Diablo® III

Question for you GW2 dudes....

What are the end-game rewards?

I haven't played GW2, but I have researched it.

I played DAoC for a very long time. The path in that game was: level a toon, build/decide on a template, acquire that template, realm VS realm (RvR) however you wanted to gain realm rank (RR) - RvR was the end-game.

GW2 doesn't have RR, the nasty hard Explorable dungeons give you different LOOKING loot but not better stat.s, and legendary weapons are a long-term goal but again, only affect LOOK.

So basically what I'm seeing is once you reach L80, there is no way to improve the innate effectiveness of your character!

Any insight?
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85 Worgen Mage
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This is a really cool idea. I wonder if it will weed out the douches. Bosses won't become faceroll because of gear progression, but because of skill progression. This sounds like a good change. Props to Anet.
Edited by Plotinator#1872 on 9/23/2012 12:52 AM PDT
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1 Dwarf Rogue
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Most people play end-games for bragging rights, not for extra few points of stats.

Take away the title/mount/achievement rewards from WoW endgame raids, and take away the unique model/colour from raiding gears, and I'll guarantee you most people won't even bother with raids aside from maybe LFR.

GW2 realizes this and so they added cosmetic to endgame rewards.

Now I'm not saying their endgame's GAMEPLAY is fun or groundbreaking or anything, just saying that they took the right approach to the reward direction for their endgames.
Edited by Fubi#1564 on 9/23/2012 2:02 AM PDT
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Loled at Orion. Criticises every Blizzard game, praises the others (GW2, TL2). Get a life dude. xD
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Guild Wars 2 is a "vanity" grind, and yes, grindng those explorable dungeons are tedious. Once you get the exotic gear your stats are basically maxed and instead you just get gear for looks.

You ideally participate mainly in sPvP or WvWvW, or some of the more important events around the world.

If you really want to work for something, you have to REALLY put a crapload of effort in to forging your Legendary weapon. I don't believe there is legendary armor though so that caps at 80 Exotic.
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09/22/2012 10:48 PMPosted by Zapados
So basically what I'm seeing is once you reach L80, there is no way to improve the innate effectiveness of your character!


I don't know one player that was full 80 exotics the moment they hit level 80.

09/22/2012 10:48 PMPosted by Zapados
GW2 doesn't have RR, the nasty hard Explorable dungeons give you different LOOKING loot but not better stat.s, and legendary weapons are a long-term goal but again, only affect LOOK.


Explorable tokens to get exotic items is pretty much the end game, WvWvW and Structered PvP could be considered end-game or things to do when you're level 80, there's also Karma gear, PvP gear, culture gear, order gear, many different weapon and armor looks. I think as of right now, only having a single level 80 zone is lacking, I hope they add another zone soon, though I haven't yet run out of things to do nor am I bored yet.

If you're looking for a WoW type clone in end-game, you will be dissappointed.
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Thanks for the responses so far!

I'm not a WoW player by a long shot. Who cares about new armor skins? Doesn't improve your toon one bit. Maybe you instill some kind of fear..."zOMG he has the crazy skin, must be good because he plays 24/7!" But your dude is the same as someone else in full exotics who looks more n00bish but didn't put in the extra 3748982392 hours. The 3748982392 hours deserves some better stat.s!

I'm looking for a DAoC clone in end-game. I have high hopes for ESO but that's for another thread....

Why DAoC was so great is that RvR (read WvWvW) was the end-game, but it also contained rewards. For killing guys or completing objectives in RvR you got Realm Points (RPs) that you could spend on unique abilities for your toons or improved stat.s. It was a hugely graduated curve, so to reach say RR5 wasn't incredibly taxing, but to reach say RR13 was nearly impossible. Only a few people ever reached it. And the power difference between a RR13 and an RR9 let's say was not overwhelming.

Basically GW2 needs to add realm points! They need unique abilities and powers that you can earn via RvR.

TLDR: When is GW2 going to add some sort of continuing reward system (end-game rewards) to WvWvW?
Edited by Zapados#1900 on 9/24/2012 7:40 AM PDT
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Who cares about new armor skins? Doesn't improve your toon one bit.


Some people seem to like gear for the sake of making your toon look different. Just look at Team Fortress 2, Valve has made quite a bit of profit from making the game free and simply monetizing hats. Most of these hats don't even do anything, they're just cool looking hats!

Same with Moba games like LoL, much of their profit comes from selling cosmetic skins and avatars.

09/24/2012 05:45 AMPosted by Zapados
TLDR: When is GW2 going to add some sort of continuing reward system (end-game rewards) to WvWvW?


Pvp should be fun for the sake of great gameplay and the thrill of beating your opponent. It shouldn't need rewards or drops in the first place, that's what PvE is for.
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09/24/2012 05:45 AMPosted by Zapados
TLDR: When is GW2 going to add some sort of continuing reward system (end-game rewards) to WvWvW?


You should make a constructive thread on their suggestion forums, providing convincing points for them to consider/take if this kind of reward system is to be applied.

https://forum-en.guildwars2.com/forum/game/suggestions
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09/24/2012 06:54 AMPosted by Strawhat
Who cares about new armor skins? Doesn't improve your toon one bit.


Some people seem to like gear for the sake of making your toon look different. Just look at Team Fortress 2, Valve has made quite a bit of profit from making the game free and simply monetizing hats. Most of these hats don't even do anything, they're just cool looking hats!

Same with Moba games like LoL, much of their profit comes from selling cosmetic skins and avatars.

09/24/2012 05:45 AMPosted by Zapados
TLDR: When is GW2 going to add some sort of continuing reward system (end-game rewards) to WvWvW?


Pvp should be fun for the sake of great gameplay and the thrill of beating your opponent. It shouldn't need rewards or drops in the first place, that's what PvE is for.


This post needs to be framed in gold and posted all over the WoW forums.
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09/24/2012 07:37 AMPosted by Atterana


Some people seem to like gear for the sake of making your toon look different. Just look at Team Fortress 2, Valve has made quite a bit of profit from making the game free and simply monetizing hats. Most of these hats don't even do anything, they're just cool looking hats!

Same with Moba games like LoL, much of their profit comes from selling cosmetic skins and avatars.



Pvp should be fun for the sake of great gameplay and the thrill of beating your opponent. It shouldn't need rewards or drops in the first place, that's what PvE is for.


This post needs to be framed in gold and posted all over the WoW forums.


When my WoW account was active as Kurnea I told people on the forums all that time that pvpers shouldn't need rewards provided that the pvp is entertaining.
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I dunno, DAoC is widely regarded as the best PvP MMORPG ever, and it has rewards, but they aren't "game breaking." Just little perks that make your toon stronger or allows him to have a few more aces up his sleeve.

Don't you believe that if you hit level 80, got your exotics, and then RvRed for like an additional 1000 hours in WvW that your toon should be innately better than someone who played a total of 100 hours to get max level + exotics?
Edited by Zapados#1900 on 9/24/2012 8:38 AM PDT
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No i think when i fight somebody Victory should be determined by who played better not who played the most if someone played for 100 ours but is better than me they should win plain and simple
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09/24/2012 12:30 PMPosted by Discordian
No i think when i fight somebody Victory should be determined by who played better not who played the most if someone played for 100 ours but is better than me they should win plain and simple


Don't forget it's an MMORPG. You *should* be advancing your toon to make him stronger. If you are so concerned about a perfectly balanced game, try playing some good FPSes like Counter-Strike Source.
Edited by Zapados#1900 on 9/24/2012 1:15 PM PDT
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09/24/2012 01:14 PMPosted by Zapados
Don't forget it's an MMORPG. You *should* be advancing your toon to make him stronger. If you are so concerned about a perfectly balanced game, try playing some good FPSes like Counter-Strike Source.


For a while - is it forever, though? I guess the answer to that question varies from person to person. Speaking for myself, I like an end, because then I can play alts. I've seen many MMOs where people complain about lack on an end game, but I have personally never felt that to be an issue. I enjoy the ride. The end game for me is another alt.
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why? why does it being an MMORPG mean that i should be making my toon stronger forever? there has to be a limit somewhere. otherwise you end up with over inflated numbers trivializing earlier gear and content to the point of uselessness. in gw2 the limit just comes earlier. then you tweak,perfect your playstyle and get better at the game, which is what i'm doing right now.
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09/24/2012 01:28 PMPosted by Discordian
why? why does it being an MMORPG mean that i should be making my toon stronger forever? there has to be a limit somewhere. otherwise you end up with over inflated numbers trivializing earlier gear and content to the point of uselessness. in gw2 the limit just comes earlier. then you tweak,perfect your playstyle and get better at the game, which is what i'm doing right now.


...then you quit! =(

But no, look at DAoC, a well-played RR5 VS a poorly played RR10, the RR5 would win. Skill was the bigger factor, and the diminishing returns on RR meant anything past like RR6 was a grind, RR9-10 was like seriously hardcore, and RR11+ was like "life-long" players. So things balanced out, even though you were still working towards the next reward.

But you guys are right...I didn't play DAoC end-game RvR for the RR, I played it because it was fun. The RR was definitely nice to have (got my cake and ate it too!), and WvW *SHOULD* have some form of RR. That said, I'm not sure why I'm hesitant to mess around with GW2...I guess it's just the $60 and time investment...I know I shouldn't use up that much time on it, LOL.
Edited by Zapados#1900 on 9/24/2012 7:17 PM PDT
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Why this obsession with the "end-game" ? Why do people assume that the "real game" is the "end game" and the road to max level is just an annoyance ? Kinda like saying - I'll skip the rest of the meals - I want my dessert only and plenty of it. It's only the dessert that matters anyways.

The best part of any game, including MMOs is supposed to be the "mid game" - between the start and the moment you quit it. Hope you read their official position about "endgame re imagined" - it's on the main site. The so called "endgame" has dozens of forms and is available at all levels.

Right now, the endgame for me and my 80 Ranger is trying to become better in action fighting, stat building and skill setting. I can turn my shortbow trapper into a rather decent Greatsword meleer (moderate effectiveness but lots of fun) - the gameplay is totally different.

I have not even finished the story - I saved the last dungeon for some rainy day. I also keep the sPvP and the WvW for that purpose, when I'll get bored of PvE or it will start feeling like a grind. Not happening very soon though.
Edited by Maegglin#1669 on 9/24/2012 9:25 PM PDT
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