Diablo® III

Hall of Godly Barbarians temporary thread

@Death

I will not be making the gem change until I roll out the new sustain formula. That should be a few days as I'm still testing it.
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how does one calculate their score? im pretty sure I could be in the hall of godly barbs.
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@Beeotch 39,678
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is that considered good?
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It's number 10 among WW barbs at the moment.
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awsome. thanks!
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my new score:

Hall Score: 27162.505534071

DPS Score: 104.8945202
EHP Score: 103.1847
Sustain Score: 1.2198174999339
Move Score: 1.25
Paragon Score: 1.425
Misc Score: 1.155
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I've done some testing. As I mentioned before, the sustain scores were blowing up too much with the new formula. Sustains were jumping up to as much as 3.2 under the new formula. I can easily see it jumping up to 4 under the right conditions such as an extremely high dps barb with 8.8% LS, low HP, and great mitigation. That's too much. Sustain shouldn't triple or quadruple a person's score.

What I intend to do is to take 1/2 of the raw sustain above 1 and use that as the net sustain multiplier. I originally intended to use 1/3 in order to roughly match the current sustain values, but I realized that for many people, sustain was in the same range of value as move speed and sustain should be far more important. Thus someone with 3.2 raw sustain under the new formula will get a 2.1 multiplier and someone with a 2 raw sustain will get a 1.5 multiplier.

This will result in higher scores than the current Hall. I will have to increase the minimum score for entry. Extremely high EHP types such as Baller and Nikeboy should see a pretty big jump in score under the new formula since their sustain scores won't be penalized as much for high HP. This will be mitigated somewhat by lowering the impact of rubies in helm for the tankers.

I would like people to comment before I actually implement the formula change.
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I've done some testing. As I mentioned before, the sustain scores were blowing up too much with the new formula. Sustains were jumping up to as much as 3.2 under the new formula. I can easily see it jumping up to 4 under the right conditions such as an extremely high dps barb with 8.8% LS, low HP, and great mitigation. That's too much. Sustain shouldn't triple or quadruple a person's score.

What I intend to do is to take 1/2 of the raw sustain above 1 and use that as the net sustain multiplier. I originally intended to use 1/3 in order to roughly match the current sustain values, but I realized that for many people, sustain was in the same range of value as move speed and sustain should be far more important. Thus someone with 3.2 raw sustain under the new formula will get a 2.1 multiplier and someone with a 2 raw sustain will get a 1.5 multiplier.

This will result in higher scores than the current Hall. I will have to increase the minimum score for entry. Extremely high EHP types such as Baller and Nikeboy should see a pretty big jump in score under the new formula since their sustain scores won't be penalized as much for high HP. This will be mitigated somewhat by lowering the impact of rubies in helm for the tankers.

I would like people to comment before I actually implement the formula change.


Sounds good Celanian,

Do you have the final draft of the forumla, so everyone can see it again?

Thanks again!

-Baller
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I still think you're not giving enough credit to damage output Calenian. I would wager that the group of barbarians that can hit for over 800k damage on a normal skill like cleave with the only buff being active is Battle Rage Into the Fray (no WoTB needed) is rather small indeed. What about some bonus for heavy hitters like myself? I honestly think your formula caters too heavily to EHP. Sure it's great to have, but if you're at a point where the life returned though life steal from the damage you deal far exceeds any incoming damage, EHP honestly becomes a moot point.

I have plenty of EHP to farm any MP I want and can I can indeed solo MP10 ubers. I have about 800k EHP in my build, but unlike many of the builds here my build directly prioritized damage per hit. With my build I wanted to hit something as hard as I can because I knew I would be relying on my damage to sustain me. So I ask you, if it takes another barb 2 or 3 hits to do the same damage I do in one hit, who indeed is more "Godly"? Just food for thought.
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I've done some testing. As I mentioned before, the sustain scores were blowing up too much with the new formula. Sustains were jumping up to as much as 3.2 under the new formula. I can easily see it jumping up to 4 under the right conditions such as an extremely high dps barb with 8.8% LS, low HP, and great mitigation. That's too much. Sustain shouldn't triple or quadruple a person's score.


What I intend to do is to take 1/2 of the raw sustain above 1 and use that as the net sustain multiplier. I originally intended to use 1/3 in order to roughly match the current sustain values, but I realized that for many people, sustain was in the same range of value as move speed and sustain should be far more important. Thus someone with 3.2 raw sustain under the new formula will get a 2.1 multiplier and someone with a 2 raw sustain will get a 1.5 multiplier.


@celanian

I think you need to revise that formula from scratch instead of scaling it upwards like that and why you are scaling it upwards and not downwards ??

I think it doesn't matter how far your LS or LOH goes if the average damage you took equals your sustain level. But when your sustain level goes higher while the average monster damage remains the same, I can't see any reason why you scale it upward. IMO, it should be downward scaling like EHP.
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Hi Celanian,

New score:

Hall Score: 48125.814246677

DPS Score: 243.714829
EHP Score: 56.0353
Sustain Score: 1.6969254475265
Move Score: 1.24
Paragon Score: 1.45
Misc Score: 1.155

Thanks again!
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how i wish i can provide some insights here, damn i hate math =/
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How I'm going to handle gems in helm:

If XP_bonus = .19, gem_life = .12
If XP_bonus = .21, gem_life = .13
If XP_bonus = .23, gem_life = .14
If XP_bonus = .25, gem_life = .15
If XP_bonus = .27, gem_life = .16
If XP_bonus = .29, gem_life = .17
If XP_bonus = .31, gem_life = .18

Adjusted_EHP = EHP * (1+Life% + gem_life)/(1 + Life%)
Adjusted_HP = HP * (1+Life% + gem_life)/(1 + Life%)

Use Adjusted_EHP and Adjusted_HP to replace EHP and HP in score. XP_bonus is after the -.35 adjustment for people wearing HF rings.

The one problem would be if someone is equipping Leoric's signet. But since nobody who has submitted a ranking has done so yet, it's probably a small issue. I'm not going to bother with below flawless square gem in helm since that should be the very minimum for any inferno character.

New raw sustain formula

1 + Mitigation*(LOH*(1+(APS-1)/2) + eff_ls + Regen ) / (HP*EHP_score*10,000/EHP)

Mitigation = EHP/HP

eff_ls = DPS*ls*.5

LOH should be increased by a high attack speed, but I'm scaling it downward because in practice, you aren't attacking every second. There will be times when you're frozen/walled/jailed or dodging arcane/molten/desecration or when you're simply moving to the next mob.

I hate increasing the LS factor since it destroys the 'purity' of the formula, but I agree that it's being underestimated in actual play. I think .5 is an acceptable compromise. Plus just like LOH, you're not attacking 100% of the time.

Mitigation replaces 10 which I'm happy about because it's less arbitrary and it reflects that sustain is more valuable the more mitigation you have.

I'm still dividing by HP in denominator because of the diminishing returns involved, but I'm scaling it downward the same way I'm scaling EHP downward in my formula. I think it's more fair to tankers this way since if they don't get full credit for EHP above 1M, they shouldn't be penalized for the full amount in the sustain score either.
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@Death

DPS is already favored over EHP. There is no diminishing returns with DPS whereas EHP becomes much less valuable above 1M in the formula.

@Rexxar

What you're proposing is to put diminishing returns in the sustain score. That could certainly work and seems like a pretty good proposal. Something like this:

If raw_sustain <= 1.5, net_sustain = raw_sustain
If 1.5 < raw_sustain <=2, net_sustain = 1.5 + (raw_sustain - 1.5)/2
If 2 < raw_sustain <=3, net_sustain = 1.75 + (raw_sustain - 2)/4
If raw_sustain > 3, net_sustain = 2 + (raw_sustain -3)/10

That certainly fits the 'feel' of sustain where the first sustain is vitally important but after a certain point you can't even use all the health you get back from your mega LS, LOH, and Regen.

What does everyone else think?
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@Rexxar

What you're proposing is to put diminishing returns in the sustain score. That could certainly work and seems like a pretty good proposal. Something like this:

If raw_sustain <= 1.5, net_sustain = raw_sustain
If 1.5 < raw_sustain <=2, net_sustain = 1.5 + (raw_sustain - 1.5)/2
If 2 < raw_sustain <=3, net_sustain = 1.75 + (raw_sustain - 2)/4
If raw_sustain > 3, net_sustain = 2 + (raw_sustain -3)/10

That certainly fits the 'feel' of sustain where the first sustain is vitally important but after a certain point you can't even use all the health you get back from your mega LS, LOH, and Regen.

What does everyone else think?

#75
1 hour ago
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I wish the formula can be linked to max HP or average monster damage but that is just bloody hard.

I was thinking if the formula should consider average monster damage or fixated monster damage, then the person with no LOH/LS/Regen or any life gain will have less than 1 sustain point. But, It doesn't justify the damage on every MP levels or the actual condition whether that person is during battle or not. So, I trash it out.

The second one is using max HP so the formula will scale downward just like the new proposal but I failed miserably :lol

So, I guess, using your new proposal is as good as the actual standard mitigation atm.

+1 to the new proposal
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It's too late at night to think, so I'll just approve.
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Hall Score: 22230.28488391

DPS Score: 125.99362
EHP Score: 96.87
Sustain Score: 1.1565962192545
Move Score: 1.24
Paragon Score: 1.27
Misc Score: 1

Working on it...
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I would like to apply for the hall, i think my dps score on diablo progress is like 175k unbuffed. Would be higher but the hellfire ring i have isnt counted so i put on my SoJ.

Thanks!

Edit pulled some info:

http://www.diabloprogress.com/hero/frankiebonez-1998/BeachTeets/24007588

Heroscore: 15,433
DPS Unbuffed: 172,422.79
EHP Unbuffed: 759,000
Edited by Frankiebonez#1998 on 11/13/2012 3:53 PM PST
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Hall Score: 25523

DPS Score: 104.556
EHP Score: 107.250
Sustain Score: 1.253
Move Score: 1.24
Paragon Score: 1.465
Misc Score: 1

Hope i get everything right. Please confirm celanian. Thanks.
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