Diablo® III

Dualwield dead? Bring your ideas. Blizzard?

100 Tauren Druid
4610
Posts: 4,963
11/23/2012 10:01 AMPosted by Monsta
that would just kill sw.
i don't think so,
a great DML will have a Skill modifier, having another 14% bola is still pretty unique to sw

the point of the static APS would compensate only speed
on a 3 APS build the +.1 is only a 3.3% dps increase, it isn't enough to kill SW
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11/23/2012 10:15 AMPosted by Korba
that would just kill sw.
i don't think so,
a great DML will have a Skill modifier, having another 14% bola is still pretty unique to sw

the point of the static APS would compensate only speed
on a 3 APS build the +.1 is only a 3.3% dps increase, it isn't enough to kill SW


Well if you apply the .1 to final aps instead of weapon base speed then it's no, it's not enough to kill calamity + dml, but it's also still not enough of a buff to make DW viable either.
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11/23/2012 07:05 AMPosted by D3MON
I dont think i could bare the slow asz shooting of manticore..


I wouldn't be able to stand it either....that's why I stacked IAS on most all of my gear. :P

2.34 IAS with a Manticore vs. the slightly higher 2.40 IAS of most DW users.

Having said that, i wish they would buff DW because i have a bunch of hand crossbows in my stash that i've had drop that i've been waiting to use...but DW is just too gimped IMO. The style and mechanic of DW is amazing, but not worth the loss of critical stats. It does need a fix, so i know that feel bro.
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100 Tauren Druid
4610
Posts: 4,963
11/23/2012 10:55 AMPosted by Monsta
it's not enough to kill calamity + dml, but it's also still not enough of a buff to make DW viable either.

certainly not,

the 3 lousy dawn/revenge/slayer still need to be buffed to allow DW pairings of those to be competitive/viable (edit I mean optimization capability not 'viable'). be it with any number of collection CC%, leech, socket, CD%, +max hatred, hate regen, max disc, vit, resistance, armor, skill bonuses, run speed, or ... w/e else could be interesting

it's still possible for a pair of 1300+ dps rares to be competitive, just insanely rare
50%, near perfect +min/max, socket, 80+CD%, 11%IAS and 200 dex
with a starting sticker price of only 4B i'm sure...
Edited by zoid#1554 on 11/23/2012 12:00 PM PST
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Dual Wield is sexy.... i want a sexy modifier for my DH for DWing

maybe a passive that gives DW like a 20% chance to STUN on crit

i don't care if it makes sense.. thats what i want
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Imo DW was intended to be the most powerfull option (DMG wise) from the beginning - sacrificing survivabilty for maximum DMG output.

Why? back in the days *cough* AS was the most powerfull statbut due to the hard AS nerf - DW became more and more obsolet and forgotton - killed by the 1.04 DML buff.

Honestly, i dont want any more survivabilty with my DW build (+10 disci is just fine) i want DMG and sick attackspeed - not a combination thats even slower(!!!!!) than a SW combo :/ being outperformed by a quiver on steroids

Sick AS and DMG (lets say we get a +1 attacks like echoing fury) + Gloom = instant heal
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I also have the same problem. I do not have a godly spite or DML but my DML will give me about 20k difference in DPS, not mentioning the extra vitality as well. Dualweld is cool but it seems weaker in most cases

I also love the attack speed of my calamity that i pass my manticore to my scoundrel. Stunlock with spike trap is fun
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Perhaps dual wield can give bonuses on certain skills, like Rapid Fire, Evasive Fire, Strafe, and Multishot.
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100 Tauren Druid
4610
Posts: 4,963
when dual wielding gain a 15% chance to fire two shots simultaneously.

that's actually pretty high, 7% would likely be enough to be worth it
Edited by zoid#1554 on 11/24/2012 4:13 PM PST
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Dual wield needs a serious buff.

Something like 20%ias and 5% crit just for using 2 x 1h

Or:

Allow to wear a quiver. The quiver is in the character graphics anyway, and we still shoot arrows!


This!
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This thread needs more love!
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Calamity+Danetta's or Calamity+DML

Calamity+DML hands down. Even if you account for the naturally enhanced ias you get when DW, it's just too much of a loss in terms of main stats such as Dex and Vit not to mention the skill+ perks and crit chance. DW needs some loving.
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Having been DW since 1.0.3, sure overall less raw stats but waaay more entertaining than SW.

Simply buffing DW to match the power of a good SW setup seems unimaginative. DW'ing should differentiate itself even more from SW in that it could be more proc focused with high APS, a +% to proc coefficient DW buff and insane CC rather than stacking CD and raw mob munching power. 1hxbows need to be able to roll a CC (up to 5 or 6) affix to offset the lack of off hand. That would put max CC (75%) well in the range of possibility for most decently geared DW'ers at the expense of lower CD.

The stunlock - traps build is great fun for ubers but it's still far behind a CM freeze wiz in all situations. It's very meh in large mobs and following a WW barb into a huge mob is often suicide trying to tank with CC + ground affixes harshing positioning. A DW buff to %proc alone would propel bola/thunder ball (or stun nades) + impale/impact to at least nipping the heels of a CM wiz in controlling the battlefield.

It's just too bad there isn't more of a variety in DH skills. Having only slow/stun as crowd control is limited and slow is terrible in any situation other than solo kiting. Kinda pigeon holes DH into fire support while having a few variations on that.

Though, it is fun to have a party of WW barb + freeze lock wiz + stun lock DH + blind lock Monk or some relating combination thereof. That works really well even now.

Edit for cool idea: If DW caused fan of knives to occur twice on use would actually make that skill useful. Vault in, FoK stun, vault out, fire fire fire stun stun stun, vault in, FoK > repeat. Sounds fun.
Edited by Praxis#1130 on 11/25/2012 10:14 AM PST
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Dual wield caused 2 projectiles to be used for hatred spenders but twice the cost.

That's all they'd need to do. Crazy good burst would be lots of fun.
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*Push* Rescue DW !
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i swapped to the danettas set from a windforce + DML.. i had an amazing dml and wanted to sell it to buy a great tal rashas for my WD.. so i did that.. got lucky drops on my danettas so switching to them wasnt an issue when my DML sold for 500m :P
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ummmmm... maybe give archery +10 CC per crossbow? so like 2 1-handers would give you 20%CC or like 10% for mainhand and 5% for offhand for total of 15%, it would then match the issue with the CC on DML being more valuable than a DW setup
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You gain or lose from DW to SW all depends on ur stats;

My mainstats:

DML Danettas
~ 2644 Dex ~ 2637 Dex
~ 67.5 Crit ~ 57.5 Crit (with Scoundrel)
~ 309 Crit DMG ~ 483 Crit DMG

My DML 200 dex 176vit 20% aspd, 10%cc, 12% elemental arrow

I lose 14k dps by switching from Danettas to DML, mainly becoz my cri dmg not as high as ops, increase in CC 10% and lose of cri dmg 174% still cost me 12k dps by switching to DML. From 217k to 203k dps.

But i found that with such a high CC 75% (with caltrop) i clear Act 3 MP2 much much faster than before lol. This is because my white dmg sometimes cant 1 shot the trash mobs but my cri dmg do 1 shot most of the trash mobs.
Edited by Yuson#6544 on 11/28/2012 7:29 PM PST
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DW definitely need a buff, especially with Crit chance. It make no sense when DW have low Average damage and low Crit chance.
Edited by Paksonghip#1355 on 11/28/2012 8:35 PM PST
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requested a sticky on this thread because i DW as well, its cool but sacrificing 10% c.c from dml is a bit too much how about blizz, buff the archery passive like adding at least 5% c.c on off hand when we DW.....that would be nice....im sick and tired of manticore such a boring weapon
Edited by ilov2violate#6297 on 11/28/2012 10:51 PM PST
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