Diablo® III

Witch Doctor Assessment in Inferno

85 Troll Mage
3415
Please feel free to comment on my findings. Note that this applies to Inferno mode only.

1) WD's have the tools they need to kite normal mobs, and kill them successfully, even without the best gear.

2) We are not locked in VQ Bears or POV builds. There are several skill combinations which work quite well.

3) Pets cannot survive even 1 hit from a3 or a4 normal mobs, and are therefore just fodder at that point. Zombie Dogs start being fodder in a1, while the gargantuan is by the end of a2.

4) Elites and champ mobs in a3-a4 are nearly impossible to kill solo, even with the best gear available in the game. I would love to hear from other WD's to see if they were able to solo even one of these a3-a4 elite packs. The only way to get past these mobs is to either spirit walk or herd them into an out of the way corner. I would love to have stacks of valor...but thats not really possible anymore for the solo WD on a3+. Im not even saying to nerf the elite mobs. Other classes can kill them. It would just be nice if WD's could as well. Each class in D3 is supposed to be able to stand on their own right?

5) A good WD has great survivability tools at his/her disposal. Spirit walk and Vessel are so essential for a3-a4 that any other build that doesnt include these is not viable. Im not sure if this is a good thing however. My suggestion is to make these spirit walks completely "no clip". I cant tell you how many times Ive tried to walk around/though and an entire pack of mobs who have surrounded me and died, even with both Vessel and Walk going off. That has to be fixed.

6) Even with the best gear, mana costs for Spirit Barrage are outrageous. Unless you have Spiritual Attunement AND Rush of Essence, you cant cast it more than a few times. Same with almost all of the WD spells - Bears, Frogs, etc. Basically, if you want to use a skill with a real mana cost, you are locked into VQ. I dislike being locked into any one skillset.

There are more issues, but these are at the top of my list for the moment.
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3)
i think there are some people that are doing ok with pets in inferno now. i still get the feeling its not that great though.

4)
ya i can solo a few....... "a few" some combinations are there just to kill ya though. really anything with "fast" or "shielding minion" are just to much to handle solo. Feels like elites in inferno really are best handles in a group. to me elites are the biggest problem of all so i tend to like to play with a group of people anyways.

5)
it for sure does not clip wall abilities and i think thats cool. I personally had to bind the grave key ` to "move" that way i could hold down 1 (my jaunt key) and grave at the same time and i would in fact move where i clicked rather than have where i clicked have an enemy there and try to cast a spell at that location instead.

bind "move" then try.

my own input:

I find boss fights in inferno to be soooooooo much fun they are not hard in hell mode but man ..... you need to be cold blooded calculating killers to kill them in inferno. Its a real rush for me. I love fighting all the act 3 bosses in inferno. they are all fun.

i clicked like on this post BTW because most of what you say is entirely true.

cheers
Edited by xcience#1442 on 6/15/2012 12:52 PM PDT
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4) Elites and champ mobs in a3-a4 are nearly impossible to kill solo, even with the best gear available in the game. I would love to hear from other WD's to see if they were able to solo even one of these a3-a4 elite packs. The only way to get past these mobs is to either spirit walk or herd them into an out of the way corner. I would love to have stacks of valor...but thats not really possible anymore for the solo WD on a3+. Im not even saying to nerf the elite mobs. Other classes can kill them. It would just be nice if WD's could as well. Each class in D3 is supposed to be able to stand on their own right?

I don't have the best gear in the game and I am able to solo kill elite/champ mobs to get 5 stacks in all of act 3. I admit that certain mobs with certain affix combinations are extremely difficult and in order to take them down I have to do spawn fighting (with at least 2 deaths) or just skip them. I'd say this happens in 1 out of every 10 packs that I face.

Then again, I specifically designed my skill set and strategy to be able to pull that off well but at the cost of being able to face-roll most normals and bosses (i.e. while my damage from Haunt/Locusts is mana efficient and allows me to kite like crazy, it's not as fast as darts/bears).

I do agree with all your points though.
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I got to agree with every point there, and i would like to add a couple more:

7) WD's is the only class that can run out of resources on his basic attacks. All the other classes basic attacks are free or even give them resources, except the witch doctor ones. A frog build with an attack speed of 2+ isnt even possible without VQ.

8) WD's are the only class in the game which got an extra disadvantage against a large amount of the elite packs: plagued packs takes 50% (i think its something like that) less poison damage, and seeing that half of our spells are poison, this seems to be really annoying for the WD.

4) Elites and champ mobs in a3-a4 are nearly impossible to kill solo, even with the best gear available in the game. I would love to hear from other WD's to see if they were able to solo even one of these a3-a4 elite packs. The only way to get past these mobs is to either spirit walk or herd them into an out of the way corner. I would love to have stacks of valor...but thats not really possible anymore for the solo WD on a3+. Im not even saying to nerf the elite mobs. Other classes can kill them. It would just be nice if WD's could as well. Each class in D3 is supposed to be able to stand on their own right?


The main issue why witch doctors arent able to solo a lot of elite packs in a3-a4 is because they were designed as a pet/control class. All our pets are useless in inferno and controls only last for 20% of the time (so a 4 second fear is in fact a 0.8 sec fear), making them pretty useless too (except the slows and zombie wall). But I dont think they can just change this so easily (an elite pack can prob kill each other in a 12 sec confusion, seeing that one hit of them easily hit for 100k+ without any damage reduction)
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85 Troll Mage
3415
The main issue why witch doctors arent able to solo a lot of elite packs in a3-a4 is because they were designed as a pet/control class. All our pets are useless in inferno and controls only last for 20% of the time (so a 4 second fear is in fact a 0.8 sec fear), making them pretty useless too (except the slows and zombie wall). But I dont think they can just change this so easily (an elite pack can prob kill each other in a 12 sec confusion, seeing that one hit of them easily hit for 100k+ without any damage reduction)


The pet issue has been addressed in several threads, all with the same consensus: Pets are not viable in a3-a4. Ive tried several stacking mechanisms, but none work to any significant extent.

In order for WDs to beat an elite pack in a3-a4, they have to be a master of kiting. Some outstanding WD's can kite for bit an eventually kill these packs. The large majority cant last more than a few seconds. My suggestion is to give WDs another kiting mechanism that works, or alter existing ones. WD's do not generally have the dps of Wizards or DHs, and therefore have to compensate with a better kiting mechanism... which we just dont have right now.

My suggestions include:
1) Make Grasp of the Dead MUCH better - increase its radius - increase the slow amount.. maybe allow "freeze in place". The current mechanic lacks very, very badly.
2) A better Jaunt. - maybe have a "Grasp of the Dead" type of effect when Jaunting away from an area.
3) Firebomb with a AOE snare/stop
4) Snake to the Face should be 100% stun
5) Passive Skills - Include increased snaring, freezing

Any or all of these changes would make for a much better WD experience in inferno a3+. Otherwise, we really have no chance at elite pack killing.

I think the real balance issue is going to be how to not give the WD so much power that killing normal mobs becomes trivial. There is such a big gap though in normal vs elite mobs in inferno right now that something has to be done.
Edited by Muzeroc#1238 on 6/15/2012 7:31 PM PDT
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kitting is one thing but I would want dps as well. I do play with a wizard and I must say that OMFG, my dps sucks bad time compared to that wizard. Sure I do have some skills to kit the enemy and hold it in place but other than that... dps is bad overall. I have lots of damage offensive skills that I don't even use because of the design like spiders and toads. Spiders dont do anything except damage...no slowing down just nothing. Toads are too unpredictable too. Well I could go on and make a trhread about it but the point is, lots of offensive skills are just not enough dps. It needs an overall boost if you ask me.
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c packs are not very hard. depends on the mob type and affix combination, but I can do 90% of all packs. what sucks are if already broken mobs become champions with even more annoying stuff: frogs, soul lickers, pestlience, charging angels etc...
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