Diablo® III

Stop saying PvP will be "Pay to win"

07/09/2012 11:07 AMPosted by Fiction
More specifically, based off of your win/loss record. It's not dissimilar from the matchmaker found in StarCraft II, which is based off of the Elo system used for Chess championships. Your win/loss and who they were against determines a 'skill rating', which is used to match up against other players of a similar rating. The intent is to get an even/fair match. Regardless of any individual factors like build, gear, or player ability, you'll find some equilibrium where you're facing off against players that you're about as likely to beat as you are to lose. If getting better gear raises your abilities then you're simply matched against players of a higher rating. Changing builds or just getting better at PvP could have the same effect. But regardless if you move up or down you're ultimately still netting around a 50/50 win/loss as you're always matching against similarly rated players.


I thought you were fired.


Bashiok has been around for years. Why would he be fired now?
Trance




In a PvP interview, Jay said there will not be a win/lose ratio display. Dumbing down the game, essentially.


I know the term dumbing down the game has been overused but this post really takes the cake. Not showing win/loss record dumbing things down? Really?
If you want to win in PvP, just 4 gate.
07/09/2012 11:05 AMPosted by Bashiok
More specifically, based off of your win/loss record. It's not dissimilar from the matchmaker found in StarCraft II, which is based off of the Elo system used for Chess championships. Your win/loss and who they were against determines a 'skill rating', which is used to match up against other players of a similar rating. The intent is to get an even/fair match. Regardless of any individual factors like build, gear, or player ability, you'll find some equilibrium where you're facing off against players that you're about as likely to beat as you are to lose. If getting better gear raises your abilities then you're simply matched against players of a higher rating. Changing builds or just getting better at PvP could have the same effect. But regardless if you move up or down you're ultimately still netting around a 50/50 win/loss as you're always matching against similarly rated players.


Bashiok the though of PvP gives me a lot of wood.

You should also have open areas with no record or matchmaking that people can come and leave as they please and just slaughter each other.

That place SHOULD ALLOW 8 people. Leave it out of coop, fine. But PvP needs 4 v 4 and big free for alls.

Also please please please don't !@#$ this up. It isn't just testing, you need to make sure there is a lot of variety to it to keep it fun.

1) Different types of areas (big/small, with random mobs/without, variety of terrain not just open and flat)
2) Different modes (FAA/team, ranked/unranked, all same class/any class)
3) Balancing dmg reduction and skill effects for players is a must (test test test)

Have an open pvp beta, get suggestions and make it great.
Umm... that rating system wont work. You can't use ratio, because someone fighting harder opponents will have the same ratio that someone fighting weaker opponents will have. It would be like pairing up professional baseball players against little leaguers simply because they have the same team batting average and era. It's not a fair fight.


the rating system does work, it's been proven to work. It's one of the most popular ratings systems in existance right now. Do you get some "unfair fights"? Yes, at the very beginning, you do. but very quickly people normalize to where they're "supposed" to be, and begin to become paired vs people who are about equal to them.

It's not about pairing you vs people with the same "ratio". Ideally, under the system, EVERYONE has the same ratio: you win 50% of the time, you lose 50% of the time.

To break it down simply, if you keep winning, and your w/l ratio is higher than 50%, the system will bump up your rank and continue moving you up until you get to a point where you are winning 50% and losing 50%. If you keep losing, and fall below 50%, it'll bump you down until you reach that equilibrium.

It's a lot more complex than that, but that's the basic gist of it. The entire concept is that you end up being paired vs people of equal skill and gear. If you get better, or get better gear, and start winning a lot, you get moved up the rankings. It's as simple as that.
it´s alive!

one week of silence, srsly?


Yes because there was not a national holiday in the US last week and they don't get days off etc. I'm sorry that you feel that you are so special that everything you post on the forums needs the attention of the makers of the game but I'm here to tell you : Your mother was wrong every morning when she told you were special as she gently put the hockey helmet on your head.

Honestly, with the amount of whining crying posts on this forum I'm not surprised they didn't abandon you all together.
Excellent...some attention to PvP. Hoping to pick your brain on further specifics, if you'll allow me.

- Will players be able to gamble on matches?
- Will teamplay still be allowed, taking into the same level of aggregate matchmaking as SC2 currently does?
- Just how far out are we? Is the team hopeful for a 2012 release?


I don't want to squash any excitement about PvP, because we think it's going to be a lot of fun, but a lot of the details are still in flux. We're focusing on 1.0.4, and once that's behind us we'll be a lot closer to sharing some more concrete details on the "PvP patch" as they solidify.


Are you planing on doing an Elo system similar to Chess or League of Legends?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elo_rating_system

This would allow you to both have a publicly displayed rating system as well as give people the ability to have a 50/50 W/L ratio over the course of their career and still be in different "leagues"
Edited by Asrrin#1906 on 7/9/2012 11:18 AM PDT
07/09/2012 11:16 AMPosted by Mosiak
If you want to win in PvP, just 4 gate.


lol srsly...
they can't matchmake on gear. not going to happen.
I don't see how its possible in the slightest. NOT all lvl 63 items are equal. i have seen some good and some very very bad.

With the RMAH and AH i can see why people say Pay to win.


If you were to start a game, hit 'I' and then press the 'details' button you will be able to get a fair idea of just how matchmaking will work...

I simply do not understand just how ignorant some of the 'I hate DIII' posters have become; it's like they fell off the bandwagon and hit their heads on the pavement...
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07/09/2012 11:11 AMPosted by Shagsbeard
Umm... that rating system wont work. You can't use ratio, because someone fighting harder opponents will have the same ratio that someone fighting weaker opponents will have. It would be like pairing up professional baseball players against little leaguers simply because they have the same team batting average and era. It's not a fair fight.


Oh no, it's not based on ratio. Look up the Elo system, I'm sure there's a wiki that can explain it better than I could.
07/09/2012 11:17 AMPosted by spiderisland
So what about a hostile system? What about world PVP? THAT was fun. Pure, simple, fun.


Dude.. please leave deciding the fun part to Jay Wilson Please.. He knows much better than u or me.. Thank You

Kinda sounds like world of warcraft

didn't you say this game wasn't world of warcraft O.o?


The ELO system is based on chess.

So by forum logic this means that Chess is based on World of Warcraft!

World of Warcraft invented Chess and the ELO system.
07/09/2012 11:10 AMPosted by Bashiok
I don't want to squash any excitement about PvP


so therefore, he won't tell us about it?
07/09/2012 11:14 AMPosted by Fellows
We're focusing on 1.0.4, and once that's behind us we'll be a lot closer to sharing some more concrete details on the "PvP patch" as they solidify.


Next logical question then: Any details on 1.0.4 that you can share?
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