Diablo® III

Hellfire nerf official explanation

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SayGa, there is no need to be so full of yourself... Besides, It is not possible for you to actually collect enough gold to buy your current gear, unless... using real money.
10/07/2012 01:09 PMPosted by Sherinz
SayGa, there is no need to be so full of yourself... Besides, It is not possible for you to actually collect enough gold to buy your current gear, unless... using real money.


i don't like to criticize but i can only agree as every post he make talk about "i" "me" etc...
i mean it's an online game for godsake.
the world does not center on one person.
10/07/2012 12:49 PMPosted by KaptainKhaos
so a ring that insta kills HC players with reflect dmg was not a bug ?


Nope, just bad design. A bug isn't something that behaves exactly as intended/programmed 100% of the time and gets approved by internal QA.
Quoted from Lylirra:
It was actually a bug fix. The ring's proc damage was incorrectly scaling with a player's primary stats and weapon damage, which it was never designed to do. While we agree it was pretty sweet to see your characters do millions of damage in a single hit, no other Legendary procs scale this way -- and that's intended.

(http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/6794230705#5)

Really? REALLY?

So you're telling us that NO ONE, no developer, no QA tester, no one in the whole company tried to proc the ring even ONCE before releasing the patch? a 1000% bugged factor isnt exactly that hard to spot. What's next, you're sending us a patch with compilation error??

What's with all the lies? Where's all the "polishing" and "Releasing when it is ready"?

Are you feeding us patches that no one in the company even tested? Or are you straight-out lying to our faces? Your call, those are the only possible choices now.


thats pretty ridiculous indeed. +1
The point of PTR is TESTING, so can't understand folks complaining about this ring, it is BETA after all, so what if it was missed, the code is not in production, they have just opened QA to the public, and the point to the testing is finding BUGS and or design issues.
Edited by Slayer#1507 on 10/8/2012 8:59 AM PDT
Dude, they destroyed monks and demon hunters and made barbarians the gods. What did you expect from those crazies? Haha they've actually buffed the only class they copied from D2. Even they like D2 better than Farm III.
Boo hoo. It's a ptr for a reason. It's designed to be changed as they see fit. Get over it.
10/08/2012 02:10 PMPosted by Futon
Boo hoo. It's a ptr for a reason. It's designed to be changed as they see fit. Get over it.


Yep, and that has nothing to do with this thread.
"I must of put a decimal point in the wrong place. I always make a little mistake like this!" -Blizzard
An ever so slight wiff of excrement about that statement.
Examples of development process:

1.I design it to hit for 100k, I write the spec, the developer makes it hit for 1M. Internal testing compares software to specification, catches bug, developer fixes the bug. We put the product to public test.

2.I design it to hit for 100k, I write the spec but mistakenly specify 1M. Developer implements 1M, internal testing checks it and it is fine according to spec. We put the product to public test.

See? Both of these are bugs, the first crept in during coding, the second during specification.
Pre-TEST doesn't mean "lets not even test what our changes did and lets let the players figure out".

Pre-TEST means "ok we think this is good, lets see how it goes, and it might need adjustments"

You seriously believe that a test server is justification for any game company to implement a major mechanic and never try it internally before releasing to the public? And risk being ridiculed? Well, that's what just happened apparently


You may be right, but be mad about a test realm is really ridiculous.
Examples of development process:

1.I design it to hit for 100k, I write the spec, the developer makes it hit for 1M. Internal testing compares software to specification, catches bug, developer fixes the bug. We put the product to public test.

2.I design it to hit for 100k, I write the spec but mistakenly specify 1M. Developer implements 1M, internal testing checks it and it is fine according to spec. We put the product to public test.

See? Both of these are bugs, the first crept in during coding, the second during specification.


Except it is not 100k vs 1M. It is "fixed damage" versus "damage scaled based on primary attributes and weapon stats". It isn't a typo that somehow gets thrown in there by itself.

Pre-TEST doesn't mean "lets not even test what our changes did and lets let the players figure out".

Pre-TEST means "ok we think this is good, lets see how it goes, and it might need adjustments"

You seriously believe that a test server is justification for any game company to implement a major mechanic and never try it internally before releasing to the public? And risk being ridiculed? Well, that's what just happened apparently


You may be right, but be mad about a test realm is really ridiculous.


It is not about where it happened, but HOW it happened / how they handled it. This is the same thing that happened with ToC, and guess what? No PTR then.

If you just compare the amount of items on this website that state properties that don't match their properties in game (even though they swear the website info is automatically retrieved from the game data), you'd realize that they really don't give a sh!t about being coherent nor consistent.
PTR ≠ Live noob.
So you're telling us that NO ONE, no developer, no QA tester, no one in the whole company tried to proc the ring even ONCE before releasing the patch?

Do you really think that developers compile and run their code every five minutes? Diablo 3 is not your Java homework, it contains so many lines of code, that it wouldn't be suprising that the game needs 1-2 hours to be built from the source code.

So yes, they just write the code and don't check it. Maybe they write unit tests, but I don't think so.
WHAT???? DH Vault:TrailOfCinders = 1500% Damage? We were not aware it was doing this and it should not have happened

WHAT???? HellFire Ring is Procing that much damage???? We were not aware it was doing this and it should not have happened.

Pattern?

PTR should be BETA. BETA = prior to release to public.

those "HUGE" blunders should have been found in ALPHA. In their own internal testing. We should not be ALPHA Testers. We should be BETA Testers

Now don't start with the whole "we are alpha testers because the real game is beta" junk. Lets just be mature about this.

Testing from a Dev/Alpha side should be done to test out standard suites of tests under all classes using varieties of gear and can simulete results and tweeks be done.

by the time it hits BETA this is usually known in the corporate world as UAT Testing (User Acceptance Testing). It is to see if any new bugs happen as well as minor tweeks to be performed based on data extracted from a much larger base of player builds and skill setups. This we have seen with small tweeks to say "Fury cost" and some larger tweeks like "DH ARMOR Buff reduced from 50% to 25%" for a specific rune.

the whole point of BETA is not to be a ALPHA testing group. It is to "validate" your ALPHA testing results and address any new issues which potentially arise as they had not been part of the standard types of testing already established by the company for that particular game.

In looking at the examples above Blizzard came out with the nerf to ToC stating "we meant this but it was doing that". There was a change to the code and it obviously was not part of the testing plan. (ie new functionality testing and regression testing). They meant (as they say) 100% each second (which I think is what it was originally so not sure why they had to change something that was already in existance) but instead it was 100% each tick and 5ticks per second so instead of 300% over 3sec it was 1500% over 3sec.

OK find you did the explaination of this and with all the negative replies on the ToC stuff one would have to make an assumption this would be something the company would NOT do again (ie not validate either new functionality via new functionality testing or regression testing).

Now we end up with the same thing on this ring? ... a OOOOOOOOPS??????

This was not a modification to something else existing. We are talking about a totally new item. I think it is safe to say NOBODY believes it wasn't rolled out originally as intended and then went... OH #@$%#@%@#% lets not do that all under the whole "oooops we didn't mean" stuff.

THIS IS NOT ALPHA TESTING. THIS IS BETA TESTING. Lets get this stuff right Blizzard.
and for the record... I think the ring should proc 4x yoru DPS (NO CRIT DAMAGE TO BE APPLIED). You run 50k it hits for 200k. You run 300k it hits for 1.2m You hit for 20k it hits for 80k.

That is the way to proc it rather than some simple 25k BS damage. Make the ring useful and get it right instead of some BS 25k damage that is 100% worthless and not even worth getting the ring for ini the first place.
It's either
A) Not a bug and they are just saying that as an excuse to try and avoid backlash for nerfing it.

B) Was a bug and they completely failed to test the only new equippable item (that I'm aware of, it's definetly the biggest anyways) in the upcoming patch.

I'm more inclined to believe it's A. Even an inexperienced person who just dabbles in programming, like myself, knows to test your program before you release is to the public. How many days before the opening of PTR were the patch details talked about? It was atleast a few days, and that doesn't include the time of development before announcing... ample time to test it.

It is likely that they tested the ring/proc many times and for many different reasons. Example, They probably tested that yes the ring does indeed drop, yes it procs, yes the animation works properly, yes it hits like a ton of bricks.
10/09/2012 01:56 PMPosted by vortexwolf
So you're telling us that NO ONE, no developer, no QA tester, no one in the whole company tried to proc the ring even ONCE before releasing the patch?

Do you really think that developers compile and run their code every five minutes? Diablo 3 is not your Java homework, it contains so many lines of code, that it wouldn't be suprising that the game needs 1-2 hours to be built from the source code.

So yes, they just write the code and don't check it. Maybe they write unit tests, but I don't think so.


Even if it is the case that it takes hours to compile the code to test it they still had plenty of time to test it out. It's not like they had a meeting in the morning and said "Hey lets implement this cool new idea I have and release it to the public this afternoon".
There's no need for official an explanation, the nerf was justifiable simply because it costs no resource and activates by just simply attacking/casting. There are no special requirements for it to trigger.

Although saying stuff like ToC 1500% damage scaling and hellfire projectile damage scaling is a bug is such a dumb move. I mean, don't they test stuff before they post it on PTR? Doesn't mean they have a PTR they can go easy on QC.
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