Diablo® III

+x% Elemental Damage mechanic: blue clarify!

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Can you please explain why it is coded to add 2 * (x%) min damage instead of x% min + x% max?

Note: I have personally done the math and I can tell you, without doubt, that it currently adds 2 * (x%) min and ignores the max damage on your wep.


I've reached out to our developers, programmers, and QA about the current functionality. Once I have more information, I'll respond back to the thread.

Thank you for pointing this out!
The "+x% Elemental Damage" affix works by adding "x%" of your physical damage to your attack, in the form of the damage type listed.

So, really basic example:
  • Your physical damage is 100, and the item adds +3% Fire damage.
  • You gain 3 extra damage to your attacks as Fire damage.


Things this takes into account:
  • Rings, mojos, orbs (etc) that have an "X-Y" damage affix (e.g. "1-2 Damage")
  • The base damage range of your weapon, before any elemental damage is added from the affix
  • +Min or +Max affixes on weapons

(Note: It doesn't benefit from "+X-Y Elemental Damage" affixes on weapons.)

We realize the current wording for this affix can be confusing, and it's something we'd like to make more clear in the future. If you have any suggestions for how this affix could be better worded, we're definitely interested in your suggestions. Just keep in mind that space is limited in item tooltips, and that whatever we use would need to be translated into all of our supported languages.


"Increases physical damage by X% (Element) Damage"

Is roughly the same length (increasing by only one word) makes it clear what it's increasing AND makes it clear what damage type it deals.
The "+x% Elemental Damage" affix works by adding "x%" of your physical damage to your attack, in the form of the damage type listed.

So, really basic example:
Your physical damage is 100, and the item adds +3% Fire damage.
You gain 3 extra damage to your attacks as Fire damage.

Things this takes into account:
Rings, mojos, orbs (etc) that have an "X-Y" damage affix (e.g. "1-2 Damage")
The base damage range of your weapon, before any elemental damage is added from the affix
+Min or +Max affixes on weapons

(Note: It doesn't benefit from "+X-Y Elemental Damage" affixes on weapons.)

We realize the current wording for this affix can be confusing, and it's something we'd like to make more clear in the future. If you have any suggestions for how this affix could be better worded, we're definitely interested in your suggestions. Just keep in mind that space is limited in item tooltips, and that whatever we use would need to be translated into all of our supported languages.


"We realize the current wording for this affix can be confusing" I am sorry but that is such baloney. What about "adds +6% to lightning damage" is confusing? It should add 6% to any lightning damage. Are you seriously telling me I have been putting together a build with a bunch of those stats and using lightning damage skills for no reason at all? And looking for a weapon that had +lightning damage on it? Next, your going to tell me that "Increases damage of magic missile by 7%" doesn't actually increase the damage of magic missile by 7%; And that the the wording might be "confusing." I am glad that I didn't shell out for any more gear. So Tal Rasha's set does not add to the elemental damage of my skills? The mistake is that you did not set it up to work correctly. So it adds the 6% of the damage stat rather than 6% to the 105% lightning damage of the skill I am using. Honestly, this just feels like you ninja nerfed this and are having to explain it now. (i.e. Storm Crow+Tal Rasha's Adjudication+Tal Rasha's Lidless Eye( with Shock Pulse buff)+Tal Rasha's adds 3% to lightning damage set bonus+2 Stone of Jordan, or Zunimasa's Journey+Tal Rasha's Adjudication+2 Stone of Jordan, and I am sure there are more combinations that I will no longer bother to search for)
The "+x% Elemental Damage" affix works by adding "x%" of your physical damage to your attack, in the form of the damage type listed.

So, really basic example:
Your physical damage is 100, and the item adds +3% Fire damage.
You gain 3 extra damage to your attacks as Fire damage.

Things this takes into account:
Rings, mojos, orbs (etc) that have an "X-Y" damage affix (e.g. "1-2 Damage")
The base damage range of your weapon, before any elemental damage is added from the affix
+Min or +Max affixes on weapons

(Note: It doesn't benefit from "+X-Y Elemental Damage" affixes on weapons.)

We realize the current wording for this affix can be confusing, and it's something we'd like to make more clear in the future. If you have any suggestions for how this affix could be better worded, we're definitely interested in your suggestions. Just keep in mind that space is limited in item tooltips, and that whatever we use would need to be translated into all of our supported languages.


"We realize the current wording for this affix can be confusing" I am sorry but that is such baloney. What about "adds +6% to lightning damage" is confusing? It should add 6% to any lightning damage. Are you seriously telling me I have been putting together a build with a bunch of those stats and using lightning damage skills for no reason at all? And looking for a weapon that had +lightning damage on it? Next, your going to tell me that "Increases damage of magic missile by 7%" doesn't actually increase the damage of magic missile by 7%; And that the the wording might be "confusing." I am glad that I didn't shell out for any more gear. So Tal Rasha's set does not add to the elemental damage of my skills? The mistake is that you did not set it up to work correctly. So it adds the 6% of the damage stat rather than 6% to the 105% lightning damage of the skill I am using. Honestly, this just feels like you ninja nerfed this and are having to explain it now. (i.e. Storm Crow+Tal Rasha's Adjudication+Tal Rasha's Lidless Eye( with Shock Pulse buff)+Tal Rasha's adds 3% to lightning damage set bonus+2 Stone of Jordan, or Zunimasa's Journey+Tal Rasha's Adjudication+2 Stone of Jordan, and I am sure there are more combinations that I will no longer bother to search for)
Technically it adds 6% to your lightning spells too... Assuming your doing all physical damage baseline.

Honestly it should just increase DPS by 6% as whatever elemental damage it is. Screw only increasing physical damage.
+X% Damage as "Elemental"

Other languages can use whatever wording suits it, or keep the same if it is not as confusing.
Edited by Frozenkex#1835 on 8/31/2012 10:24 PM PDT
i should think the wording should be.
+x% to physical dmg, that dmg type is fire.

or
+x% fire dmg to base physical damage.
Edited by chrisloup#6305 on 8/31/2012 10:34 PM PDT
If this is the case, then tal rasha 4 set will be really OP.
Max damage is stored as the difference from min, so they are the same... I think... :)
So, i have to ask:

Why did you add elemental damage to the weapons?, when any weapon that is based on it actually seems to be penalized in one way or another for damage calculations with no benefits since you took those out except for Cold Damage, but you added an extra penalty to that one.

FYI:
No, weapon glow is not worth having inferior damage potential.
I think is getting way to complicated... i spend more time in town doing the math then actually playing something... they should simplify the math on this game... 104.3 dmg ? i mean the .3 why is that there ??? why can it be simply 104 i see myself playing diablo with a calculator by my side for every drop.
09/01/2012 03:04 AMPosted by r2ur
I think is getting way to complicated... i spend more time in town doing the math then actually playing something... they should simplify the math on this game... 104.3 dmg ? i mean the .3 why is that there ??? why can it be simply 104 i see myself playing diablo with a calculator by my side for every drop.
The ".3" is there so that the game doesn't lie to you. The math isn't even hard.

If you ever played D2 you had at LEAST two online calculators because the LCS required you to use them to know your actual values and breakpoints.
[...]

1. +x% <elemental> damage DIRECTLY increases the damage of your weapons.
Note: This essentially functions just like the +xx% damage stat found on many weapons.

2. It will increase the DPS of your weapon by 2x weapon MIN damage * weapon attack speed.

[...]


The way statement 2 is worded is misleading. It doesn't actually do that, however, else final damage range could have a minimum higher than the maximum (and a host of other associated issues).

The way "adds X% to elemental damage" appears to work, more or less, is: it adds X% of the total non-elemental minimum damage as +min and + max elemental damage.

So... if a gear set had 100-200 non elemental damage, a mod of "adds 5% to cold damage" would add +5 min cold damage and + 5 max cold damage.
Edited by Gigahurts#1817 on 9/1/2012 6:07 AM PDT
Posts: 141
I would be very interested in the interaction between the mechanics:
item: "Adds [X]% to [Element] Damage"
item: "[Element] skills deal [X]% more damage."
item: "+ [X-Y] [Element] Damage"
skills: "... [X]% Weapon damage as [Element]"
passives: "Whenever you deal [Element] damage to an enemy"

I'm looking at something like Zunimassa's Trial - It says it "Adds 8% to Poison damage" but according the to the blue, that means my skills are earning poison damage. Does this mean that any of my skill now activate Bad Medicine which reads "Whenever you deal Poison damage to an enemy, their damage is reduced by 20% for 3 seconds" ?? Including all those skills that say "As Fire/Physical" etc like Firebomb or Grap of the Dead? Also even without Zuni's Boots, If I buy any old weapon with +X-Y Poison Damage, does that also make Firebomb activate Bad Medicine?

I guess the big question is how do these elemental layers stack within items and skills. And if skills always just convert damage type to "all fire" at the end, why even have items distinguish elemental damage types at all (from what I can see all skills that deal damage explicitly say what damage type they do).
Edited by Harlequin#1309 on 9/1/2012 8:50 AM PDT
08/31/2012 02:53 PMPosted by Druin
those that thinks they know how it works, how do you know you are right? did you actually tested?


Yes.

I spent ~6 hours and ~500k gold on testing every combination I could think of with various weps all with the same dps.
I made an excel spreadsheet and tweaked formulas until I got one that effectively predicted paperdoll DPS over a spread of 10 different weps down to the decimal.

:D


is there a chance you can make this spreadsheet public? mainly so we can see the formula syou used to get an accurate paperdoll dps calculation :)
Could you also clarify how to add in the damage added by legendaries such as these?
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/item/won-khim-lau

I can't figure out how to add the "Lightning skills do X% more damage" to my DPS.


This one is impossible to perfectly test via paperdoll because the added damage DOES NOT show up in your paperdoll dps.

However, the best way to look at it is ANY time a skill has text such as "does 110% of your damage as lighting" (Fist of Thunder) then the "Lighting skills deal 15-25% more damage" stat will effect that skill's % modifier.

Example: When wearing a 20% WKL, your FoT would do (110% * 1.2) = 132% damage each hit instead of 110%.

In this way it does not increase your paperdoll dps, but does increase the damage you do.
Can you please explain why it is coded to add 2 * (x%) min damage instead of x% min + x% max?

Note: I have personally done the math and I can tell you, without doubt, that it currently adds 2 * (x%) min and ignores the max damage on your wep.


I've reached out to our developers, programmers, and QA about the current functionality. Once I have more information, I'll respond back to the thread.

Thank you for pointing this out!


Thank you so much Lylirra!
I think it's just a misleading explanation. The game shows us
'adds x% to y dmg type'
but it is meant to work as
'adds x% of your weapon dmg as y dmg type to your overall dmg'
this still not clarifies why it is calculated wrong but we saw this problem before (rubies = min/max was calculated as min*2, I think it's the same coding problem).
Makes me even more excited about by 900ish dps all physical damage butcher's sickle. Best 13 million I ever spent. Love having my storm crow 8% lightning added in now to get a Tal rasha's allegiance.
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