07/23/2012 07:48 AMYou sir are an unprecedented boss, may I add you in game ?
Posted by Reaver
lol did you mean me or Woojr? Btw Woojr this topic is about making your tornadoes hit more, not about making more tornadoes.
Question. Does the use of whirlwind automatically cause the OH weapon to hit last? Or is a timing thing?
The reason I'm curious because with the Dino double tornado build (Run Like Wind + WW) you're using the sprint but after you get started, you use it in conjunction with WW. So I'm curious if the OH ALWAYS hits last with WW? If so, then it makes it VERY important to have a fast OH if you want strong fury generation from your tornadoes. That said, it's a kinda a double edged sword because you noted that: "Important note: I also researched Whirlwind and it seems to follow the same aps scaling values as Sprint tornadoes.
EDIT: Whirlwind Fury cost scaling with aps. "
So you generate more fury, but also spend more once you get WW'ing. Am I understanding all this correctly?
1. I´m not sure what you mean. You mean whirlwind as a "main-off, main-off, main-off, etc." sequence ending with "off"?
Nope, whirlwind alternates weapons (both aps and damage) and you can get an even or odd number of ticks, depending on its duration. That´s why I explicitly said "to maximize tornado tick damage" and not "to maximize double tornado build damage" in my post.
2. Yes the higher your tick frequency the more fury cost for whirlwind, but it´s linear. Each tick costs 5.4 on average. You will run out of fury faster with more aps, but also take into account that each WW critical hit has a (13%) chance to generate 15 fury through into the fray.
Consider that most of the fury (and damage) comes from tornadoes. Let´s compare the two:
1. damage - same frequency (leaving out), most of the time you have 4 tornadoes up while whirlwinding. Each tornado does 20% of main hand weapon damage per tick, each whirlwind tick does 36.67% (alternating) weapon damage per tick. So if there´s just 2 tornadoes hitting the same number of oponents as whirlwind, it does more damage (even more if you go high damage main and fast+stats off-hand).
2. fury generation (into the fray) - same frequency, sprint has a 20% proc coefficient and whirlwind has a 13% proc coefficient. So on average you need 5 tornado critical ticks to generate 15 fury and 7.7 whirlwind critical ticks for the same. Again, you have up to 4 (rarely 5) tornadoes up almost all of the time.
That´s why people tend to look more at optimizing sprint tornadoes than whirlwind. In an ideal d3 world, you´d have a 350 strength, 959 loh, +200% CH damage (socketed) 1100+ dps 1.20 aps mace in main hand and a 7% weapon IAS dagger with the same stats and dps in the off-hand :p
So how much of a benefit would I see switching from mace offhand to a dagger offhand with similar stats? Currently have mace + mace.
I would go from 4.33 tps to 5.67 tps if I'm interpreting the post correctly. How much of a benefit is this? Enough to sacrifice other stats like strength?
The benefit is 5.67/4.33 = 30.9% when you sprint after swinging with the off-hand. In the heat of the battle it´s impossible to conciously apply this. So it´s about half of that boost.
You should figure out yourself whether to change your off-hand. You said similar stats, I understood same dps and same str./vit/CH/loh. If the only difference between them would be the aps value, then yes, dagger as off-hand is better. If the dagger has less important stats then let it be, get some IAS somewhere instead to achieve the next best breakpoint with your maces.