Diablo® III

Electrify Magic Weapon & CM/WW

11/20/2012 03:27 AMPosted by RulerEric
I am going to try out just replacing shocking aspect tomorrow on MP6; wicked wind, safe passage, shards, unleashed, bone chill, electrify, cold blooded, evocation, critical mass


Idk Eric, I always find your mixing of skills interesting, but I rarely understand your thought process.

When I'm farming there's a constant balance between time spent moving, and time spent killing. Increasing movespeed will have diminishing returns on efficiency cause the ratio of time spent moving over time spent killing will shrink as you become faster as moving.

Same with dps, and you increase DPS time spent moving becomes a larger and larger % of your overal farm speed.

Raising MP in essense uses this formula by lowering your effective DPS, or increase your time spent killing vs your time spent moving. This reduces the emphasis on movement speed.

Therefore is absolutely possible to end up with not only greater loot, but greater xp/hour doing this spec in MP10 than raw SNS-wormhole in MP8. In MP8 your kill speed is fast, so you require fast movement speed to compete. In MP10 normally your kill time is so slow that movement speed becomes almost a non-issue for farming speed as a whole.

If you increase dps by a large enough margin, its absolutely better loot. In my experience today it was even higher xp (around 15% more/h) than MP8 SNS/Wormhole.
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Will test tonight. Since I'm not banned...
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Can't wait to test this out tonight.
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@whoop does using a tals source drop u believe 2.73 brkpoint, and if it does do u notice a difference?
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11/20/2012 03:50 AMPosted by Shandlar
I am going to try out just replacing shocking aspect tomorrow on MP6; wicked wind, safe passage, shards, unleashed, bone chill, electrify, cold blooded, evocation, critical mass


Idk Eric, I always find your mixing of skills interesting, but I rarely understand your thought process.

When I'm farming there's a constant balance between time spent moving, and time spent killing. Increasing movespeed will have diminishing returns on efficiency cause the ratio of time spent moving over time spent killing will shrink as you become faster as moving.

Same with dps, and you increase DPS time spent moving becomes a larger and larger % of your overal farm speed.

Raising MP in essense uses this formula by lowering your effective DPS, or increase your time spent killing vs your time spent moving. This reduces the emphasis on movement speed.

Therefore is absolutely possible to end up with not only greater loot, but greater xp/hour doing this spec in MP10 than raw SNS-wormhole in MP8. In MP8 your kill speed is fast, so you require fast movement speed to compete. In MP10 normally your kill time is so slow that movement speed becomes almost a non-issue for farming speed as a whole.

If you increase dps by a large enough margin, its absolutely better loot. In my experience today it was even higher xp (around 15% more/h) than MP8 SNS/Wormhole.


Sorry, to elaborate on what I said earlier.

This spec can be the new high MP spec. I think it can fill the roll of meteor for me in that regard. Also, I can see myself using this spec for group play as well instead of meteor.

Your right about the need for teleport in terms of movement is not as important in higher MPs where kill speed is the limiting factor anyways, so teleport can be dropped @ those MPs.

However in terms of lower MPs and walking through trash I'd choose teleport because the increase in damage from MW is NOT necessary to clear those areas and the limiting factor is movement speed. Of course a little DPS boost helps, but it is not necessary.

So to sum up, for myself personally, I would choose this spec for high MPs and group play where movement speed boost is not AS IMPORTANT as solo clearing MP6/7 for efficiency sake. I think I'm geting the sense you feel the same way Shandlar, but not 100% sure lol :)
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This works very well in MP 10, also Time Bomb completely outperforms CR in 10 imo, mobs die so much faster with TB and MW. I can now clear MP 10 in reasonable time to consider farming it, so thanks Shand :) granted I just got a Trifecta Amulet, so it counts too lol
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11/20/2012 09:49 AMPosted by novice
This works very well in MP 10, also Time Bomb completely outperforms CR in 10 imo, mobs die so much faster with TB and MW. I can now clear MP 10 in reasonable time to consider farming it, so thanks Shand :) granted I just got a Trifecta Amulet, so it counts too lol


LETS SEE THE AMMY!
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^lol I pm'd you for evaluation but no response, in the end I just grabbed it xD +6 IAS, but that together with Lacuni put me to 3.0, or 2.77 with an OS Wand. Really near end game for me, just need a good Lacuni for gg. Mitigation is no problem at all now.
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^ nice spec novice. have options... whats that trifecta like? A good lacuni does not exist imo so mempo and apoc force is end game for me to get 3.0 or 2.74+ with OS.
Edited by Aimless#1700 on 11/20/2012 10:04 AM PST
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11/20/2012 09:57 AMPosted by novice
^lol I pm'd you for evaluation but no response, in the end I just grabbed it xD +6 IAS, but that together with Lacuni put me to 3.0, or 2.77 with an OS Wand. Really near end game for me, just need a good Lacuni for gg. Mitigation is no problem at all now.


I'm on PST time, might have been sleeping.

Lets see this bad boy, your profile is not updated. I'm curious!

I agree, your character is hella tanky and is solid base to build upon.
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tested this out and the aoe damage is amazing, great find guys.

Only prob is that with my shy 650 ar and 4.2k armour i need teleport to survive in the highest mps so im actually better off with standard sns till i get better mtigation. same thing with meteor.

So one day ill be able to get full use in singleplayer, till then its pretty sweet for high but not highest mp multiplayer runs.
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What numbers are we speaking about?

I see in a Shandlar post that we should see about 900% extra damage, but in an Aimless post he sees about a 10.5 multiplier that's an extra 200% weapon damage, or a 25% overall

I actually tested this rune as well as the other magic weapon runes some days ago and didn't find any big improvement, didn't really use a chrono but for may taste MP10 was still painfully slow and with several silly deaths due to not having TP.
Edited by GreyMouser#2169 on 11/20/2012 11:16 AM PST
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What numbers are we speaking about?

I see in a Shandlar post that we should see about 900% extra damage, but in an Aimless post he sees about a 10.5 multiplier that's an extra 200% weapon damage, or a 25% overall

I actually tested this rune as well as the other magic weapon runes some days ago and didn't find any big improvement, didn't really use a chrono but for may taste MP10 was still painfully slow and with several silly deaths due to not having TP.


Yeah I think 140k or so DPS would make it more viable. Also you may try Time Bomb over CR, it really does more DPS, noticable.
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If you farm trash mobs, Meteor Shower is the best, period. No skill can hit an area as large as it can, and the AoE damage is insane.
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11/20/2012 11:46 AMPosted by novice
If you farm trash mobs, Meteor Shower is the best, period. No skill can hit an area as large as it can, and the AoE damage is insane.


Except you give up a swath of SA procs from casting meteors instead of WW, not to mention the drop in arcane power return, longer refresh times from CM on your other AoEs (shards and CR), and meteors not scaling with attack speed.
Edited by BDF#1838 on 11/20/2012 12:13 PM PST
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I feel like Sparkatus!!!
Great find boys. ;)
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Here's what I hope to be some easy to follow math on electrify. The gist of the math is Electrify rune should add about 20% dps tops, at 4+ mobs.

At 3.0 breakpoint, you get 40 tics per WW cast, or 5 eletctrify procs per WW per target. Each proc does 10% weapon damage for a total of 50% weapon damage extra per WW. The base damage of WW Is 252% so for 2 targets your WW does about 20% more damage.

My simulator results are telling me that for 55% crit, 3.01APS, and 20 APoC, WW makes up about 30-35% of your total dps, so let's say 35%. That means with Electrify you'll do about 0.35*0.2*100 = 7% more dps. I'm just going to neglect the CR, FN, and DS procs since they have very low proc rates compared to WW.

Just to be clear about my calculations, I'm lookint at it on a per mob basis. Obviously it scales with the number of mobs, but if you calcuate the total damage, and divide by 2 you should get an overall 7% dps increase.

If you have 3 mobs present, the bonus damage is about 100% weapon damage per WW, for an overall increase in dps of 14%. Likewise, 3+targets would mean 21% increase. Just to compare, this scaling is the same result as Shandlar has in his first post. 150% for 2 targets means 75% per target. 440% for 3 targets is about 150% per target because he rounded the procs to 18 instead of using 22.5. 900% for 4 targets is 225% extra damage per target, which is 3 times the 75% for 2 targets, so the scaling is actually linnear on a per target basis.

In short, what you're seeing from the high aoe dps is mostly just an overall increase in dps due to multiple targets. Even with 4+ mobs Electrify should only give about 20% dps increase (in addition to the 10% from MW). It's still better than Slow Time from a soloing perspective, for all fights except against single target, and about even with 2 targets.

Please let me know if there's any errors in the math. I've gone over them a couple times but hadn't really put much thought into the rune before today.
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