wouldn't mind something like this, but I think it falls squarely in the realm of "unlikely".


You realize Blizzard does this for their RTS games already, right? They already invested the time developing the pause-on-lag features for those games, so I can't imagine it would really be that difficult for Diablo.

Your 3-life thing, though, is IMO more of a cop-out than anything else. I'd rather have the occasional lag-death than multiple lives. Hardcore is hardcore, if removing lag deaths means making it less meaningful (open to abuse, multiple lives) then it's not a proper solution.
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Google "internet routing" already. People always assume that the only two factors involved in lg are their own computer and the game's servers. You have no idea what's going on between your computer and the server. There's so many potential problems, from a downed pole with damaged fiber two thousand miles from you to your neighbor having a thirty year old vcr that is backfeeding signal into your neighborhood cable system.

If there is a consistent problem with the majority of people, then it's more likely to be the fault of the servers or datacenter. It's not, because there would be a whole lot more posts on the forums. If you have seen some of the head ends and datacenters that are out there, you would be amazed that the internet even works, much less as well as it does.
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While I think it'd be cool if HC became SC on death, they'd have to remove everything from your inventory and all items equipped imo, otherwise people could bring items over letting a lvl 1 HC die. At that point, it's kinda what's the point though.
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"Please don't" is all I have to say to any suggestions that would make HC easier. The omnipresent threat of death is precisely what gives this game mode its appeal, whether that death come at the hands of belial, alt-tab, overconfidence, lag spikes, or bad affixes. It's this brutal, no excuses, "go kick rocks" aspect that makes it so appealing to start with.

Of all the possibilities "slain by: technical difficulty" has to be the most frustrating, but for now any kind of fix that doesn't devalue the mode itself is a pipe dream.

viva la permadeath
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Posts: 150
06/06/2012 11:56 AMPosted by Zenakis
Nobody knows the ubicity of their tumulus. Sometimes the internet disconnects.


Glorious.
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Hardcore is not the only way to play the game. If you don't agree with the terms then don't play it but don't come on here and preach to the community that you actually care about a random strangers toon being lost to lag.

After about 130 hours of game time, 1 level 60, and 2 level 50+, I have only experienced a couple of 5+ second lag spikes.

It's not on blizzards end but it's not necessarily your end either, !@#$ can get delayed during the transfer process. You think you just have a cord running from your house to the blizzard servers?
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Ok. I have a solid PC, ethernet, and I experience only the rare one-second lag spike, maybe once every few hours that I notice. I know everyone likes to stomp their feet and pretend it's Blizzard's fault, but this is one gamer that doesn't suffer from significant lag problems of any kind. To blame Blizzard is just scapegoatism--there are too many more likely variables like local usage, your ISP, your PC, and others to assign blame to Blizzard. If their servers are garbage, why doesn't it affect me? Am I the only one?

Could it happen to me? Sure, but it hasn't in 50 hours of gameplay. I pay extra for premium Internet. Do these people with lag issues? Oh, of course they do! No one will ever admit they are wrong on the Internet! The Internet is only for lying and whining!

Anyway, HC death is permanent. Accept it. Any attempt to change that because of lag spikes, Acts of God, your three-year old, your sister, thoughts of suicide, aliens, drunkenness, sleep deprivation, your girlfriend, your wife, a seizure, carpal tunnel, or any other reason kills the whole experience. "Make a dead HC character into a SC one." Gah! GAAAAAAAAAAAH!

When, not if...WHEN death comes, I don't want HC mode to warm up some milk, kiss me tenderly on the forehead, tuck me in, read me a story, and leave the nightlight on. I want it to leave me for dead in a plastic bag on the freeway.

Now, for a fun game. Guess the movie with the following pertinent quotes! BONUS points: Give me the name of character!

"We do not train to be merciful here. Mercy is for the weak."

"If your head comes away from your neck, it's over."

"Game over, man! GAME OVER!"
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Posts: 94
Fate is capricious and unfair. Those who choose to play in Fate's playground must accept the consequences.

Any "3 lives" rule, or move-character to softcore rule, or literally any other rule except final and absolute death would eliminate the pure rush of HC. The HC rush comes ENTIRELY from the brutality and finality of death.

Any technical solution could be gamed, would be expensive to administer, and would cheapen HC as people's deaths (survivals? resurrections?) were called into question.

Best solution? Do not change HC, change the gamer.

Let HC weed out those who do not have the temperament for it.


well said..
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Posts: 172
If you want to continue playing your character after death, simply play softcore. Dying due to lag, ISP issues, computer crash, etc, is one of the risks you take when you elect to play a hardcore character. If the player finds those risks unacceptable..... play softcore. It's such a simple solution that already exists.

If you can continue playing after character death, it's no longer hardcore. Period.
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Posts: 1,571
You could just play softcore and delete your character after 3 deaths, same end result without the need for making a whole new game mode or taking away a mode for 1 death that many of us want.
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06/06/2012 01:36 PMPosted by Deleted
There's so many potential problems, from a downed pole with damaged fiber two thousand miles from you to your neighbor having a thirty year old vcr that is backfeeding signal into your neighborhood cable system.


Yeah one of my old roommates was a bigshot troubleshooter for a local cable company. He told me once some ladies blow drier took out her whole town whenever she turned it on.

But two different games with servers relatively close shouldnt have such varied performance. Why is all my other internet use smooth as butter and D3 as smooth as 30 gauge sandpaper.

ps. I dont support multiple lives in any way but the disco deaths are a problem and need a solution
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