Diablo® III

Fixing useless stats

Changing OwE does not mean removing it. It'll most likely stay very similar, but less gear restrictive and mandatory. Having to regear will only increase the nerf.

Anyways, the same can be said for for WDs with your MF/GF/HGF and pickup radius change.
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Along with Stats buffs, they need to attend to some item types also...

My suggestions:

1 - Polearms and Daibos should have double the reach of other weapons.
-- No one uses Polearms and Daibos... they're just too slow... if at least that caused you to have more range, maybe some Barbs and Monks would use them.

2 - Wizards should be able to equip Sources as Off Hands with Staves.
-- Makes no sense that 2 handed Axes and Maces are better Wizard weapons than Staves.
If the wizards could equip Sources along with Staves, it would be a different option to build around, even if Staff affixes would need to be reduced so they behave more like Bows/Crossbows

3 - Witch Doctors should be able to equip Mojos with Crossbows.
--Crossbows can roll Witch Doctor bonuses, but they're severely lacking in power when compared to other 2 handed weapons because they're balanced to use WITH A QUIVER!
If Witch Doctors could use a Mojo with a Crossbow, I could see LOTS of WDs using that whole lot of Intelligence Manticores....

4 - All 2 handed weapons should be able to roll 2 sockets.
--I mean, when dual wielding 1 handed weapons you can get 2 sockets.....
if using 1 handed + source you can get 2 sockets....
Why can't my Skorn have 2 sockets?
it should just to be fair.

2 handed weapons were already buffed... and they aren't used by anyone....
most players don't even pick up 2 handed yellows from the ground anymore.

Some other suggestions to improve itemization would be, for example, an extra affix tier that could only roll in blue items...

For example, a yellow/legendary amulet can have up to +10% critical hit chance....
A Blue amulet could get to 13-14% maybe even 15%....

this way MAYBE someone would be using a Sawtooth Amulet of Far Sight with + 15% critical hit chance + 400 intelligence instead of a fancy yellow with 6 affixes...
this could generate a lot of pretty interesting stuff revolving around a single stat....
And would give reason to people actually read Blue item stats.

11/22/2012 06:39 AMPosted by Joren
The changes your propose are pretty good, but the implantation is difficult. Blizz would have to update every item existing: Something they can do, but it would require a lot of time and resources. They'll probably wait until they have more changes on itemization and then update all of it at the same time.


It wasn't difficult when they cut attack speed by half overnight....
most changes OP proposed are almost just like that....

for example, triple every single resist, make every bleed scale with user DPS, make thorns take main stat into account...

Almost everything is just changes to existing parameters in affixes... global changes....
should not be that problematic.
Edited by seilaoque#1726 on 11/22/2012 7:43 AM PST
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It wasn't difficult when they cut attack speed by half overnight....
most changes OP proposed are almost just like that....

I didn't say they couldn't do it. It's just that there are A LOT more items that spawn these affixes and there a lot more items in general. Also, there was a "need" to do it quickly, which there isn't right now.
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Just to nitpick on a few of the changes I disagree with...

Magic Find/Gold Find - These stats should at least be combined, but that won't copletely resolve the problam. This is how you make it usefull: change it to "Gold, Magic and Health Globe Find". This will encourage builds focusing on health globes as a way of sustain and/or damage (WD Gruesome Feast).


There really isn't a problem with GF or MF.
People still seek out these affixes and they still boost the value of items.
I'm not opposed to combining GF/MF as one affix but I very much disagree taking that further as it feels overpowered. Part of the strategic purpose behind GF/MF is to weigh the difference between increasing your combat efficiency vs improving a non-combat benefit.

Life After Kill - Completely useless and counters the idea of the health globe mechanic. Should only be on some legendary items as garnish.


This affix is a more reliable health globe mechanic as it triggers 100% of the time on kill.
It's not worthless but instead it poorly scales compared to things like LoH.
Life after kill should be changed to a % gain of total life.

On the other hand you are 100% correct in saying it goes against the health globe mechanic. But I'm generally opposed to removing something from the game entirely.

Indestructible - Completely useless and counters the idea of a gold sink in game. Should only be on some legendary items as garnish


The only reason why this is useless is because death isn't actually en effective gold sink.
If death cost say 5% of your overall gold, you could sure as hell bet that this affix would be sought after.

That said I believe this affix should be reworked.
The affix implies some defensive benefit so why not make akin to damage reduction? Industructable adds 5% damage reduction for example.

Pickup Radius - Should range between 7-10 yards.


Pickup Radius is a VERY powerful affix for defense and farming efficiency.
It's one of those things that feels balanced already.
You can easily use 2 pieces of equipment with this affix and be content.
Edited by babinro#1836 on 11/22/2012 7:49 AM PST
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By now it seems that blizzard realised that there's just too many stats in the game that no one can benefit from. What's frustrating about this is that, in my opinion, resolving these issues is not very problematic:

Thorns - Change it to reflect all damage done to you, based on either a percentage your damage or the damage taken.
Bleed Chance - Should be damage that is a percentage based on your damage, which would make it scale.
Experience Gained - Should allways be percentage based.
Magic Find/Gold Find - These stats should at least be combined, but that won't copletely resolve the problam. This is how you make it usefull: change it to "Gold, Magic and Health Globe Find". This will encourage builds focusing on health globes as a way of sustain and/or damage (WD Gruesome Feast).
Indestructible - Completely useless and counters the idea of a gold sink in game. Should only be on some legendary items as garnish.
Life After Kill - Completely useless and counters the idea of the health globe mechanic. Should only be on some legendary items as garnish.
Life regeneration - Should be buffed to make it competitive with Life Steal and Life on Hit.
Singular Resists - Should range between 100-200.
Extra Health from Potions and Health Globes - Should be changed to: "x% to life and resource pool from health globes and potions". Should range between 15%-30%.
Chill/Freeze on hit - Completely useless. We already have cold damage, immobilize and slow on hit, no idea why this is even in game.
Blind/Fear/Knockback/Slow/Stun/Immobilize on Hit - With the recent changes Blizzard made to how CC effects work, It's long overdue for these stats to get a huge buff. Should range between 15%-30%.
Single Skill Bonuses - Need to roll on legendary or corresponding class items only. Should recieve a slight buff to actually make them desirable.
Crowd Control Reduction - Should recieve a slight buff and cap at 85%-90%.
Pickup Radius - Should range between 7-10 yards.

These changes are meant to ecourage a more diverse skill and passive selection among the classes and to combat the tendency of all players to look for the exact same stats.


could you also tell them to buff monk's mantra of retribtution? That skill REALLY SUCKS and needs a buff ... the mantra of retribution - retaliation is FAKE 60% reflected and when used it, the damage reflected back at white trash mobs is INSIGNIFICANT ..
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Just to nitpick on a few of the changes I disagree with...

Magic Find/Gold Find - These stats should at least be combined, but that won't copletely resolve the problam. This is how you make it usefull: change it to "Gold, Magic and Health Globe Find". This will encourage builds focusing on health globes as a way of sustain and/or damage (WD Gruesome Feast).


There really isn't a problem with GF or MF.
People still seek out these affixes and they still boost the value of items.
I'm not opposed to combining GF/MF as one affix but I very much disagree taking that further as it feels overpowered. Part of the strategic purpose behind GF/MF is to weigh the difference between increasing your combat efficiency vs improving a non-combat benefit.

Life After Kill - Completely useless and counters the idea of the health globe mechanic. Should only be on some legendary items as garnish.


This affix is a more reliable health globe mechanic as it triggers 100% of the time on kill.
It's not worthless but instead it poorly scales compared to things like LoH.
Life after kill should be changed to a % gain of total life.

On the other hand you are 100% correct in saying it goes against the health globe mechanic. But I'm generally opposed to removing something from the game entirely.

Indestructible - Completely useless and counters the idea of a gold sink in game. Should only be on some legendary items as garnish


The only reason why this is useless is because death isn't actually en effective gold sink.
If death cost say 5% of your overall gold, you could sure as hell bet that this affix would be sought after.

That said I believe this affix should be reworked.
The affix implies some defensive benefit so why not make akin to damage reduction? Industructable adds 5% damage reduction for example.

Pickup Radius - Should range between 7-10 yards.


Pickup Radius is a VERY powerful affix for defense and farming efficiency.
It's one of those things that feels balanced already.
You can easily use 2 pieces of equipment with this affix and be content.


Agree with everything you said.
Still, Life on Kill would not be sought after even if it filled your health back to 100% everytime you killed something....

it would still give you tons of life at times you don't need it and no life during hard battles.

it's a intrinsically bad stat.
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That said:- introducing it without changing older gear - every monk gear becomes crap.- introducing it retroactively - monk OwE becomes extremely overpowered.- introducing it retroactively AND changing OwE - almost impossible to achieve without destroying every monk's build (and with build I mean gear composition).


I think that change on single resist may re-balance the monk instead destroying or making it overpower. Most people feels monks are very weak compared to other classes, it could give them an edge for investing less on resist (aka, making resist cheaper to monks) and letting they invest more on DPS.

Don't worry about people creating immortal monks - it already costs less than 1kk gc on AH items and very few think they are amazing because of that; they just don't kill any elite mob on average/higher monster power. They will still exists, but perhaps now they will be able to kill something.

Anyway, I see a sense on what you're trying to tell us; One with Everything passive should be reajusted in some way (like, min resist = some% of greater resist).
Edited by Rago#1835 on 11/22/2012 8:20 AM PST
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I'm sad that this discussion switched to being about monks and that broken mandatory passive. I would prefer that we would stay on topic, so here's a simple solution:

One With Everything - Your resistance to all elements is raised by 24% of your highest resistance, which is decreased by 6%.

After retroactive changes this passive will mostly benefit monks who have double resistance on their gear, but will also benefit those who do not (becouse single resistance stats will more then double).
Edited by HATOTAH#2129 on 11/22/2012 8:21 AM PST
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I saw your point, HATOTAH, I changed a little my comment ;)
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Have you ever tried stacking this stat?

If you have, and got it to around 74% (I have) you notice a huugggeee difference.

Making it easier to get to that would be over powered. (Although I would love to make it easier to reach higher numbers I feel it needs to be remain difficult in order to keep it valuable.)

Allowing it to cap at 85-90% would be game breaking.

Keep PVP and PVE in mind when suggesting these changes.

I like that you included it because I really enjoy this stat for my current build, but it does not need a buff.


Point taken, I just feel like stacking it should be a little bit easier, given the fact that it's not a stat most find useful or even seek. Good comment though, so lets learn from this:

Crowd Control Reduction - Should roll on fewer types of items, and recieve a buff to compensate.
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To all those who offer ideas about changes other then item stats, while I appreciate your enthusiasm and opinions, this is not the place. this thread was created to adress a certain issue, and while I agree that there is still a lack of skill, passive, rune and item balance please stick to the issue. I will open other threads for those issues soon.

And keep up the good comments, I will post a revisioned opinion after I feel like all my points have been adressed. thanks :)
Edited by HATOTAH#2129 on 11/22/2012 8:53 AM PST
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The point I was trying to make was that keeping the old items in the game is really bad for a large group.

Single Skill Bonuses - Need to roll on legendary or corresponding class items only. Should recieve a slight buff to actually make them desirable.


I think it's fine that Wiz skills can roll together with stat that aren't beneficial for the Wiz. You can't have good items if you don't have bad items. An idea that Kripp gave and that I do like is matching these affixes with their corresponding main stat. So, a belt that has +dex or +int (+vit should work, though) will never roll barb skill bonuses. This way perfectly rolled items that otherwise would be ruined have a higher chance to be worth something.

Other things I'd like to see changed are the effect of main stats and crit. dmg. If endgame dps was lower, more affixes would become viable.
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To all those who offer ideas about changes other then item stats, while I appreciate your enthusiasm and opinions, this is not the place. this thread was created to adress a certain issue, and while I agree that there is still a lack of skill, passive, rune and item balance please stick to the issue. I will open other threads for those issues soon.

And keep up the good comments, I will post a revisioned opinion after I feel like all my points have been adressed. thanks :)


Sorry, I was one of the guys who went a little overboard when I suggested changes in weapon types along with Affixes.

Now, Life Regen comes to my attention...

you're asking for a buff to it, I'm not so sure it's needed actually...
it's passive regen....
it shouldn't be able to compete toe to toe with Life on Hit or Life Steal that are active regeneration affixes....

And Life Regen already rolls in a lot of stuff...
maybe it could roll on less pieces of equip and receive a minor buff, but it's already pretty relevant as it is today.

If you buff it to get the regeneration on par (or close) to life on hit, then life on hit would be complete obsolete.
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Other things I'd like to see changed are the effect of main stats and crit. dmg. If endgame dps was lower, more affixes would become viable.

Excelent point, I agree.

And Life Regen already rolls in a lot of stuff...
maybe it could roll on less pieces of equip and receive a minor buff, but it's already pretty relevant as it is today.

The amount rolled on items tends to be too low, the range of this stat needs to be adjusted.
as a main point: the range of an unpopular stat need to be better than the range of a popular one, for obvious reasons.
Edited by HATOTAH#2129 on 11/22/2012 9:40 AM PST
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Perhaps the minimum amount of Lps should be buffed. The stat already is pretty good, but I agree that it can be a pain if it rolls really low.
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11/22/2012 09:53 AMPosted by Joren
Perhaps the minimum amount of Lps should be buffed. The stat already is pretty good, but I agree that it can be a pain if it rolls really low.


Minimum rolls should be buffed to almost everything when dropped by lv63 monsters....
How infuriating is finding a Lacuni Prowlers with 15 resist all?

But yeah, this could fix Life Regeneration pretty well.
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11/22/2012 09:56 AMPosted by seilaoque
Perhaps the minimum amount of Lps should be buffed. The stat already is pretty good, but I agree that it can be a pain if it rolls really low.


Minimum rolls should be buffed to almost everything when dropped by lv63 monsters....
How infuriating is finding a Lacuni Prowlers with 15 resist all?

But yeah, this could fix Life Regeneration pretty well.


If every piece of gear had 15 AR, you'd have a decent amount. If every piece had 15 Lps, you still wouldn't notice it.

Like I said: you need bad items to have good items.
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Minimum rolls should be buffed to almost everything when dropped by lv63 monsters....
How infuriating is finding a Lacuni Prowlers with 15 resist all?

But yeah, this could fix Life Regeneration pretty well.


If every piece of gear had 15 AR, you'd have a decent amount. If every piece had 15 Lps, you still wouldn't notice it.

Like I said: you need bad items to have good items.


Agreed on needing bad items to have good items....

but yesterday I bought a crappy lacuni prowlers for 75k just for the movement speed so I can roflstomp MP3 even faster than before....

The same item being sold from 75k up to 1 billion REALLY bothers me....
even the "legendaries" are too random....

I don't ask to All Resists roll over 70 every time... but level 63 affixes rolling 15 all resists is a big joke...
if it rolled 35 would still be a bad roll, but not so much of a joke.

Yeah, Life Regeneration needs this way more than All Resists does right now...

The proposed fix to Life Regen making it never roll below, let's say, 150 on level 63 affixes would be a good fix... and still allow for a big range of values for this stat and never being completely worthless.

You never see critical hit chance below 3.0% on a level 63 affix.... for example... this could stay like this.

You need to be lucky too many times to have a really good item nowadays.

Keeping the example on Lacuni Prowlers....

0 - First, a Lacuni Prowlers needs to hit the ground....
1 - It NEEDS to roll critical chance or won't have much value, EVER. Exactly because of what OP wanted with this topic... Affixes are NOT balanced... AT ALL.
2 - it NEEDS to roll Resist All or a Main Attribute.
3 - That roll from 2 NEEDS to be at least nice... Roll 30 intelligence or 15 all resists and your item just got subpar again.
4 - everything else does not matter.

Would it hurt much if Resists rolled between 40 and 80 instead of 10 and 80?
or if Intelligence rolled between 60 and 200 instead of 20 and 200?

There are a lot of Bad yellow Bracers, we don't need BiS legendaries to be as bad as those.

Nowadays affixes roll between negligible mediocre to uber godly.
I really think they could go from OK (relevant) to uber godly..... At least on legs.
This would just make item drops a little less frustrating.

Again this is not fixing "useless" specific stats, but trying to fix "useless" stats in general.
a lot of stats need higher minimum rolls, IMO.

Life Regeneration just happens to be one of them.
Edited by seilaoque#1726 on 11/22/2012 11:26 AM PST
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