Diablo® III

Diablo 3 vs. Torchlight 2 vs. Path of Exile

Being a fairly new ARPG gamer with questions as to what game to play or continue playing, what do you guys think Diablo 3 does wrong that other modern ARPGs (T2, POE) do right, and can they be implemented into the game in the future? Additionally, what does Diablo 3 do right that these other games could improve on?

Hope this can be a drama free discussion of the variations in game systems between these games and specifically what Diablo 3 could implement that is successful in the others!
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People who just want a D2 with high resolution graphics, different story and classes/skills
---------->path of exile
People who want to play a totally different traditional hack&slash arpg game, with mod support.
---------->torchlight2
People who.....I don't know. but it's a blizzard game, it's a diablo game.....
---------->diablo3
they improved graphics, combat, auto gold loot. new story, class, AH. removed stats/skill tree.
imo, the biggest problem of d3 is
1.they gave monsters awesome affixes to improve the combat, but they forgot to give players ability to counter that. the result, everyone stack main stat/vit/ar/cc/cd/loh and kite as the only tactics.
2.they took out stats/skill tree, but most items inherit D2 design which make most of them are crap. they should know, items and skills/stats should be designed together in a DIABLO game.
3.they care too much about the balance and economy. which make this game more like a MMO. and most diablo player don't like MMO, at least, don't want diablo to be like a MMO.
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Combat is much more intense and dynamic than in any other isometric ARPG;

The health globe and resource system rewards the player for being more aggressive;

The skill system encourages creativity and experimentation;

The rune system allows you to customize your skills;

Automatic stat allocation and the ability to change skills at any time makes you less afraid of screwing up;

The removal of D2's annoying features (limited ammo, locked chests, potion spam, etc.), except maybe for repairs;

The auction house allows players to safely buy and sell items;

The narrative is better integrated to gameplay;

Followers are both useful in combat and interesting storywise.
Edited by JohnnyZeWolf#1953 on 9/12/2012 2:36 PM PDT
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Posts: 938
09/12/2012 02:11 PMPosted by JohnnyZeWolf
Followers are both useful in combat and interesting storywise.


No they are not. They are both incredibly annoying, and totally useless.

In d2 they sometimes did MORE damage than the hero.

09/12/2012 02:11 PMPosted by JohnnyZeWolf
The narrative is better integrated to gameplay;


What are you smoking? The story was a jumbled mess. Nothing important happened in act 2 for the most part.

09/12/2012 02:11 PMPosted by JohnnyZeWolf
The auction house allows players to safely buy and sell items;


It also allows for gold farmers, hacking, abuse, and finally failure in the system to aggravate players and take their money.

The removal of stat points prevents the player from ending up stuck with a worthless build;


It also makes your character automatically the same as every other character. Unique abilities have been removed.

Combat is much more intense and dynamic than in any other isometric ARPG;

The health globe and resource system rewards the player for being more aggressive and gets rid of the need to spam potion;

The skill system encourages creativity and experimentation;

The rune system allows you to customize your skills;

The ability to change skills at any time makes you less afraid of screwing up;


All of these are just plain wrong. Experimentation means taking risk. This game removed the risks of using stats and skills.

Without risks there is no reward. Diablo 3 is not rewarding.
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I believe:
Diablo 3
- make real money
- those who are already rich, and don't want to leave the game
- those who already paid for the game, and don't want to try other new games

Torchlight 2
- cartoon graphics, great combat mechanism (on par with Diablo 3)
- straight forward, still have some customization

Path of Exile
- customization (skills/runes and stats can be mixed up with different classes)
- innovation (not new, but willing to improve, eg. barter system instead of gold system)
- free (starting open beta, or open stress test - such as this coming week)

There are problems with each game, no one is better than the other one currently. They invest on different part of the game, and it depends on what you prefer.
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Combat is much more intense and dynamic than in any other isometric ARPG;

The health globe and resource system rewards the player for being more aggressive;

The skill system encourages creativity and experimentation;

The rune system allows you to customize your skills;

Automatic stat allocation and the ability to change skills at any time makes you less afraid of screwing up;

The removal of D2's annoying features (limited ammo, locked chests, potion spam, etc.), except maybe for repairs;

The auction house allows players to safely buy and sell items;

The narrative is better integrated to gameplay;

Followers are both useful in combat and interesting storywise.


And all those good features are sub-par to most of the games that I played.
Compare to other MMORPG (note: most of the MMORPG games are ARPG already, except for Atlantica and few other ones). I would say Survival Project is a much better ARPG than Diablo 3 if you focus on combat mechanism.
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why everyone that complain about diablo 3 is either using starcraft 2 account or new free account???
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Posts: 16
I never tried Torchlight (neither of them), but between D3 and PoE, I stick all the way with PoE, since I've joined the beta I haven't played D3 (except like 10 hours total in the last 2 month).
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Combat is much more intense and dynamic than in any other isometric ARPG;

The health globe and resource system rewards the player for being more aggressive;

The skill system encourages creativity and experimentation;

The rune system allows you to customize your skills;

Automatic stat allocation and the ability to change skills at any time makes you less afraid of screwing up;

The removal of D2's annoying features (limited ammo, locked chests, potion spam, etc.), except maybe for repairs;

The auction house allows players to safely buy and sell items;

The narrative is better integrated to gameplay;

Followers are both useful in combat and interesting storywise.


You go girl! Earn that $5!
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Path of Exile (Good) - Insane amounts of Class customization. Want to be Necromantic Death Knight that uses massive two handers while summoning hordes of undead? Want to be a Spellsword? You can build those characters in PoE.

It has astrong D2 asthetic. Very dark and forboding atmosphere

Voice acting is pretty good

Good difficulty curve. Some of those early dungeons are brutal, but beatable.

Free to play

Path of Exile (Bad) - The combat is kinda of slow ala D2, so compared to Torchlight or D3 you'll move and fight at a much slower and deliberate pace.

In game economy takes a while to get used to as there is no gold in game

You have to be online to play it, but since it's free, this isnt a big deal.

PoE os basically D2 with much better graphics and updated passive skill tree. that can be good or bad depending on your point of view.

Torchlight 2 (Good) - Fast, fun combat, massive amount of loot that can at times be loot overload. Good amount of class customization, tho not on the level of Exile.

Music is great

Torchlight 2 (Bad) - Graphics are very cartoony and the game on normal is super easy
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Guys admit it torchlight 2 is way better the only thing they dont have is the auction house which we all know is a money scam for blizzard. It would have been more resonable had the gold farmers not ruined the economy, gg blizzard.

torchlight 2 simply has more to offer in terms of content.

the graphics are personal opinion too but id be stupid to argue and play a game for straight graphics.

and dude above if its too easy on normalyplay on veteran or elite i have both diablo 3 and torchlight 2 and have invested more hours into torchlight 2 because its more fun than d3.

Oh yeah mods make for nearly infinate replay value, mmmm btw blizzard wheres pvp....oh yeah it's not happening.....corporate rip off
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Hello,

I don't normally post here, but this interested me, so I thought I'd swing by and give my thoughts (whatever they're worth!).

I played and enjoyed both D1 and D2 (and Torchlight 1 for that matter). I only just got D3 and Torchlight 2 and am enjoying both of them, but I can't speak for Path of Exile as I'm not really aware of it.

I'm a fairly casual gamer, so not really into MMORPG thing and I tend to prefer single player to multi-player. My thoughts are very much coloured by that approach.

I stress that I do like both games and I am still relatively new to both (being new acquisitions). so I haven't got that far through them. However, I do find myself more drawn to Torchlight 2. Now that could be because it's closer to what I'm familiar with (D2 and Torchlight), but I think it might be because it has an addictive quality to it that the early levels of D3 seem to be missing (in my opinion). I like the freedom I have in T2 early on to customise the character. It does seem that you can do that at later levels in D3, so perhaps it is too early to say and I am happy to admit to being wrong!

The customisation means that I can see myself playing through T2 with the same class repeatedly to try out new builds. In D3 I'm not sure I'm going to play each class more than once. That's a double-edged sword in some ways; in D3 I can play everything the character has to offer without starting it all again. In T2 you do need to try out the same character again. I thought I would object to the T2 approach and prefer the D3 approach, but I actually appear to be enjoying T2 more at present and do feel inclined to go through it again.

I do get the impression that gear is more plentiful and sells for more in T2, whereas it seems pretty scarce so far in D3. Again, not having got that far, I'm not sure how fair that is yet. I like the concept of crafting and have experimented a little with it. I haven't tried the Auction House - the concept doesn't really grab me, to be honest. Perhaps I'm missing something?

The variety of options on offer with T2 is good too - the whole use of pets, spells, fish, etc. gives you lots of options and, as a gamer, I tend to like choice.

In terms of style, D3 is more adult, grim and dark, but I also like the colourful steampunk of T2. Personal preference is for the grit and darkness of D3, but T2 is still enjoyable and the two do feel different in that regard, which is a good thing in my opinion - it provides variety.

So that's my tuppence worth. T2 edges it at present, but that may change once I get further into D3 and find out what else it has to offer.
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D3 pro's

Fast paced action I only need two clicks to join a public game and slash n farm

Legendary Weapons with unique affixes

The map-system is awesome

D3 Cons
Charachters are not unique enough, even with legendarys every DH ends up with manticore n barb with skorn etc.

Inferno is too easy, gear up for 1 mil and faceroll (MP shoulda been like easy, medium, hard imo)

AH; im kind of pro +con to this but the problem is that I get very lazy and just spend my gold there and whoops from stuck on act II I can faceroll the rest of game

Keywardens never dropping the keys to the only thing that keeps up my interest in game, too many runs with 5 stacks without keys getting dropped

Torchlight 2 is not my cup of tea

I just started with POE but here I go

Pro's: Skill tree for personalised leveling

Con's: Being to used to D3 and Skyrim I have hard time knowing where to go to finish quests
Trading is hard to learn with the barter system especially If you got ADD like me
Edited by Sodril#2307 on 11/14/2012 9:58 AM PST
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The skill system encourages creativity and experimentation;


Is that why there are sooooo many unique and interesting builds in D3 that are farming high lvl content?


The rune system allows you to customize your skills;


How exactly is this rune system any better than what the other ARPG's are doing? From what I can see players are bored that every class has access to any of the runes at any time. Not to mention how most classes use the same runes because they are obviously better than the others.


Automatic stat allocation and the ability to change skills at any time makes you less afraid of screwing up;


and don't forget bored. Where is the RPG in this game? Where's the meaningful choices?


The auction house allows players to safely buy and sell items;


With the added benefit of hating that the AH's are in the game at all? Hating that drops are built around the AH so that you spend time in this antisocial room playing the D3 stockmarket instead of really playing the game?


The narrative is better integrated to gameplay;


Wow I know I haven't played in awhile but last I checked the community was begging for a free roam option so that they didn't have to hear the same friggin lines of dialogue over and over and over.
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If D3 incorporated some of TL2's features, I'd be happy:

  • Enchant items
  • Add sockets to items
  • Non-TL2: Survival Arena


The first two completely fix the current drop quality problem. The last allows me to play without having to use waypoints or listen to any more dialogue.
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Ive played all three. I was expecting to hate D3 the most of the three given the very vocal trashing of the game.

Heres what i found:

POE looks good, has a seemingly complex skill system thats less complex than it looks since they give you every roles options...things you wouldnt use...and that makes it look crazy complicated, in reality there a much smaller section that your class will use and you ignore most of the "web"

Theres no respec, so if you want to try something new...back to the starter zones on an alt.

TL has decent combat, you get a pet, it has good music. The graphics are something either you love or hate. Its a well done game from what i saw, its just the graphics piss me off.

Now to this game, D3. What this game excels above the other two, in my mind, is combat, world immersion, and overall action/entertainment value.

D3 uses a fantastic physics engine. What this does is make the world feel more alive, it makes your robes flow and move with you in a natural fashion. Your every swing has an aoe effect on the surrounding grass. When you break stuff it explodes in a pleasing manner.

Also the rune system, which is a step in the opposite direction compared to D2, gives you the ability to try new stuff out, which breaks the monotony.

The AH system, you love it or hate it. Yes it does seem that your class gets more drops for other classes. If you enjoy AH mechanics its a fantastic addition. Personally i love hunting for steals in the AH and playing the market. It adds a level of meta-game to D3.

Bottom line comes down to whats more imporant to you. Are you someone who has played D2 for the last 12 years and consider it the next coming of god? If so D3 will enrage you...its...*gasp*...different. POE fits the bill a bit more if your stuck in the past still. D3 is more of an evolution to D2 where POE seems more like D2 with modern graphics.
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09/12/2012 02:39 PMPosted by Zoul
Followers are both useful in combat and interesting storywise.


No they are not. They are both incredibly annoying, and totally useless.

In d2 they sometimes did MORE damage than the hero.

The narrative is better integrated to gameplay;


What are you smoking? The story was a jumbled mess. Nothing important happened in act 2 for the most part.

The auction house allows players to safely buy and sell items;


It also allows for gold farmers, hacking, abuse, and finally failure in the system to aggravate players and take their money.

The removal of stat points prevents the player from ending up stuck with a worthless build;


It also makes your character automatically the same as every other character. Unique abilities have been removed.

Combat is much more intense and dynamic than in any other isometric ARPG;

The health globe and resource system rewards the player for being more aggressive and gets rid of the need to spam potion;

The skill system encourages creativity and experimentation;

The rune system allows you to customize your skills;

The ability to change skills at any time makes you less afraid of screwing up;


All of these are just plain wrong. Experimentation means taking risk. This game removed the risks of using stats and skills.

Without risks there is no reward. Diablo 3 is not rewarding.


Then get the hell off our game and stop commenting on the diablo 3 Forums. Get off my game and go play Path of Exile if you want a a game where you use the SAME SKILL OVER AND OVER, Ranged is the only way you can excel at PvP, The items have half useless stats on them, The classes are bland and make no sense to any other APRG ever made. No gold..... Very hard to understand user interface. Very useless Gems and Orbs. Ill admit its leveling system, and End game content is much better, but !@#$ diablo 3 is just going to get better anyways. I hate people like you. (P.S. I know you said nothing about path of exile, that was a mix between you and the OP, cause he asked about the game.)
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1. Just because people don't like D3 doesn't mean they can't use the forums. We payed for the game same as you. Get over it.

2. You can't criticise POE for using the same skill over and over because A. you don't have to use the same skill over and over theres a ton of builds genius! B. All ARPG's do this, heck D3 is even worse than POE. Everyone uses the same few skills to spam. I watched a WW barb on youtube and it was seriously the most boring crap Ive seen in this kind of game.

3. Ranged is not the only way to excel at pvp in POE. You don't know anything so quit pretending.

4. Your seriously going to accuse POE of having useless stats compared to D3??? We have much better itemization as a whole. D3 has TONS of useless stats. I could give you a long long list of stats useful for various builds in POE, D3 has a very short list of good stats.

5. Classes are bland? Compared to what? The Barbarian??? Your clueless

6. No gold is a very very good thing. Anyone who isn't a giant fanboy should be able to see teh advantages. You don't have to deal with the stupid inflation and lack of gold sinks. The interface isn't hard to understand if you actually take time to learn it, its time to move past games that 5 year olds can play.

7. Oh my God. Did you really say useless gems and orbs??? I was somewhat guessing when I said fanboy earlier but now its obviously true. What is wrong with you?
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