Diablo® III

Item Dupe and Bot Gold Farming. Blue?

Posts: 185
Maybe if you started looking at it from the company's perspective, it might sit better with you.

You have to consider that these guys took a very negative and money/resource draining entity in these cheaters, botters, etc and have now found a way to make it a revenue stream. Blizzard's goal is to make as much money as possible. Period. That's any corporations' goal. First and foremost, they are responsible to their shareholders, not you. Your satisfaction is secondary. As long as people are playing and using RMAH, they do not care. There's nothing to "fix" from the business perspective if this is the case.

Think about this for a second...For every $60 Blizzard makes on the RMAH, they have, effectively, sold another copy of the game. With no monthly subscription in place, this is HUGE.

Not a lot of people realize Blizzard / Activision are a COMPANY / CORPORATION. ppl should go look up the definition of those 2 words... bots are only going to MAKE money for blizzard. what a concept. reminds me of a ciggarette company or something. everybody knows stoggies are bad for you and cause lung cancer and death, but they still buy them and make the shareholders money.

weird comparison after i typed that out but it still makes sense to me. well put tho sir.

Anyway...the bottom line is this: There are three things to look at, given that this is not subscription based. 1. Negative impact on sales due to bots, etc. 2. Negative impact on RMAH sales due to bots, etc. 3. Positive impact on RMAH sales due to bots, etc. Somewhere the math between these three variables is being studied and the outcome of that math will determine what, if anything, will be done.


If you read ahead into the thread, you'll see where I debunked the whole "bots are going to make blizzard money" argument. Basically stocking the gold on RMAH to the point where it's nearly free (in terms of dollar amounts) isn't going to benefit Blizzard as much as I think they would like. What is a gain of 15% on say .10$? They aren't going make jack as far as a profit goes if they let bot abuse/item dupe go unchecked.
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The best solution for this would be the implementation of a ladder just like in Diablo 2 and use this as excuse to reset the whole game.

Doing this, probably, everyone would be happy.
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Posts: 185
06/10/2012 02:10 AMPosted by Solaynia
You all got exactly what you wanted, the game to come out asap, and now are suffering the consequences of your ignorant behavior. Blizzard is only partly to blame for bringing out the game with so many things to still be in tact, but their fans are the most to blame because they can't stop !@#$%ing about content they aren't even ready for if you guys don't want a game like WoW ^-*! and let them fix the game, it hasn't even been out for a month yet you stupid ignorant babies. Grow up and stop whining, it's pathetic.


No one here is whining. You want item dupe and bots flooding your game?
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Posts: 185
The best solution for this would be the implementation of a ladder just like in Diablo 2 and use this as excuse to reset the whole game.

Doing this, probably, everyone would be happy.


At the end of the day, resetting everything would eliminate the problem, sure. The issue then becomes bots and item dupe abuse throwing off the ladder completely with characters who have an endless supply of duped items at their disposal. No more farming needed, thus no more gameplay required.
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I'd like to hear what Blizzard has to say on the matter of botting and duping. They have been quite silent about it and I would hope they could at least give us a heads up about what's going on.

+1


I would think they are still trying to figure out what they are going to do about it and saying that in public would lose some face amongst some players saying, "oh sure you'll wait till Blizzard (tm) SOOM comes around and then it will be too late". No matter what they say people are quick to jump on them so why not remain silent.

It reminds me of my relationship with my mother, I don't ever call her as she's trained me that when ever I call her she jumps on my case, so why should I call her. Same sit here, they say something and people are quick to jump all over them complaining about one thing or another.

They'd be best to spend their time fixing the problem then communicating what they are going to do about it and give the botters and other cheaters a head start at looking for ways to work around the fix.
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100 Draenei Priest
8670
Posts: 6
06/10/2012 02:12 AMPosted by DTale
You all got exactly what you wanted, the game to come out asap, and now are suffering the consequences of your ignorant behavior. Blizzard is only partly to blame for bringing out the game with so many things to still be in tact, but their fans are the most to blame because they can't stop !@#$%ing about content they aren't even ready for if you guys don't want a game like WoW ^-*! and let them fix the game, it hasn't even been out for a month yet you stupid ignorant babies. Grow up and stop whining, it's pathetic.


No one here is whining. You want item dupe and bots flooding your game?

It sure sounds like a lot of whining, people keep blaming blizzard for making this game come out before it was complete, but if you look at graphics on d2 you'll see they are working with completely different engine then they were before. personally it looks amazing in d3 so as far as whining goes can't keep nuking the system unless you want a game like WoW where it's no fun and everything is handed to you.
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Posts: 185
06/10/2012 02:17 AMPosted by Solaynia


No one here is whining. You want item dupe and bots flooding your game?

It sure sounds like a lot of whining, people keep blaming blizzard for making this game come out before it was complete, but if you look at graphics on d2 you'll see they are working with completely different engine then they were before. personally it looks amazing in d3 so as far as whining goes can't keep nuking the system unless you want a game like WoW where it's no fun and everything is handed to you.


I think you're searching for a different discussion, although I can't be sure... The issue in this thread is bot gold farmers and item dupe ruining the game for the people (Like me, and others) who actually really like this game and enjoy playing without cheaters.
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06/10/2012 02:17 AMPosted by Solaynia
It sure sounds like a lot of whining, people keep blaming blizzard for making this game come out before it was complete, but if you look at graphics on d2 you'll see they are working with completely different engine then they were before. personally it looks amazing in d3 so as far as whining goes can't keep nuking the system unless you want a game like WoW where it's no fun and everything is handed to you.


You think the game being incomplete is because they're using a different graphics engine? You think people are talking about the graphics when we say it's incomplete? Ahahahahahahaha, oh god. Please, tell me more.
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100 Draenei Priest
8670
Posts: 6

It sure sounds like a lot of whining, people keep blaming blizzard for making this game come out before it was complete, but if you look at graphics on d2 you'll see they are working with completely different engine then they were before. personally it looks amazing in d3 so as far as whining goes can't keep nuking the system unless you want a game like WoW where it's no fun and everything is handed to you.


I think you're searching for a different discussion, although I can't be sure... The issue in this thread is bot gold farmers and item dupe ruining the game for the people (Like me, and others) who actually really like this game and enjoy playing without cheaters.

There is always gonna be cheaters on any game, especially online and if you make money of it. It's kinda unavoidable..like a virus. Life goes on and people just need to ignore it and just play the game and have fun.
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100 Draenei Priest
8670
Posts: 6
06/10/2012 02:21 AMPosted by Deadgye
It sure sounds like a lot of whining, people keep blaming blizzard for making this game come out before it was complete, but if you look at graphics on d2 you'll see they are working with completely different engine then they were before. personally it looks amazing in d3 so as far as whining goes can't keep nuking the system unless you want a game like WoW where it's no fun and everything is handed to you.


You think the game being incomplete is because they're using a different graphics engine? You think people are talking about the graphics when we say it's incomplete? Ahahahahahahaha, oh god. Please, tell me more.

My point was they are using different content that they aren't used to and it was ultimately it was a lot to take on for them. Trying to make a fun game but also trying to please the majority of players. Can't really avoid bots, there millions of players everyday, how can you expect them to just pinpoint the botters and eliminate them, they'd just make new players. kinda dumb you expect so much from them.
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i dont mind botting in that anybody with any knowledge of online games knew it was going to be done. but duping needs to be fixed.
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Posts: 185


I think you're searching for a different discussion, although I can't be sure... The issue in this thread is bot gold farmers and item dupe ruining the game for the people (Like me, and others) who actually really like this game and enjoy playing without cheaters.

There is always gonna be cheaters on any game, especially online and if you make money of it. It's kinda unavoidable..like a virus. Life goes on and people just need to ignore it and just play the game and have fun.


While it is in a sense unavoidable, it still needs to be addressed. I think we can all agree on that point.

Having the cheaters in game effectively eliminates the purpose of the AH and RMAH entirely. They no longer represent an "auction house" and become something more along the lines of maxing your characters gear for pennies (whether buying an item for 100,000,000,000 gold which cost you a mere 1$ tops, or by buying any of the thousands, maybe millions, of the duped versions of said gear for just a few pennies instead.)
Edited by FinalBoss#1919 on 6/10/2012 2:31 AM PDT
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Posts: 185
06/10/2012 02:25 AMPosted by Solaynia


You think the game being incomplete is because they're using a different graphics engine? You think people are talking about the graphics when we say it's incomplete? Ahahahahahahaha, oh god. Please, tell me more.

My point was they are using different content that they aren't used to and it was ultimately it was a lot to take on for them. Trying to make a fun game but also trying to please the majority of players. Can't really avoid bots, there millions of players everyday, how can you expect them to just pinpoint the botters and eliminate them, they'd just make new players. kinda dumb you expect so much from them.


What is dumb is that they have implemented a system for detecting bots, which is no longer able to do that. This needs to be fixed, which remains to be the entire point of the thread. Although if you can't see that, I think it is best we agree to disagree on that point.
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I have found a flaw in the 15% transaction fee of RMAH items and gold being sold.

If the bot running gold farmers over saturate the market with gold, the price will drop incredibly. We're talking pennies here over time, if it isn't dealt with. Where then, is blizzards profit if they're earning 15% on the penny?

Item dupe isn't any different. If the end game, top of the line items are being duped and then sold in mass quantities, then the same problem will arise. Take 15% of .25$ (more likely much less than that) for a awesome chest piece that is 1 out of 100,000 others.


The way I see it, in game prices will not drop if the AH is flooded with gold. If more gold is available in the games economy, prices in AH money will rise because the money is worth less because there is more of it. Thus, item prices become inflated. So you, as Joe Average, is left with two options: farm the crazy amount of gold yourself to buy an item in game or buy the item with real money. Given high inflation, buying the item for real money thus becomes more attractive to you. And the lower the price of that item in real money, the more likely you are to consider actually paying real money for it. If Blizzard gets $60.0375 from you because you bought that item, and the game, they are still getting $0.0375 more from you than they would have got, without RMAH. If you choose to farm the item yourself, Blizzard gets nothing on top of the original purchase. Add up all those 0.0375 transactions and you're making money.

I suspect you'll also see a lot of cartel type behavior where these huge farming operations will be buying up legit items with in game money(because they have tons of it) and then selling the items RMAH. They will more or less control the market, eventually, as they did in FFXI Online because they will have access to the two things they need in order to do this: huge amounts of online money as well as real money. Whatever follows...Blizzard gets 15% anyway. If you're a realtor selling a house and your commission is 5%, do you care which end pays you?

I suspect the RMAH has been delayed, intentionally, in order to have time to flood the in game economy with gold in order to drive prices up, thus making RMAH more attractive to Joe Average over farming.

The point you made about duping is a good one, though. That could possibly mess up the whole thing and, if it does, Blizzard will stop it but, as for bots farming gold...there's no reason why Blizzard would want to stop this. More in game money means higher item prices due to inflation which means more farming for you which means it's more likely you'll just buy the item. In which case, Blizzard wins. The other option is for you to quit. But, even then, Blizzard still wins because they already have your $60.


You forgot one thing, ppls getting pissed and just quit the game and maybe dont buy future games from the company.

I just know I didnt buy anymore a NCsoft product for a while, this may happen with Blizzard too if they dont do anything about all the exploiters, botters and cheaters.

Ive read you could made billions early in the AH because of a bug and these ppls are still not banned ? So in other words we have to cheat and bot ourselves if we want to play D3 in the future like in D2 or you wont be able to trade for anything.

Dont sound too great to me, we will see where we stand in a month but if noone from the exploiters and cheaters gets banned till then Iam done with this game and future projects from Blizzard like with NCsoft.
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100 Draenei Priest
8670
Posts: 6

My point was they are using different content that they aren't used to and it was ultimately it was a lot to take on for them. Trying to make a fun game but also trying to please the majority of players. Can't really avoid bots, there millions of players everyday, how can you expect them to just pinpoint the botters and eliminate them, they'd just make new players. kinda dumb you expect so much from them.


What is dumb is that they have implemented a system for detecting bots, which is no longer able to do that. This needs to be fixed, which remains to be the entire point of the thread. Although if you can't see that, I think it is best we agree to disagree on that point.

Well you do see that this game hasn't even been out for a month yet right? Give it time and they'll fix it. *shrugs* everything just takes a little time
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Posts: 185


What is dumb is that they have implemented a system for detecting bots, which is no longer able to do that. This needs to be fixed, which remains to be the entire point of the thread. Although if you can't see that, I think it is best we agree to disagree on that point.

Well you do see that this game hasn't even been out for a month yet right? Give it time and they'll fix it. *shrugs* everything just takes a little time


Indeed, the game has only been out for a month. However, on the verge of something so big as the RMAH being released, something like botters and item dupe is a *huge* issue.
Edited by FinalBoss#1919 on 6/10/2012 2:47 AM PDT
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Posts: 185


The way I see it, in game prices will not drop if the AH is flooded with gold. If more gold is available in the games economy, prices in AH money will rise because the money is worth less because there is more of it. Thus, item prices become inflated. So you, as Joe Average, is left with two options: farm the crazy amount of gold yourself to buy an item in game or buy the item with real money. Given high inflation, buying the item for real money thus becomes more attractive to you. And the lower the price of that item in real money, the more likely you are to consider actually paying real money for it. If Blizzard gets $60.0375 from you because you bought that item, and the game, they are still getting $0.0375 more from you than they would have got, without RMAH. If you choose to farm the item yourself, Blizzard gets nothing on top of the original purchase. Add up all those 0.0375 transactions and you're making money.

I suspect you'll also see a lot of cartel type behavior where these huge farming operations will be buying up legit items with in game money(because they have tons of it) and then selling the items RMAH. They will more or less control the market, eventually, as they did in FFXI Online because they will have access to the two things they need in order to do this: huge amounts of online money as well as real money. Whatever follows...Blizzard gets 15% anyway. If you're a realtor selling a house and your commission is 5%, do you care which end pays you?

I suspect the RMAH has been delayed, intentionally, in order to have time to flood the in game economy with gold in order to drive prices up, thus making RMAH more attractive to Joe Average over farming.

The point you made about duping is a good one, though. That could possibly mess up the whole thing and, if it does, Blizzard will stop it but, as for bots farming gold...there's no reason why Blizzard would want to stop this. More in game money means higher item prices due to inflation which means more farming for you which means it's more likely you'll just buy the item. In which case, Blizzard wins. The other option is for you to quit. But, even then, Blizzard still wins because they already have your $60.


You forgot one thing, ppls getting pissed and just quit the game and maybe dont buy future games from the company.

I just know I didnt buy anymore a NCsoft product for a while, this may happen with Blizzard too if they dont do anything about all the exploiters, botters and cheaters.

Ive read you could made billions early in the AH because of a bug and these ppls are still not banned ? So in other words we have to cheat and bot ourselves if we want to play D3 in the future like in D2 or you wont be able to trade for anything.

Dont sound too great to me, we will see where we stand in a month but if noone from the exploiters and cheaters gets banned till then Iam done with this game and future projects from Blizzard like with NCsoft.


Yes, all of this and the other issues being reported in the forum cannot be good for their image. We can only hope that by keeping this thread, and others like it active that the blue's will update us as to whether or not Blizz has any plans on dealing with the item dupe and bot's.
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100 Draenei Priest
8670
Posts: 6

Well you do see that this game hasn't even been out for a month yet right? Give it time and they'll fix it. *shrugs* everything just takes a little time


Indeed, the game has only been out for a month. However, on the verge of something so big as the RMAH being released. Something like botters and item dupe is a *huge* issue.

I agree which is why they should postpone it, and keep working on fixing the content that is obscured, and they can try to eliminate the dupes and try to control the botters in the game. They'll make the systems. But there is still a way to dupe and bot, if there is a will there is a way, you know?
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As a result of all the CRAP that is now out and available to dupe, bot and exploit your way to personal gain, I guess there will be a 12 hour day of maintenance that ends up being 24 hours this tuesday..
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