Diablo® III

UPDATE: Blue Confirmed : Triumvirate is BiS

UPDATE 31/08/12: It's official. Blue has confirmed. Triumvirate is intended BiS!!!!

http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/6413025317#13

So those of you concerned, this might be a bug and get 'nerfed/fixed' in the future, its not.

Chantodos can suck a big fat one.

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Hi Gents,

After multiple threads demanding Blizzard explain, why "Adds +X% to Y Elemental Dmg" works on items. I finally wanted to make this specific thread.

Historical links:

1. My thread requesting official clarification:
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/6352955844?page=1

2. Reddit post explaining this affix:
http://www.reddit.com/r/Diablo3Strategy/comments/wrejh/has_anyone_figured_out_how_adds_x_to_element/c5g1mb6

i.e. for those who dont know, the legacy legendaries like Zuni's Boots etc. had this affix "Adds +X% to Y Elemental Dmg".

In Zuni's case it was "Adds +5-6% to Poison Dmg". You would think, it would add 5-6% to VenomHydra. Wrong, since launch, it has always added PURE 5-6% TO OVERALL DPS.

You can simply understand them to effectively work as "Adds +5-6% OF Poison Dmg"

With 1.0.4 this hasnt changed.

The Triumvirate source reads:
Adds 5-6% to Fire Damage,
Adds 5-6% to Arcane Damage,
Adds 5-6% to Lightning Damage
http://www.d3lexicon.com/item/triumvirate

ie over n above all the stats, because of the distorted mechanic and wierd wording, this source provides adds 15-18% OF Fire/Arcane/Light dmg i.e. 15-18% to OVERALL DPS increase.

For a 100k Wiz like me, thats more than ANY other source can provide. And were not even counting the other wise great possible rolls on this source.


Ive tested this, as is visible from my profile page.

This makes the Trium source, hands down, the BiS (obviously all other rolls need to be high and comparable to Chantodo's, TalRashas, Occulus)

If you dont believe me, use any DPS spreadhsheet/website and put my stats in from my profile. The numbers wont add up.

Partly due to:
- Paragon's adding +3 INT per level, i have +27 INT than my sheet shows
- I logged off with Enchantress, so i think its adding her +3% Atk Speed
- But majorly the difference is the 15% that TRIUM is adding to my OVERALL DPS.

Do yourselves a favor, and grab it while its still affordable

PS: There is a reason im using a weapon with no additional elemental dmg. For same dps/stats, 'black weapons' (ie only bonus physical dmg), get the FULL benefit from the above. If i had a, say, +Fire/Light/Poison/Holy weapon, then that portion of the damage doesnt benefit from the above

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TLDR: Trium source is BiS, cause the [Adds 5-6% to Fire Damage,Adds 5-6% to Arcane Damage, Adds 5-6% to Lightning Damage] bonus adds 15-18% OF Fire/Arcane/Light dmg i.e. 15-18% to OVERALL DPS increase.

For a 100k Wiz like me, thats more than ANY other source can provide. And were not even counting the other wise great possible rolls on this source
Edited by Seolfor#1633 on 8/31/2012 9:00 PM PDT
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exactly mate
this is why I got mine while they were still cheap :)
now i need to get a new weapon that doesnt have elemetal damage :/

nice gears btw
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Good thing I got mine too like I mentioned in another thread, it's one of the best off-hand for a SC/Storm Armor wizard. Prices are rising fast though, especially the ones with APoC, so hurry up!
Edited by HolyTedMan#2257 on 8/26/2012 12:48 PM PDT
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@OP:

Just read a thread on DiabloFans that explained how we would calculate it:

I quote Morphos:

"Morphos, on 24 August 2012 - 04:27 PM, said:
The +% to ele damage works, but in a really weird way. It works like this:

Take all sources of non-elemental MINIMUM damage. This is the lower damage number on your weapon, not counting any elemental damage. If you weapon has a +ele damage affix, subtract the minimum on it from the minimum listed on the tooltip. Now add the +minimum damage from all your other items, i.e. source and jewelry. Take the appropriate percentage of that (i.e. 5% if its +5% poison damage, like from zuni boots) and then double it. It then adds that much +dmg.

Example:
You have Triumvirate with a total of +18% ele damage (6% on 3 elements).

You have a weapon with a tooltip damage range of 400-800, with a poison affix of 200 - 500, making its physical damage 200 - 300. You have a ring with +20-40 dmg, and an offhand with +100-400 damage. You add up 200 + 20 + 100 = 320. You take 18% of that = 57.6. You multiply by 2 = 115.2. Effectively it is adding +115.2 dmg, i.e. 57.6 average damage, which is likely to be something like 3000-4000ish"

And for those looking to see how much % elemental dmg can add onto you character when you change a source, I found this really great DPS spreadsheet as well:

ww w.bios-gaming.de/ d3dps / ?

Its probably as good as the Deity Wizard calculator. Anyway, I've also noticed that DIABLO PROGRESS bases its calculation off this calculator.

It seems to me that in 1.0.4, the DPS race is now about %elemental dmg and IAS given that many items can now roll additional IAS.

Anyway, I guess for those like me who've gotten a Chantodo's source, its a little too late to be switching...
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^You got a chant source that rolled way higher crit and damage than the triumvirate can roll. Your not missing much. Your damage will be slightly lower, your dps will be slightly higher (attack speed) and your utility will be much higher (10.0% CC). I wouldn't worry about it that much.
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I didnt know about that before I bough mine. Haha nice dps bonus^^. And I found it for 15kk (eu)
p.s. Just tested 2 similar weapons with elemental dmg and without one. However its the same result=/ So for me this source adds just 5% dps, not 16=/
Edited by Synthez#2846 on 8/26/2012 2:36 PM PDT
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It's my favorite post-1.0.4 find. :)
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what if i had holy damage for a weapon, would i need to get a "black weapon" too?
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08/26/2012 02:31 PMPosted by prime
what if i had holy damage for a weapon, would i need to get a "black weapon" too?


Yes, otherwise the bonus u will get is very very minor and not the full +X%

08/26/2012 01:01 PMPosted by Shandlar
^You got a chant source that rolled way higher crit and damage than the triumvirate can roll. Your not missing much. Your damage will be slightly lower, your dps will be slightly higher (attack speed) and your utility will be much higher (10.0% CC). I wouldn't worry about it that much.


I just want to clarify, the intention of this post is NOT to say that all you Chantodo users have a sh itty source.

But yes, contrary to popular belief, all rolls being similar/equal, the Trium will give much higher DPS.

In addition to my above points, the +1 random affix on Trium can roll another +INT (making it >250), a socket or Bonus +5% v/s elites or ApoC or MagicFind or Vit.

All making it even more superior.

THis post is intended to make people aware, before u put ur money blindly on Chantodos, TalRasha or Occulus, consider what that amount will get you as a Trium
Edited by Seolfor#1633 on 8/26/2012 2:48 PM PDT
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08/26/2012 02:45 PMPosted by Seolfor
Yes, otherwise the bonus u will get is very very minor and not the full +X%

Doesnt work for me. Same dps with elemental weapon and without it=/
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^Hes referring to actual damage dealt I think. It will never actually show on in game DPS sheet. Its damage added at the end based on your non-elemental damage (base weapon damage, rings/amulet/source). If your weapon is +min/max damage and +% damage thats all counted, but if its +elemental damage, only the base non-elemental damage is counted.

Therefore you should see higher actually hits if your using +min/max damage weapons with triumverate than with +fire damage.
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i tested it out and it actually works. only thing is the 2 legendary wands are +elemental damage weapon (chantodo's is fire, slorak is lightning)

you'd need to use a rare wand, and everyone basically has to buy a new one because 90% of wizards use a +elemental dmg wand instead of +min/max physical.
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My profile is updated with my new Triumvirate and you can see the DPS increase. It added 17k DPS for me vs. my old source. Pic here: http://i.imgur.com/Pjlfg.jpg
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^Actually since +min/max damage is the only way for +% damage to stack properly all the really high dps players are already using +min/max physical. All 1100 dps+ wands will be +min/max not elemental.

I just want to clarify, the intention of this post is NOT to say that all you Chantodo users have a sh itty source.

But yes, contrary to popular belief, all rolls being similar/equal, the Trium will give much higher DPS.

In addition to my above points, the +1 random affix on Trium can roll another +INT (making it >250), a socket or Bonus +5% v/s elites or ApoC or MagicFind or Vit.


Hmm lets do the math cause that doesn't seem like its going to work out that way...

Say I if I have no source on my base stats are 2250 int, 40% crit chance, 400% crit damage, +20-40 damage, +27% attack speed, and a high end min/max physical wand that's 550-1100 damage (1155 dps).

So which is more dps;

Triumverate;
100-400 damage
+6% Fire
+6% Lightning
+6% Arcane
8.5% Crit
+275 Int (random rolled 'illustrious')
+70 Vit (random rolled 'illustrious')
+14 Max AP

Which would add up to 179k unbuffed dps

Or

Chantodo's Force
125-475 Damage
+9% Attack Speed
+10.0% Crit
+305 Int (Random Rolled 'Illustrious')
+70 Vit (Random Rolled 'Illustrious')
+12% Spectral Blades Damage

Which would add up to 173k unbuffed...

Alrighty, guess you win this one. The +18% definitely outpaces the higher min/max damage, higher crit, higher int, and attack speed on chantodo's. Didn't expect that tbh.
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aw so I only get +12% because my weapon has fire damage?
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08/26/2012 05:19 PMPosted by Jars
aw so I only get +12% because my weapon has fire damage?


Much Less because it only adds it to the physical damage components (Base dmg, rings, source, amulet)

Triumvirate <3

Fyi it does not add 15% dps, a bit less which I am at a loss to explain.
Tested this with a blue source vs a triumvirate with same int(+-5) and same avg dmg(+-5)
Dps difference was about 10%~ vs expected (+5+5+6)
Edited by skyQuake#1457 on 8/26/2012 5:36 PM PDT
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Do you think this applies to the Tal Rasha set bonus that reads:

"Fire skills deal 3% more damage" etc?

Also what about Tal's amy that has:
"Adds 6% to Arcane Damage"

Would that just give you a 6% DPS boost if you had no Arcane on your weap?
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If I can't snipe my next offhand, it's all your faults.
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08/26/2012 05:34 PMPosted by Goku
If I can't snipe my next offhand, it's all your faults.


Thats why u buy first post later :)

Do you think this applies to the Tal Rasha set bonus that reads:

"Fire skills deal 3% more damage" etc?

Also what about Tal's amy that has:
"Adds 6% to Arcane Damage"

Would that just give you a 6% DPS boost if you had no Arcane on your weap?


No to fire skills deal 3% more dmg
Yes to add 6% to arcane dmg. Should work same way as Trium or Zumis
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