Diablo® III

Disappointed with Nephalem Valor

TLDR below.

After testing out the Nephalem Valor system for the last 6 months, I have become pretty disappointed with it. When I first heard about the system, I was really excited. I immediately thought "GREAT! Now we don't have to farm one spot all the time, and there will be motivation to move all over the world!". For a while, I really enjoyed the system.

Now, I am realizing that it feels really dumb. It doesn't feel fun to go out and hunt down Elite packs, just to get 5 stacks of this buff, before you start MFing. I always liked to turn to Diablo when I had 20 minutes before I had to leave the house for work or class, I could get in a couple Mephisto runs and maybe get some quick loot to be excited for when I got home. That is no longer possible, seeing that it will often take 20 minutes just to get your 5 stacks up. Now, a magic find run that could be 5 minutes has turned into 45 minutes. Diablo used to be the contrast to WOW for me, because it was casual, and had immediate gratification, wheras you'd have to dump lots of time to accomplish something in WOW. Now that's how it feels in Diablo 3.

This post isn't meant to be a Diablo to WOW comparision, or a casuals vs. hardcore players type of thing. What it comes down to for me is that doing magic find runs for loot (what this whole game is about) feels like it's too arduous and grindy of a process. I propose you remove Nephalem Valor, and just let us farm where we want and when we want. Up the quality of boss loot, and don't make us travel all over the world to do a MF run.

I get that you have your vision and your ideal view of how Diablo should be played, but it doesn't make it feel more "diverse" when you force people to farm buffs. It doesn't actually increase the number of viable farm locations, because people will still find a few key spots with a chain of elites to farm. The Diablo playerbase is a strong one with a strong history. I think that it's a bad practice to take away things from people when they've been so accustomed to them for so long.

TLDR: Nephalem Valor isn't fun; remove it and let us farm where we want without farming buffs. I don't want to play in more areas, and I don't want to play longer. I want to play where I want for how long I want.
Edited by Morningrise#1133 on 11/12/2012 6:14 AM PST
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I'd like to see it disappear. Just increase the bonuses for MP levels to compensate. Right now, it's impossible to play short sessions optimally. Playing two 90-minute sessions with a 45-minute break (dinner, trip to the store, put the kids to bed, whatever) between them is much less effective than playing a 180-minute session before or after whatever you need to do. It shouldn't work that way.
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21 Night Elf Rogue
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Posts: 110
I like it...its pretty easy to get 5 stacked.
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11/12/2012 06:08 AMPosted by Morningrise
I propose you remove Nephalem Valor, and just let us farm where we want and when we want.


The other problem is the mob density is almost non-existent in anything but A3. It's hard to farm for good items when it takes 40 years to find an elite mob (I'm looking at you, A4). Even if they removed the NV most people would probably still grind A3 anyway. They would need to increase the mob factor too, if they got rid of the NV.
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Yeah what is the point of it really. I feel the exact same way, I want to farm for like a quick 15-20 min and get on with something else, but Blizzard is forcing us to do full act runs without changing builds, it gets boring real fast

Also, as you mentioned, drop rates for bosses need to be increases, along with boss difficulty, right now bosses are a joke.

Ubers too, mostly drop garbage, greatly increase their drop rate, their difficulty is fine as it is.

Giving us an option to vary mob density will make act 2 more viable for farming as well.... just some ideas
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I agree. It's lame to have to commit X amount of time to farming to get anything out of it. Whether it takes you 20 minutes or 5 minutes to get the 5 stacks doesn't matter. I shouldn't feel like I have to set up an MF run and then do it for a certain amount of time to make it efficient.

And I don't think only bosses should have their loot buffed. Just take out NV and buff all loot on every mob. So we can farm a bunch of trash mobs + elites or do a boss run. Just give us that freedom.
Edited by Khristophoro#1862 on 11/12/2012 7:55 AM PST
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NV it's pretty pointless at this time. I get my stacks fast but there seems to be no point in it, it's a mandatory mechanic that shouldn't exist.
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NV was put in as a mechanic to encourage players to not farm one location, and to explore other areas of the game.

This sounds all happy and fun, but the same issue exists: There are still "best routes" to take for farming. The problem has just moved to a few waypoints in the act, instead of one or two waypoints.

By the way: Who's decision was it to not allow us to travel between acts in a game? That has to be one of the most frustrating, annoying things I've encountered in this game.
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TLDR: Nephalem Valor isn't fun; remove it and let us farm where we want without farming buffs. I don't want to play in more areas, and I don't want to play longer. I want to play where I want for how long I want.


Stop your QQ.

Act I and III takes literally minutes to get the five stacks up. Those are the only two levels you should be farming anyway. Stop being lazy or dedicate yourself to other priorities besides playing this game.
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It definitely sounds boring. Plus you can't change your build without losing the stacks. That really kills the fun of changing your build to face different bosses.

It sounds like work. In old diablos, you could just stop playing after farming for a while. Then return back 2 hours later, and your probabilities wouldn't be hampered, would be the same. Now you need to play continuously. Playing continuously is not viable for me. Whilst I work at home, I don't have available time all day, I have sporadic surges of free time.

Penalizing players for taking breaks? For trying new builds? It is lame.


This is the exact reason the tried and true skill trees are gone from D3.... because lazy asses want to switch skills to fight different situations. If you dont like using your skills, why did you chose to use them again?
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It definitely sounds boring. Plus you can't change your build without losing the stacks. That really kills the fun of changing your build to face different bosses.

It sounds like work. In old diablos, you could just stop playing after farming for a while. Then return back 2 hours later, and your probabilities wouldn't be hampered, would be the same. Now you need to play continuously. Playing continuously is not viable for me. Whilst I work at home, I don't have available time all day, I have sporadic surges of free time.

Penalizing players for taking breaks? For trying new builds? It is lame.


This is the exact reason the tried and true skill trees are gone from D3.... because lazy asses want to switch skills to fight different situations. If you dont like using your skills, why did you chose to use them again?


People like to change builds for variety... That's why people rolled alts of the same class in D2.

I don't see the problem with cutting out all the grind. Of course, they didn't replace the grind with any kind of legitimate replay value, but that is a different issue.
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Stop your QQ.

Act I and III takes literally minutes to get the five stacks up. Those are the only two levels you should be farming anyway. Stop being lazy or dedicate yourself to other priorities besides playing this game.


Yeah okay, what you just said makes no sense at all...and thanks for proving my point, btw.

Act I and III takes literally minutes to get the five stacks up. Those are the only two levels you should be farming anyway.


Yeah, like I said in my post above. There's no diversity in farming, because these are the only two areas you should be going. And more specifically, there's even a strict pre-determined route you should be following too.

Stop being lazy or dedicate yourself to other priorities besides playing this game.


So, play a ton more and grind with a boring system, or play less? Huh? I already play casually as it is...maximum 1-2 hours per night.... that still avoids the entire point of the system being pointless.
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I dunno... I can get 5x NV and hit up a key master really quickly on MP4-MP5 on a couple of characters (Monk+WW Barb) now in for a total of about 20-30mins max per run.

I kind of hate to play devils advocate here but maybe you aren't farming/hunting at the proper MP level for your play styles? It shouldn't take you like 90-180 mins to bust out some good runs... even on my really short 4x NV - then hit up KeyMaster zone for 1x more NV then the KM... I still get TONS of good items and legendary drops.

I kind of like how the game has us farming A1-A2-A3... I would just like to see more Hellfire recipes though to make more use of the organs.
Edited by FadeXF#1379 on 11/12/2012 3:08 PM PST
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much qq? 5 stacks take long? then ignore the entire existence of NV stacks

literally how/what do you start mfing on? killing elite packs or trash? if you are killing trash for mf, then you probably are doing it wrong, but if you're killing elites, then make sure you get to high paragon level and simply farm warriors rest and remake game IF you are so inclined.

at high mf level. zero stacks, you still get yellows from any/all elites. NV is a reward, you make the reward now seem like a punishment.

so exactly what are you complaining about.

I farm a1,a2,a3 for quick key runs. getting 5 stacks shouldn't even than 5 minutes .so called "strict routes" are so called optimisations, you are entirely free to do things in non optimised ways.

and i see you complaining about a2? I love a2 (except for high mp lvl bees and blazing guardian elites but its all managable)

5 stacks from (3 in bcm, 1 in khasim outpost events, 1 in stinging winds above alcarnus event, the guranteeded elite in alcarnus, 2 elites in ruin cistern at the path to oasis waypoint, dhalgur oasis (tomb of khan zakab), shrine of rakanishu, or just do vault runs)

every day you wake up , you gotta do your ablutions, then go to work presumably. is that a strict routine that you also qq about? you surely can do the non optimal one, and hold your crap in until the nite.
Edited by chrisloup#6305 on 11/12/2012 3:53 PM PST
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I feel the same. I can play sporadically like many others in this thread so needing to farm the stacks before I feel like I am in "find something cool mode" is annoying.
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NV was put in as a mechanic to encourage players to not farm one location, and to explore other areas of the game.



NV was also put in the game to reward those who stuck with a build, seeing that you have the freedom to change your talents anytime you please. Without NV people may feel forced to respec for different bosses or affx combinations.
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I propose you remove Nephalem Valor, and just let us farm where we want and when we want.


The other problem is the mob density is almost non-existent in anything but A3. It's hard to farm for good items when it takes 40 years to find an elite mob (I'm looking at you, A4). Even if they removed the NV most people would probably still grind A3 anyway. They would need to increase the mob factor too, if they got rid of the NV.


well, a4 is tough for finding the infernal machine plan, but that aside, if a4 had more mobs, I don't think i would even go a4 other than to shake things up (achivements mostly), it has the worst suckiest mobs ever.

think about high mp lvl morlu incinerator elites eg:(illusionist, teleporter, arcane, vortex) .. paint the floor red and call it a day..
Edited by chrisloup#6305 on 11/12/2012 3:16 PM PST
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Posts: 213
I agree with OP.

Sometimes I don't enough time to get 5 stacks and then do some more content because I have work / children. I used to like on D2 the fact that if you had 5-10 minutes you could still get in a few mephisto or pindle runs.

I think NV could be safely removed from the game now that there are MF mechanics like paragon. Also MP, which ultimately determines your loot too.

Please stop trying to force us to play 20-30+ minutes each session.
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