Diablo® III

Voice of the forum Blizzard cares, Why?

lol actually, OP is right at least for some cases,
e.g. remember why we began to have this legendary item mark on mini-map and on the ground?
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/6412211608?page=1

And the response is:
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/6412214426?page=2#29
"We're definitely aware that Legendary item drops can be difficult to see against certain textures..."

Right...so the change to legendary drop effect that happened after players demanded it was just a coincidence :p
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11/06/2012 05:19 PMPosted by Vaeflare
What we DO do, however, is to keep in touch with the development team and relay important discussions and trends that we see in the forums on to them.


What do you consider important enough to relay? How do we know our ideas and suggestions are being taken seriously? Somebody once told me the information that gets relayed are based off the number of up or down votes thread gets, is this true?

Technically an expert is someone who has spent a considerable time doing or researching something. You don't always need a college degree, given circumstances.

With this logic, I agree the developers are experts at creating games but can anyone on the development team say they have more hours logged in and playing the game then some of the people that play the game? Doesn't that make the some players "more correct" as they are now "experts" at playing the game and determining what is or isn't good and bad? more fun?

Shouldn't we the players be given constant feedback about the changes occurring for the game's future since we're the "experts" at playing the game?
Edited by Fuha#1913 on 11/7/2012 4:33 AM PST
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TL:DR,

Our Community Manager's are actually decent, hardworking people doing their job and so are the Devs. That's perfectly fine.

I suppose and assume the main issue here is because there's so many layers of bureaucracy the whole process seems to appear to most of the community that nothing is being done.

Why not change the system? Community managers are here to manage the community, (clean up threads, monitor discussions, help players out) it would be far more appropriate and useful if the Dev's themselves came down to discuss about the more important mechanics of the game, the ones they have control over and our community managers unfortunately can do nothing about.

Community managers should just highlight issues/ important discussions in forums to the Devs. But let the Dev's themselves answer or respond to these discussions.


I would rather they spend their time working on fixing this game. Making the needed changes to the classes where you would have as much build diversity that the devs had originally intended. Now I know that it would be impossible for the devs to make all possible build combinations of all classes inferno viable. But still they could have it where you would at least have around 50 viable builds per class if not more.

Plus the devs need to improve the endgame for this game. Paragon levels and adding in the inferno machine was a step in the right direction but more is needed. Such as PvP, that is a feature that would no doubt keep some playing even though this game is boring to play for some players.

No matter how much you would love for the devs to talk to us. The way Blizz works is totally different than other companies. It has to work the way that it does. Even though it does not show a personal one on one touch with the dev team it still shows that they care because they do use our suggestions to improve the game. I do believe that the paragon levels were taken from a player's suggestion.
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lol actually, OP is right at least for some cases,
e.g. remember why we began to have this legendary item mark on mini-map and on the ground?
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/6412211608?page=1

And the response is:
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/6412214426?page=2#29
"We're definitely aware that Legendary item drops can be difficult to see against certain textures..."

Right...so the change to legendary drop effect that happened after players demanded it was just a coincidence :p


What made Blizz aware of the situation, was it the devs spending the same amount of hours playing their game? Was it the fact that the Q&A testing new content to be put into the game? Of course not on both questions, it was us the players. But do you really think that Blizz has to come out and say it? No they do not, it is because anyone with half a brain knows it is the players that discuss these issues on the forums. Then the CM's take it to the devs. Then they no doubt check things out in simulation, running different legendary drops in different backgrounds. Then they could tell that the players were telling the truth.

What do you think would've happened if no player ever said anything about that problem? What do you think would've happened if no one mentioned the invulnerability exploit? Do you really think it would've been solved? I say it would not, if players do not talk about real concerns and real issues here on the forums. Then Blizz will keep developing the game thinking everything is fine and there are no problems.
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What do you consider important enough to relay? How do we know our ideas and suggestions are being taken seriously? Somebody once told me the information that gets relayed are based off the number of up or down votes thread gets, is this true?

Technically an expert is someone who has spent a considerable time doing or researching something. You don't always need a college degree, given circumstances.

With this logic, I agree the developers are experts at creating games but can anyone on the development team say they have more hours logged in and playing the game then some of the people that play the game? Doesn't that make the some players "more correct" as they are now "experts" at playing the game and determining what is or isn't good and bad? more fun?

Shouldn't we the players be given constant feedback about the changes occurring for the game's future since we're the "experts" at playing the game?


I am certain that the CM's can tell what threads are important and what ones are not. They can tell in a glance what threads and topics that they will be taking to the dev team. I am sure it does not take an Einstein to figure it out. Some threads would be junk and it would be obvious to anyone here.

For some this game would not really be fun unless the game is changed where they are an uber leet god that cannot be killed and they got an I win button. Where the best gear in the game drops with perfect rolls like candy in the streets. Which would destroy the game because of the lack of any real challenge and effort in obtaining that gear. Blizz knows these and other threads in other subjects are junk. There is no way that the dev team would seriously make any of that come true.
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11/07/2012 05:01 AMPosted by ShadowAegis
I am certain that the CM's can tell what threads are important and what ones are not. They can tell in a glance what threads and topics that they will be taking to the dev team. I am sure it does not take an Einstein to figure it out.


I agree with this, but I wasn't implying that they don't read or relay anything. I'm asking how do WE know they are doing it. I want to know what they have planned next rather then a patch note that comes out day of patch. There are a lot of players unsatisfied for many reasons.

Personally I don't think anything I've suggested as been taken seriously and I've seen others touch base on the same ideas in a few different threads which also haven't been given any feedback.

And Einstein, although being very intelligent lacked common sense, so he wouldn't be able to figure it out anyways.
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11/06/2012 05:51 PMPosted by Vaeflare
When you realize that players are posting because they’re passionate, it’s a lot easier to see eye-to-eye with people and treat them with respect, even if you might politely disagree with their opinions.


That's actually pretty good to hear :)

I criticize a lot, truth in that.

If I didn't like Diablo series, I wouldn't even bother coming here and sharing my opinions.

D1 and D2 were two of my favorite games ever, that's the main reason why I hated so much some of the aspects in D3. And it's interesting to recognize that I'm not alone here. Why do you think the game sold so much in the begining? It's not because of WoW. It's because of the previous success that the series had experienced.
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Id just like to ask Vaeflare if he or someone has read the hundreds of post of lag since patch 1.05 on the technical forums. I took the time to even addres most of those posts on a single one. I asked every post i saw to please reply on my thread so there wasnt a bunch of threads going around. After about 3 weeks and hundreds of post, no technical issue forum manager has rise to help us out. We have explained that the only lag we recieve is from D3. Everyone plays any game without a problem, but when it comes to D3 after patch 1.05, some people have unbearable lag which makes ONLY D3 unplayable. Not ISP problem either as we have demostrated in the hundreds of threads. So i beg you Vaeflare can you pass the this msg to the techinal comitee or anything or even address it yourselve since after weeks of complaining no one has even comented that you guys are trying to solve this issue.

Sign,
A Blizzard Fan since the 90s
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While indeed the forums (and social media in general) are intended for players to interact and chat with each other about whatever interests them, I whole-heartedly disagree that we don’t care about feedback. We do care, and feedback from the forums has absolutely influenced the direction of Diablo III.

The thing is, we as community managers don’t make the calls on what should and shouldn’t be implemented or changed in Diablo III. That’s not our job. So it’s true that you’ll never see us saying we’re tasking the development team for anything, because we don’t make those sorts of decisions for them.

What we DO do, however, is to keep in touch with the development team and relay important discussions and trends that we see in the forums on to them. Similarly, we often work with our developers so that they can relay information to us about what’s going on behind the scenes with Diablo III, and help us to answer your questions. This community is certainly full of ideas and competing points of view, and they are all extremely valuable to us. Your discussions often provide insight into concerns and ideas that may or may not have been prominent on our radar, and our job as community representatives is make sure the developers are aware of what you think.

At the end of the day, it’s up for the developers to determine what decisions are made for Diablo III. Those decisions can be influenced by the community at-large, and we genuinely appreciate that so many of you take the time to leave us constructive feedback, regardless of whether or not it is directly incorporated into Diablo III.


Do Do
lolol
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11/06/2012 05:51 PMPosted by Vaeflare
Thanks for the kind words. :) I try to be as candid and unbiased with the feedback I gather and pass along as much as I can. While I sometimes raise an eyebrow at some of the threads and posts that are scattered about the Diablo III forums, I know that for the vast majority of players, the reason they’re posting here is because they’re passionate about the game. When you realize that players are posting because they’re passionate, it’s a lot easier to see eye-to-eye with people and treat them with respect, even if you might politely disagree with their opinions.


I know Blizzard cares about fans and listens to them, and have personally seen evidence of this countless times over many years and games.

I would like to personally say thanks for this, and it is appreciated by me for one.

Now where (and when) is the promised PVP? It cant get here soon enough for me!
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11/07/2012 05:29 AMPosted by Will
When you realize that players are posting because they’re passionate, it’s a lot easier to see eye-to-eye with people and treat them with respect, even if you might politely disagree with their opinions.


That's actually pretty good to hear :)

I criticize a lot, truth in that.

If I didn't like Diablo series, I wouldn't even bother coming here and sharing my opinions.

D1 and D2 were two of my favorite games ever, that's the main reason why I hated so much some of the aspects in D3. And it's interesting to recognize that I'm not alone here. Why do you think the game sold so much in the begining? It's not because of WoW. It's because of the previous success that the series had experienced.


So you believe that the majority bought this game sight unseen. Where they had no clue of what D3 would be like before they installed it. Or they really believed that the game would be like the first time that Blizz showed the game to the public. If that is the case then millions of players were really disappointed if they were looking for a perfect copy of D2:LOD. That sounds insane to me that players would not keep up to date with a game that they want to play.

I know that I do not do that at all. If I want to play a game that is in development and I know about it I will keep up to date the moment that I hear about it. I believe that more players than you think did just that. They knew what they were getting when they bought D3.

I agree with this, but I wasn't implying that they don't read or relay anything. I'm asking how do WE know they are doing it. I want to know what they have planned next rather then a patch note that comes out day of patch. There are a lot of players unsatisfied for many reasons.

Personally I don't think anything I've suggested as been taken seriously and I've seen others touch base on the same ideas in a few different threads which also haven't been given any feedback.

And Einstein, although being very intelligent lacked common sense, so he wouldn't be able to figure it out anyways.


Again the CM's job is to take our concerns to the devs. They cannot make the devs implement our suggestions, they have no power of decision. Also they cannot tell us anything until the devs give them the go ahead. Meaning that most of the time the devs do not tell us about anything new until they are sure about what they want to do.

If they told us every little thing that they are planning and give us an estimated time. Then when those things do not appear the players would look at that as broken promises. Which causes more disappointment.

Also you always expect a CM to post in your threads. I guess you expect him to say I will be taking this to the devs and make them implement it pronto. Is this what you expect. Then have the devs sing your praises that you have such great ideas that they could've never came up with it.
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Dev's don't make these decisions either they are developers. They do the projects that are spec'd out to the by the game designers vis a project manager. Dev's are just kick !@# nerdy assembly workers. Even though the CM says otherwise. I believe they are mistaken, or are just dumbing it down for simplicity sake. I've never worked for a dev shop, nor know any dev's that have where Dev is allowed to set there own priorities outside of on a smaller level like the order I build my services in for a task that has been set for me, and prioritizing "bug fixes".

By bliz they "pass things on to the dev team". I can assure you it doesn't mean CM just walks into the room full of dev's and is like "HOLD THE PRESSES!" Do I got a solution for you! No they have meetings.. (hopefully short ones), and they sit down with the game designer, other pm's, pj's, producers basically some marketing folks (however bliz may title them different from other companies), maybe 1 lead dev who is there to say if something is technically capable and give general time line estimates and depending on his hands on involvement the "Big Cheese".

(see)
http://us.blizzard.com/en-us/company/careers/posting.html?id=120007I

Nowhere in the "dev's" aka Software engineers position does it say anything about playing the game and making decisions on how things should be changed.

Yet in the game designer position, you can see that is EXACTLY what that job is about.
http://us.blizzard.com/en-us/company/careers/posting.html?id=120009U

If no player ever said anything about a problem they would have reports and analytic showing user behavior to figure things out and a Q&A team on there side. It's only been in the past couple years that forums + games have come together (at least in the history of gaming). They can be a great first responder for bugs but that is it. NES wasn't shipping me a new Super Mario cartridge if I figured out how to do the minus world glitch, or complained that I should get 2 coins per box. Valid unique and constructive suggestions are less likely to take place then finding the exact item you want to drop, but that doesn't mean you should give up! You never know you might get lucky, if you really stand out with a constructive and unique point of view. My point in this all basically was there is no reason to get upset over "crybabies", analytics and brand owners, product managers, or game designers (however you divide up the tasks) in the end are going to prevail over nerd raging forum members ;)
Edited by Brahm#1943 on 11/7/2012 9:47 AM PST
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how to unlock monster power ang hardcore mode???
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11/07/2012 09:28 AMPosted by ShadowAegis
Also you always expect a CM to post in your threads. I guess you expect him to say I will be taking this to the devs and make them implement it pronto. Is this what you expect. Then have the devs sing your praises that you have such great ideas that they could've never came up with it.


There is a difference between what you wrote and what I'm asking, I feel as though you're making me sound much worse then I'm trying to.

CMs from my understanding do their jobs I never said they didn't, me and I'd like to think many other players would like "more" feedback because we think it doesn't come enough. I don't feel like I've asked for anything unreasonable.

11/07/2012 09:28 AMPosted by ShadowAegis
Again the CM's job is to take our concerns to the devs.


On the other hand you claim to know their job and how well they do it. So what are you? besides a blue knight? are you a CM? Because if you are I'll let it go.
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11/06/2012 10:47 AMPosted by Providence
You're wrong. I could explain why but i don't have that kind of time


I have $10,000,000 but I do not feel like showing you.
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Blizzard has always paid close attention to their fans and community, probably way more than most people could ever imagine (such as literally befriending and getting in touch with top players across all their games). Anyways, I feel that feedback from the players should be taken with a grain of salt as they don't always know what it is that they want, we just think we do.

A quick d3 related example. I can remember before d3 launched there was a HUGE amount of concern that the game would extremely easy and dumbed down in comparison to d2. They kept assuring us at Blizzcon that d3 would be incredibly hard, because that's the feedback they were getting from the community. I believe this was the core reason Inferno launched in a more less completely unplayable state, and also why we had infamous statements such as "and then we doubled the difficulty" (or whatever the exact quote was).

Anyways, my point is, Blizzard pays attention to their fans more than most realize and far more than any other gaming company. You're not about to see EA or Activision give 2 craps about what their fans actually want from their games, they just want to shove out another Call of Duty or Madden and take your money.
Edited by skooo#1263 on 11/7/2012 10:02 AM PST
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11/07/2012 06:59 AMPosted by MagusHenosis
Thanks for the kind words. :) I try to be as candid and unbiased with the feedback I gather and pass along as much as I can. While I sometimes raise an eyebrow at some of the threads and posts that are scattered about the Diablo III forums, I know that for the vast majority of players, the reason they’re posting here is because they’re passionate about the game. When you realize that players are posting because they’re passionate, it’s a lot easier to see eye-to-eye with people and treat them with respect, even if you might politely disagree with their opinions.


I know Blizzard cares about fans and listens to them, and have personally seen evidence of this countless times over many years and games.

I would like to personally say thanks for this, and it is appreciated by me for one.

Now where (and when) is the promised PVP? It cant get here soon enough for me!


Well.

I think this is the first post I have EVER seen on these boards that meets all of the following criteria:

A) Is directed to a Blue
B) Asks about the delay of PvP implementation
and
C) Did not want to make me find the poster IRL and shove his keyboard down his throat.

Gratz, good sir.
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props to vaeflare for relaying all our feedback

you must have the patience of a saint to filter through the countless garbage threads

Thanks for the kind words. :) I try to be as candid and unbiased with the feedback I gather and pass along as much as I can. While I sometimes raise an eyebrow at some of the threads and posts that are scattered about the Diablo III forums, I know that for the vast majority of players, the reason they’re posting here is because they’re passionate about the game. When you realize that players are posting because they’re passionate, it’s a lot easier to see eye-to-eye with people and treat them with respect, even if you might politely disagree with their opinions.

If you guys cared I doubt you'd ignore large parts of the audience so much like ignoring the EU customers and posting near exclusively on the american forums. That's not a good sign of faith, it's not good interaction and it really makes me doubt how earnest you guys are. This is on top of the fact every time we ask for something (like more legendaries) you play games with our suggestions like making the item quality worse to compensate or when we asked for better drop rates so all you did was shift them around and left later acts pointless while A1 was the most viable option by far for a while.

You can't ignore large parts of your audience and pretend you care, it just shows the truth.
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Thanks for the kind words. :) I try to be as candid and unbiased with the feedback I gather and pass along as much as I can. While I sometimes raise an eyebrow at some of the threads and posts that are scattered about the Diablo III forums, I know that for the vast majority of players, the reason they’re posting here is because they’re passionate about the game. When you realize that players are posting because they’re passionate, it’s a lot easier to see eye-to-eye with people and treat them with respect, even if you might politely disagree with their opinions.

If you guys cared I doubt you'd ignore large parts of the audience so much like ignoring the EU customers and posting near exclusively on the american forums. That's not a good sign of faith, it's not good interaction and it really makes me doubt how earnest you guys are. This is on top of the fact every time we ask for something (like more legendaries) you play games with our suggestions like making the item quality worse to compensate or when we asked for better drop rates so all you did was shift them around and left later acts pointless while A1 was the most viable option by far for a while.

You can't ignore large parts of your audience and pretend you care, it just shows the truth.


Nobody wants legendary knickers go back to the eu.. lol jk sorry couldn't help myself. ;)
Edited by Brahm#1943 on 11/7/2012 3:26 PM PST
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Dear Blizzard,
I believe everyone wants to know what happen to "Everybody Loves Shen" achievement? Most were spoken and achieve..excepy "VICTORY" after defeating Diablo. I had complete Diablo round many times and yet unable to achieve Shen's "Victory" conversation.
Please advise and notify what happen as most players are stuck with this un-achievement.
:(
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