Diablo® III

I'm sad about MP now

@OP.

You are too short sighted.

MP10 will be the most efficient farming.

You just need to wait for 12 - 24 months for enough patches and expansions to get 64, 65 and 66 ilevel gear that will put your DPS in millions.

MP10 will be cake.

Ubers can be one-shotted.

Mark my words.
I agree that the higher the MP levels, the less efficient you get. Granted I'm not all about efficiency, but that's just a bad model.

I don't know why the only bonus to finding items is a 25% MF bonus per level. In all honestly, that amounts to very little given the extra time it takes to kill things. If your base chance of finding a legendary from a monster is 0.001%, if you're at mp10 with 600%MF, it's now 0.007%, but the monsters have 3400% more health.

What were they smoking? By those numbers, in order to have the same efficiency in mp10 as mp0 at 100k paper dps, you would need 3.4 million paper dps. So, outside of keys/organs, what's the point of mp10?

Then again, if they gave mp10 the best farming results, everyone would be crying that they can't do mp10 and "it's not fair", kind of like how act 3 was before 1.0.3.
Edited by Yura#2182 on 11/13/2012 11:28 PM PST
11/13/2012 10:33 PMPosted by speedforce
Let's say 1 elite pack takes you 30 seconds longer.
Let's say 30 seconds on elite pack is not efficient farming.

Farming with my wiz on mp2 and most elite packs are 3-5 seconds, they don't even have chance to use their affixes cause they are chickens from Enchantress cast. Higher mp are not as efficient as mp2 right now, more dps is required.

Another story for my barby, it is extremely difficult to generate fury and keep WoTB on lower mp. So I prefer at least mp 4 while farming.
11/13/2012 10:52 PMPosted by Darlynn
MP10 actually is quite effective in both terms of exp and drops, if you skip all elites.


completely WRONG.
When the game was just released Inferno was said not to be for everyone, yet it holds the best rewards.
MP10 is said now to be a challenge for those seeking it, yet the rewards are margenly better then the lower MP lvls.

If you are going to give MP10 the best rewards and make it the best place to farm everyone is going to cry again they cant farm the place.. It will be nerfed and dumbed down just as original Inferno got nerfed to a piss easy play.

Its a never ending circle that way, as it is now, its fine. Be glad you have a choice to pick your sweet spot now.


Except MP10 will never be a "sweet spot". Look at the monster health scale chart compared to the "bonuses" you get. Thats right, it never makes sense to play in MP10.

See the problem now?

but he is right. If you give MP10 the best possible reward then you divide the community even more then now, in those people which either play 48 Ours each day or dual wield credit cards in the game.

Is this the kind of game you want? Which only caters to the hard core crowd? How well did that worked with Inferno pre patches? People left the game very fast.

How do they say? Be carefull what you wish for.

I am not even sure if MP10 was ever meant to be the best of the best farming spots anyway. Blizz said they want people to figure out ways how to deal the DPS for it. And its more as a "bonus" challange to those which feel bored from the game. No one as far as I know said that the highest MP levels are there to be eventually the most efficient farming places in the game. What you get there is just a "small" bonus.


Then again, if they gave mp10 the best farming results, everyone would be crying that they can't do mp10 and "it's not fair", kind of like how act 3 was before 1.0.3.

exactly. And people are right with that claim and "crying".

Again. Remember who is the bigest number of players. Casuals. Thats why D2 LoD was so succesfull. It gave those people a chance to "farm" decently for the best rewards.

To change that will only kill your game because only a very small number of players can actually farm then efficiently
Edited by CrniVuk#2227 on 11/13/2012 11:47 PM PST
Another story for my barby, it is extremely difficult to generate fury and keep WoTB on lower mp. So I prefer at least mp 4 while farming.
For Barbs, I find that Hammer of the Ancients/Earthquake is far superior for MP0-1 than WW is.
Look at the monster health scale chart compared to the "bonuses" you get. Thats right, it never makes sense to play in MP10.

See the problem now?


You would rather have they revamped some Legendaries to be super sweet awsome omgzors gear that only drops in MP10? So that pretty much nobody that doesnt use the RMAH can get and everyone cries their eyes out in outrage?


I think Blizz did right to NOT give better loot exclusive to high MP levels.

I also think they did right to NOT make higher MP lvls a far, far more rewarding choice.

BUT

I think they scaled the benefits wrong, in that it shouldn't be WORSE to farm higher MP's at least to the grand scale that is is in reality.
11/13/2012 11:44 PMPosted by speedforce
Another story for my barby, it is extremely difficult to generate fury and keep WoTB on lower mp. So I prefer at least mp 4 while farming.
For Barbs, I find that Hammer of the Ancients/Earthquake is far superior for MP0-1 than WW is.

if you have enough DPS WoTb is not even required for lower MP levels. Though you lose a bit on speed that is true.


Except MP10 will never be a "sweet spot". Look at the monster health scale chart compared to the "bonuses" you get. Thats right, it never makes sense to play in MP10.

See the problem now?

but he is right. If you give MP10 the best possible reward then you divide the community even more then now, in those people which either play 48 Ours each day or dual wield credit cards in the game.

Is this the kind of game you want? Which only caters to the hard core crowd? How well did that worked with Inferno pre patches? People left the game very fast.

How do they say? Be carefull what you wish for.

I am not even sure if MP10 was ever meant to be the best of the best farming spots anyway. Blizz said they want people to figure out ways how to deal the DPS for it. And its more as a "bonus" challange to those which feel bored from the game. No one as far as I know said that the highest MP levels are there to be eventually the most efficient farming places in the game. What you get there is just a "small" bonus.


All that to say MP 10 is useless.

What's the challenge of MP10 exactly? Taking 10 + mins to kill elites??? Thats not challenging thats mind numbing.

Currently, even with teh best gear, there's never a point to be in MP10. The HP scales to ridiculous proportions so it's never a good idea to play there.

Granted, if taking 10 mins to kill HP brick walls is your idea of fun, then there it is.
The more research I've done and information I've gathered: MP0 just seems like the best. It's the best for XP for paragon. It's the best for legendary farming. It makes me sad. Why build such a great end game system of MP (and a fun one) and not reward you really for challenging yourself.

:(


There's no way in hell a 111k DPS character's most efficient MP level for paragon XP is MP0.
Most of my characters ( all beside my DH ) have between 30k and 60k DPS and my optimal MP is between MP1 and MP3.

11/13/2012 10:11 PMPosted by Alcovitch
The issue is that gearing for higher MP's is a complete waste of time. You always gain more xp and loot per hour at the lower MP's because the XP bonus and rewards do not scale appropriately with monster HP with each Monster Power. Monster Power 10 for example will NEVER be a good place to farm.


You are right about the higher MP levels.
But now about the lower.
If you have decent gear, it's better to play, say, MP3 than MP0.
If you have godly gear, it's probably better to play MP5-6 than MP3.

I don't think many players ( if any ) would benefit from playing higher than that, and most likely not MP10.
But the game isn't done yet, think about it.
What about when they release the expansion and we have more powerfull uniques?
What about when they buff some skills?
What if at some point they increase our level from 60 to 70, or even 100?

So far, MP10 isn't of much use for paragon leveling/MF'ing, correct.
But it's usefull for other things ( keyfarming, ubers ), and the little bit of MF these level gives you are just an added bonus.

But for the regular player ( who can't go through MP10 at all ), the lower levels ( MP3-MP5 ) are still good XP, better than MP0, and you can go higher and higher as you progress.

It's easy to notice with an high DPS character.
My highest DPS character is my DH ( with sharpshooter ), like 200k or whatever... And clearing an act on MP1 takes pretty much the same time as MP0. The trash dies in 1 hit on either level, and the elites dies in 8 or 10 seconds on either level.
So it's just a straight XP/MF/GF boost with no added difficulty/time.

If you have 500k DPS, you can probably say the same about MP5.
Edited by blood#1783 on 11/13/2012 11:56 PM PST
11/13/2012 11:30 PMPosted by ermak
Another story for my barby, it is extremely difficult to generate fury and keep WoTB on lower mp. So I prefer at least mp 4 while farming.


For the classic WW barb, indeed there are issues with low MP's and fury for 100% WotB.

Here's the thing...a P100 wiz friend of mine who also has an almost P100 WD, decided to gear his Barb to Plvl him.

He of course found the same issue, as predicted.
But, he is thinking outside the box. The issue is keeping WotB up with Thrive on Chaos.
But really, in MP1 you don't need 100% WotB.

His solution, WotB Insanity to call on if needed and just WW through MP1 without WotB, he is destroying paragon lvls.
Another story for my barby, it is extremely difficult to generate fury and keep WoTB on lower mp. So I prefer at least mp 4 while farming.


For the classic WW barb, indeed there are issues with low MP's and fury for 100% WotB.

Here's the thing...a P100 wiz friend of mine who also has an almost P100 WD, decided to gear his Barb to Plvl him.

He of course found the same issue, as predicted.
But, he is thinking outside the box. The issue is keeping WotB up with Thrive on Chaos.
But really, in MP1 you don't need 100% WotB.

His solution, WotB Insanity to call on if needed and just WW through MP1 without WotB, he is destroying paragon lvls.


He might as well use rend rather then WotB.

I use mp3 to make sure I have fury. I don't kill any slower on mp3 due to the fact I run through mobs either way. The only difference is when my tornado (which is up either way) kills the mob. In mp0 I don't even get through ww before stuff is dead, but by mp3 stuff dies right before it goes off screen. Other builds will obviously have different variations of this but for barbs is a much different story.
Edited by Traz#1392 on 11/14/2012 12:21 AM PST


For the classic WW barb, indeed there are issues with low MP's and fury for 100% WotB.

Here's the thing...a P100 wiz friend of mine who also has an almost P100 WD, decided to gear his Barb to Plvl him.

He of course found the same issue, as predicted.
But, he is thinking outside the box. The issue is keeping WotB up with Thrive on Chaos.
But really, in MP1 you don't need 100% WotB.

His solution, WotB Insanity to call on if needed and just WW through MP1 without WotB, he is destroying paragon lvls.


He might as well use rend then WotB.


And that very suggestion is 'in testing'. :)

But the point being, WW is only a problem in low MP's in trying to keep up the very thing you only need for higher MP's.

Low MP's- 0,1,2 are still the most viable for most specs for most objectives- Plvl, loot. Even the 'problem' spec of WW barb, if you think outside the box.


He might as well use rend then WotB.


And that very suggestion is 'in testing'. :)

But the point being, WW is only a problem in low MP's in trying to keep up the very thing you only need for higher MP's.

Low MP's- 0,1,2 are still the most viable for most specs for most objectives- Plvl, loot. Even the 'problem' spec of WW barb, if you think outside the box.


It's not a problem though. I went from mp1 to mp2 to mp3 as my dps went up. I'm only 10k base away from 100k which will start to make mp3 optimal. As I go up the mp goes up and my runs take the same amount of time, but I benefit from higher gold / mf / exp.

Even if I get up to 125k base dps I can then start to use cain set and leoric's signet to "nerf" my dps to again make it much much more efficient and easy for me to do runs but skill keep the same speed. There is a ton of benefit to having such a "problem" as ww barbs do in the 1-3 mp range as we can resort to more specific exp gear / mf gear.
Edited by Traz#1392 on 11/14/2012 12:30 AM PST


And that very suggestion is 'in testing'. :)

But the point being, WW is only a problem in low MP's in trying to keep up the very thing you only need for higher MP's.

Low MP's- 0,1,2 are still the most viable for most specs for most objectives- Plvl, loot. Even the 'problem' spec of WW barb, if you think outside the box.


It's not a problem though. I went from mp1 to mp2 to mp3 as my dps went up. I'm only 10k base away from 100k which will start to make mp3 optimal. As I go up the mp goes up and my runs take the same amount of time, but I benefit from higher gold / mf / exp.

Even if I get up to 125k base dps I can then start to use cain set and leoric's signet to "nerf" my dps to again make it much much more efficient and easy for me to do runs but skill keep the same speed. There is a ton of benefit to having such a "problem" as ww barbs do in the 1-3 mp range as we can resort to more specific exp gear / mf gear.


Interesting, I wonder if you will see results in a converse manner, though.
The barb I was mentioning has almost twice your base dps, allowing to basically just run WW with no WotB in MP1 and kill. He was doing <5 min >6 mill xp runs with no leorics in early tests.


It's not a problem though. I went from mp1 to mp2 to mp3 as my dps went up. I'm only 10k base away from 100k which will start to make mp3 optimal. As I go up the mp goes up and my runs take the same amount of time, but I benefit from higher gold / mf / exp.

Even if I get up to 125k base dps I can then start to use cain set and leoric's signet to "nerf" my dps to again make it much much more efficient and easy for me to do runs but skill keep the same speed. There is a ton of benefit to having such a "problem" as ww barbs do in the 1-3 mp range as we can resort to more specific exp gear / mf gear.


Interesting, I wonder if you will see results in a converse manner, though.
The barb I was mentioning has almost twice your base dps, allowing to basically just run WW with no WotB in MP1 and kill. He was doing <5 min >6 mill xp runs with no leorics in early tests.


My item farming pace is 35m exp per hour. Full out I can top 55m-60m exp per hour with my current gear. I get about 17.5m exp per run with just a hellfire ring. You can imagine what a much higher dps barb with leoric's signet and cain set (60% more exp) and more base run speed could get.
Edited by Traz#1392 on 11/14/2012 12:42 AM PST
Posts: 37
I think you misunderstand what mp is for.

do whatever mp that lets you slice through mobs like its butter.

---
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=qH0SNZXSc6A
eg: for this 740k dps archon wizard. he farms mp10 just like how the rest of us farm the lower mp.

http://kr.battle.net/d3/ko/profile/NalGangDoRTZ-3223/hero/19501531

(english if you want to see his gear)
http://www.diabloprogress.com/hero/nalgangdortz-3223/FrostBurn/19501531


I'm sad about DPS now.
Barb's stole this thread just as fast as they steal our lootz :(
They should've just made monsters hit harder and faster than bloating their HP per MP lvl.. And have certain kool items drop only on higher levels. I dunno just make the reward be equal to the challenge.
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