Get the Desktop App for Battle.net Now
- All your games in 1 place
- Log in once
- Automatic game updates
i'm not getting this 1-2shot then trap then repeat rinse combo..
you are not mistaken, they are theoretically identical damage output over infinite time
the use of 1 at a time is more for management/efficiency distributing the damage as evenly as possible
when you are starved for hatred, waiting till you have 90 again can become a waste of time (since the monsters may all be dead by then) you'd be better off shooting 2-3 then putting down a trap and getting the full potential of your layered damage
there is nothing wrong with all 3, then shooting for 3.2 seconds, for longer fights
the models are there for you to notice that in 3.2 seconds you need to drop 3 echos and have x seconds left to regen 90 hatred; that is another way to look at it
with 4 hate/sec (x3.2 seconds) the echos cost 90 over = 77.2 remaining
you also need to shoot nearly 26 bola shots to regain that hatred.. impossible
with 7hate/sec you need to create 68, and 8 shots of tinkerer(+grenadier) will do it
if 8 grenades do it, and you have 3 echos, thats 11 shots in 3.2 seconds or 3.43 APS, a ton of aps is needed.. so you still have potential hatred issues that can be solved with M4D, vengeance, a templar, gear.. until you can sustain 29/hate sec you are not using spike trap to it's fullest
derivations of a shot pattern are simply going to have to adapt to the game as you encounter it
Edited by zoid#1554 on 12/4/2012 8:55 AM PST
think I go with 1st reply as a general rule.
If they are more stationary I face-tank them and drop 3 down within about 2 -3 seconds.
If they are more mobile (ie succubus/wasps in particular) I lay them down as needed and try and draw them over by moving.
Archers not to hard. They tend, unless they are teleport, to stay a little ranged and often clustered together so I can lay multiple down there as well.
For me I typically will pop SP and put a slight delay between traps ... I don't just mash the spiked trap button. Running NIghstalker I always keep spamming my main hungering or bola (depending on what I'm running at the time) and between my primary and the spiked it keeps my disc up.
When I'm encountering stationary elites or large mobs I don't even watch the main screen persay. I focus mostly on the SP:GLOOM timer. Once I see it expires I re-activate it and again start with the spiked traps with maybe up to 1sec between them. Works wonders and virtually no deaths unless I'm in too many arcane fields or get frozen with phasebeasts. I do want to clarify I do watch the environment on the main screen but I have much more focus on my sp:gloom timer to know when to reactivate so I can restart my spiked traps. This helps a lot to keep enough hatred flowing to withstand even extra health mobs (unless you are playing very high MP) and burn 'em down without totally running out of hatred.
I run marked for death - mortal enemy on the elite im trying to kill and i use companion - bat for hatred regen as well as custom engineering which allows me too toss down 6 traps. If the attacker is ranged Ill spam him with all 6, if he is cmelee ill spam them all in front of myself. Echoing blast dmg regens hatred while mortal enemy is cast on them so I have a very steady use of traps especially with custom eng.
Echoing is like scatter. 3 explosions for 1 trap vs 1 explosion from 3 separate traps. Plus if you lay at your feet it affects a tighter proximity to yourself over scatter which is spread out
The delays each echoing explosion produces is, in my opinion, better than scatter.placing a scatter against a large mob is great and better than echoing from the standpoint you get to melt that mob much quicker vs a 1sec delay between each echoing blast. However when you want to deal with elites which want to be more melee on you or those big turtle killers (whatever they are called) Often times it takes more than 1 "explosion" to kill them Using echoing can often kill them just themselves (depending on the MP level) when they do their charge toward you and then stop and do their hiding/protection annimation. Place a echoing there and you will typically get 2 or even all 3 hits on the beast. When combined with SP:GLOOM echoing rune will allow you constant Life Leech vs potentially all at once leaving your more vulnerable.
There is a place where scatter works better than echoing. For instance things like the sand wasps or succubus. Where they are in constant motion and hard to get a good 3-hit from an echoing itself. However I think the effectiveness of echoing under almost all circumstances will well outperform the scatter rune for virtually all of your game play with few exceptions.
I used to use spiked a lot back in the early days but have found for myself, based on the way I like to play, nothing is better than echoing.
Yarp, I used scatter for 100s of hours. My fav thing to do was lay all 3 at a tight hallway or in a door way, then pull elites into it and instantly melt the whole pack. I then went LFB as my damage was high enough that I could 1 hit trash and spank packs with 2 hits + beasty bombs. But with the higher HP in mp4 +, LFB was too inneffecient. Scatter is more spikey and can nuke 1 thing real quick, but I prefer the precision and flexibility of echoing blast.
the only down side with echo < scatter will transfer cold damage, that is the only difference
they are identical (cept for play 'style') in regard to damage output/potential
and just to note, the power of scatter and echo make all other spike trap runes functionally useless...
devs need to think on that
Edited by zoid#1554 on 12/4/2012 10:49 AM PST
Tried this last night on MP7 Azmodan, alternating bolas and spike traps while making sure I don't go over the 3 trap limit. I also had MfD: Grim Reaper on as well (should have used another rune - no adds lol!).
With 203k dps in my new nats gear, he was dropping faster than usual. I'm definitely sticking to spike traps for Ubers from now on.
As for farming, I'm clinging valiantly to my old spec (in profile) and legacy nats...it's just too good to let go for my playstyle. Thanks to all who contributed to this thread :)
they only work by exploiting the poor behavior of AI...
unless they will be invisible to enemies :)
Edited by zoid#1554 on 12/4/2012 6:27 PM PST
they only work by exploiting the poor behavior of AI... unless they will be invisible to enemies :)
Maybe scatter with custom engineering to put 6 mines out in the span of a couple of seconds? Combine that with a cm wiz ftw maybe... It's going to be a blast coming up with OP team-based combos like that.
Threats of violence. We take these seriously and will alert the proper authorities.
Posts containing personal information about other players. This includes physical addresses, e-mail addresses, phone numbers, and inappropriate photos and/or videos.
Harassing or discriminatory language. This will not be tolerated.