Diablo® III

Request for response on state of Monks..

(Locked)

We feel that monks are in a decent place at the moment, and are a solid class in terms of power, but there are some things that we would like to address with the class. Namely: we would like to delve deeper into fulfilling the fantasy of what it means to be a monk.

Currently, monks spend a lot of their time applying an assortment of DPS buffs through the use of utility and survivability buttons. The bulk of monk damage comes from very passive gameplay, like healing yourself to get a damage buff, or applying Sweeping Winds and not looking at it again. We want to give players who enjoy the fantasy of being a blur of fists and feet a more active playstyle, and we’d love to play up some other fun mechanics as well.

For example, one possibility we’re considering is changing one of Dashing Strike’s runes to allow players to travel further with the skill so that it can serve as a mobility tool, but at the cost of imposing a cooldown. Another possibility we’re exploring is making Lashing Tail Kick feel more compelling by moving the knockback component to a rune, or changing a rune to remove the knockback and instead increase the damage more meaningfully. These types of changes are not minor tweaks, however. We want to make sure we take some time to make meaningful changes that improve the overall play experience for these sacred warriors.


I wont make this long cause it will be pointless for this guy to even understand the situation anyways just count how many people are selling their monks on monk forum and say that words again if you really care about those people who spend 100+ hours to the game...
Don't worry, just check the 1.05 patch, about all the skills changes for Barb, Wizard and DH... They got a lot of changes (nerf and a lot of buff)... and all our monk got almost no change (nerf our best defensive skill -50%)...

I think Blizz doesn't care about monk and witch doctor...
I think I just looked through nine pages of complete !@#$%^-s. What the *!@# is so wrong with the monk?

My opinion? You all suck donkey junk at playing video games that require $%^-ing skill. I love my monk, and keep in mind I have not farmed for 1000 hours, in fact I play 5 days a week, maybe 1-2 hours a day. I completed inferno before the 1.04 patch came out and before my monk was good. I only have 30k damage, and I wreck shop....

So where is the disconnect between all of you and me? I don't think I have the best of gear, although I built my monk very smart. I utilized what I need, stacking a LOT of LoH, crit damage and chance, and resistances.

I can solo act4 inferno in a 4-man game, and when I play coop I am almost ALWAYS the only one who doesn't die, compared to every other paper mache class out there (besides the barbarian).

Sure they do more damage, but ffs people give the complaining a rest. I am SO happy they aren't making changes to my monk, besides maybe a few minor ones. I have plans for upgrades in the near future to bring my damage up to about 80-120k, tripling my output, and only sacrificing some resistances.

Quit your monks everybody, please GOD quit. Then the market value on our gear will be lower. haha. Have a nice day


Cool story bro. 31k dps w/ 5300 armor. After the 1.05 nerfs to enchantress and STI, im curious how that extra attack speed loss will affect that dps and your new armor rating at around 4100 works for you while u are farming act 4 solo.
Edited by Drakkin#1965 on 10/3/2012 9:20 PM PDT
Posts: 1,063
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Suggestion... make the loot more fun... fix the game... done! Hey, I figured it out guys!
The set bonus,especially the 3 set of Inna is WTH useless !No matter dps or defence, monk is too weaker than barb!
10/03/2012 09:19 PMPosted by Habs54
Don't worry, just check the 1.05 patch, about all the skills changes for Barb, Wizard and DH... They got a lot of changes (nerf and a lot of buff)... and all our monk got almost no change (nerf our best defensive skill -50%)...


A geared barb is not even affected by the nerf however even a geared monk is affected by the nerf lol in PTR
Can someone point me to the official explanation for the following >>

pre 1.05 Seize the Initiative: 1 armor for 1 dex
pre 1.05 Nerves of Steel: 1 armor for 1 vit

post 1.05 Seize the Initiative: 0.5 armor for 1 dex
pre 1.05 Nerves of Steel: 1 armor for 1 vit

Why is one of the critical skills for one of the two tank classes being nerfed in half while the exactly equivalent skill for the other tank class being left untouched?

The closest I can find is this:

"This will result in anywhere from 750 to 1250 armor [lost] for most monks (depending on your Dex) which is comparable to the mitigation lost by other classes."

But that doesn't address the issue of the direct comparison of these two passives or the issue that it's much easier for barbs to get armor, and will be even moreso post 1.05 since, after all, their primary stat gives armor without their even having to use a passive.

Someone might say something about monks benefiting from dex via dodge but that's a joke; the relative benefits of dodge vs. armor have been dealt with elsewhere.
10/03/2012 09:18 PMPosted by Pyroboom
I see we're in need of a downvote button for blue post.


+1

Blizzard just showed us how utterly blind they are to the community.
I have plans for upgrades in the near future to bring my damage up to about 80-120k, tripling my output, and only sacrificing some resistances.


Good luck with that.

The fact remains that, at higher MP on the PTR we are forced to take STI even in it's nerfed state. I don't think we should be forced into a shield, and be a walking aura which is what is currently feels like at MP8+.
With that comment Vaelflare will surely be on the top 10 most hated Community Managers now
There are only two possiblities for monks post 1.0.5 if it goes live unchanged:

1) Reroll and play a BARB
2) Quit wasting your time on this

Monks are dead. This becomes a ONE CLASS GAME. A game of Barbs.
a simple solution would be increasing those unpopular skills' damage !!
Posts: 12,565
I've already rerolled Barb and Witch Doctor.
I'll probably have a Demon Hunter come 1.05 as well.

Shelving my Monk with these types of responses. I don't see any changes hitting 1.05, so I guess I'll wait and hope until 1.06.
I don't even know what to say Blizzard...
Okay though, Monk is Monk
We feel that monks are in a decent place at the moment, and are a solid class in terms of power, but there are some things that we would like to address with the class. Namely: we would like to delve deeper into fulfilling the fantasy of what it means to be a monk.

Currently, monks spend a lot of their time applying an assortment of DPS buffs through the use of utility and survivability buttons. The bulk of monk damage comes from very passive gameplay, like healing yourself to get a damage buff, or applying Sweeping Winds and not looking at it again. We want to give players who enjoy the fantasy of being a blur of fists and feet a more active playstyle, and we’d love to play up some other fun mechanics as well.

For example, one possibility we’re considering is changing one of Dashing Strike’s runes to allow players to travel further with the skill so that it can serve as a mobility tool, but at the cost of imposing a cooldown. Another possibility we’re exploring is making Lashing Tail Kick feel more compelling by moving the knockback component to a rune, or changing a rune to remove the knockback and instead increase the damage more meaningfully. These types of changes are not minor tweaks, however. We want to make sure we take some time to make meaningful changes that improve the overall play experience for these sacred warriors.


Well at least now we all know what the problem is. Blizzard isn't fixing monks not because they don't care, but because they don't realize how gimped they really are. This is solvable. Better that they're ignorant than apathetic.
10/03/2012 05:35 PMPosted by Vaeflare
We feel that monks are in a decent place at the moment

My monk says: Your flaws are revealed!
Shut this thread down, just shut it down,...these people are all bad monks and miserable complainers too, i just put on crap gear on the ptr just to see how it would go and i actually did pretty well with 30k dps and 600 resists, also i switched different skills around and tbh every possible spec seemed just as viable as any , only problem was the passives...dont make me make a video of it lol look here folks , if you want to use other skills and be "different" than just do it , because it is doable and i know because i just did it rofl.

Also monks are mainly balanced on the endgame side of things, if they really buff everything like you guys want dont you realize that the monks with higher end gear would now totally overpower all other classes?
Edited by Incorporated#1508 on 10/3/2012 9:38 PM PDT
This post proves how clueless devs are in terms of Monks being... Monk-ish.

This "blue" statement confirms that I will let my Monk collect dust. You can "explore" all you want, but when there's 1 Monk build for 99% of the players, something is wrong.

If you want to make "meaningful changes" sincerely, listen to the Monk community. There's many great posts on the plight on Monks. Here's a brief run-down

Attack Speed for Monks doesn't feel "quick and agile" like a Monk should be. There are not enough abilities to increase this trait for Monks.
Generators
• don't deal enough damage
• don't return enough resources
• Not enough variety
• They require a Monk to stand still, while EVERY OTHER CLASS can generate resources while mobile.

Spenders
• Aren't worth a skill slot
• Resource costs is high versus damage output
o Sweeping Winds has no proc coefficient (0.00!). Make it low, but add one. Have PickUp Radius increase the radius or duration of this ability.
o Seven Sided Strike has a huge cost AND a long cooldown. Remove/lower the cooldown significantly, keep the cost.
o Tempest Rush feels lackluster compared to Whirlwind. Less damage, less utility. Change some of the runes here please. Have Pickup Radius increase the area by an amount.
o Breath of Heaven heal does not scale, and the radius is small. Scale it with… you guessed it – pickup radius.
o Lashing Tail Kick – cost is slightly too high, has odd knockback.
o Dashing Strike – wut? Use Thunderclap and GAIN spirit and deal just slightly lower damage. The cost in additional to the skill slot do not justify this ability.
o Wave of Light – lol? ½ your Spirit bar for an attack that deals 390% base. No other class gives up ½ their resources for just 390% damage. It’s been improved, sure, but cost really needs to reduce down to 50 before even considering using an active slot for this.
o Exploding Palm – looks good on paper, but in practice, Rend is much more effective. It only hits 1 enemy, has a large-ish cost (40 spirit! C’mon), and the “explosion” at the end DOES NOT SCALE WITH MONSTER HP IN MULTIPLAYER GAMES OR MPX VALUES. Fix it. Cost should be 10 Spirit if each cast can only hit 1 target. For this cost, it should freeze/stun enemies. That should be a part of the Monk toolkit. Martial arts movies I see always have some character that paralyzes victims.
o Cyclone Strike – I personally love this ability. But again, high cost, not enough radius, not enough damage. Lower to 25, and have PickUp Radius increase the base radius of this ability.
o Inner Sanctuary – please do something with this. 20 second CD makes it nearly useless. Expand the radius with PickUp Radius, reduce the cooldown, and have some better runes.
Mantras
• It seems Monks are balanced around having one, whereas other classes don’t need their buffs to function. A Wizard without Familiar? Still good. A DH without Companion? Yup, functions. A WD without Soul Harvest? No biggie.
• These need to be baseline and not occupy a skill slot.
• These need their on-use effects extended as a Spirit dump. Maybe a toggle mode to go super-buff and drain Spirit constantly. 10 per second or something high equivalent to the 25/3 seconds it is now. It’s not “fun” to simply hit a Mantra for a temp buff every 3 seconds. Or remove Mantra Activation entirely if it’s not going to occupy a skill slot.

Passives
• Wow. Uninspired, lackluster. It’s like the choice of lesser evils. It’s no surprise that Monks use OWE, Seize, and one other of their choosing which doesn’t seem to matter all that much.

• Resolve – needs to work with all abilities that damage a target, and offer some offensive capability as well.
• Fleet Footed – on the right track, but 10% isn’t worth a slot. I would take it if it were 10% to movement AND increased the movement cap to 50%.
• Exalted Soul – Max Spirit is meaningless with all the cd’s and the lack of generation that Monks have. Doesn’t work with current Monk implementation at all. See below for replacement.
• Transcendence – This is good, but no scaling. Poor design.
• Chant of Resonance – This is good, but Mantras are currently designed to be spammed. Doesn’t mesh with that design. The extra Spirit is handy, but 2 per sec is meh.
• Seize the Initiative – Nearly every Monk has this, because it’s one of the better Passives. But that isn’t saying much.
• The Guardian’s Path – Extra dodge is nifty, but dodge suffers from diminishing returns heavily. It doesn’t yield 15%. The 2h Weapon Spirit Generation is also pretty nifty, and about the only reason people would consider taking this. But again, lack of Spenders hampers it. Remove the dodge for dual wield and add 25% attack speed.
• Sixth Sense – this is lolworthy. 30% of your crit hit is converted to dodge… which then gets hit by DR. Unless you’re over 45% crit, Guardian’s Path is a better choice. It just feels like a duplication. Needs to be eliminated.
• Pacifism – this one is meh. It’s okay for HC I suppose, but with Serenity and CC-reduction items, it’s not needed. Redesign it please.
• Beacon of Ytar – this one is great for survival builds, since all the survival skills have cd’s. 15% doesn’t seem like much. I think it needs some offensive capability like “Increases Spirit generated from Generators by 50%” or something as well.
• Guiding Light – This is crap. It doesn’t work solo, even if you heal a follower. Plus the range on Breath of Heaven is ridiculously small. Redesign to work with health globes.
• One with Everything – Hands down the best passive Monks have. Or the worst, depending on how you view it. The good news – potentially adds tons of Resist All to Monks. The bad news – it locks you into using 2 affixes for Resist All, and drives the price of gear you need upwards.
• Combination Strike – It works, but it needs a vast overhaul. Keep in mind that this uses 1 Passive PLUS 1 Active slot per 8%. Want that 24% damage increase? 5 skill slots for it. I don’t know of any class that has to jump through that number of hoops just for 24% damage increase.
• Near Death Experience – Good for Hardcore. 35% Spirit is a joke though. It’s getting a buff in 1.05.
Here’s some ideas for Passives
• Steadfast – increase damage you deal when you stand still. 3% per second up to 30%, lasts until you move (1 second maybe?)
• Elemental Affinity – Adds 10% of your physical damage to each of fire, arcane, ice, lightning, etc.
• Elusiveness – increases the damage you deal after you dodge. Adds 1% damage per dodge, stacks up to 40 times. Lasts 5 seconds.
• Spiritual Attunement – reduces the cost of Spirit Spenders by 5% per 3 seconds. Resets when you cast a Spirit Spender.
• Critical Point – when you affect the enemy with a charm/stun/freeze ability, it increases your critical chance by 3% per enemy, maximum of 10 stacks. Lasts 5 seconds.
• Monk Style – If using 2 claws or a daibo, and spirit stone, gain +100 Spirit, +4 Spirit per second, and 15% to dodge.

tl;dr - Monks need more offensive capabilities, less reliance on defensive skills (so more room on their bar), Mantras needs redesign, Passives need redesign, and finally – Monks need to synergize with gear like +pickup radius or CC effects.


Blizz says monks feel fine. But we can all list a wall of PROBLEMS that need to be addressed or looked at or acknowledged OR SOMETHING...
Just a bunch of whiming monks here, before 1.05 you guys use to be supermans, unkillabel and crushing everything you see, now that you are more balanced and more equal to other classes, you start to cry.
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