Diablo® III

Fixing useless stats

Would it hurt much if Resists rolled between 40 and 80 instead of 10 and 80?
or if Intelligence rolled between 60 and 200 instead of 20 and 200?


I agree, right now the range of stats is too large and makes for some laughable results at times. the ranges do need to be adjusted a bit, mainly for lvl62-63 items.
That said, the main concern of this thread are usless stats. feel free to voice your opinion, but please stick to the subject.
Edited by HATOTAH#2129 on 11/22/2012 1:24 PM PST
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I think that affix ranges fall in the same category as useless affixes. And since Blizz will have to update the items - or at least should -, I think it's beneficial to discuss other changes to itemization as well.
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Agree with all but a few items from op:

Blind/Fear/Knockback/Slow/Stun/Immobilize on Hit:
There are a few items that goes above the range of 15%-30%, and it makes a huge difference. IMO those high range of CC should only be on selected few items. They will be fun to use, but it wouldn't make sense to have high CC on every item.

Crowd Control Reduction - Should receive a slight buff and cap at 85%-90%:
I think CCR currently is working fine as it as after 1.0.5.

Pickup Radius:
I don't think the PR on items needs a buff, but instead I think the default "0" PR needs a buff. I would like to have a default PR of, say 2 feet instead of 0. It's pretty ridiculous sometimes that you need multiple pass to pickup a pile of gold.
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OP and Seilaoque said most of the things I would say. Even though, I'll throw my two cents...

It's really interesting when I read about Diablo "itemization". Why...? Well, think about a DPS character - don't mind about class - in Diablo 3, now answer to yourselves a couple questions...

1- Name a Helm: Mempo of Twilight
2- Name a Shoulder: Vile Wards
3- Name a waist: The Witching Hour
4- Name a wrist: Lacuni Prowlers
5- Name a Leg: Inna's Temperance
6- Name a boot: Zunimassa's
7- Name a 1h Weapon: Echoing Fury

Now think with me, except for DHs who won't use Echoing Fury, out of 13 slots, everybody is aiming for the very same equipment!

Oh come on... Really? Itemization? Variety? If Blizzard aimed for that they missed by that much.

Thanks to this incomprehensible "itemization system" and laughable affix rolling range, you can find these equipments for 2K gold or 2Bi gold. We have crappy geared characters using the "same" equipments a top geared player.

If you can have a crapy lacuni prowlers for very cheap, why even border have blues and yellows? Let's only have lacuni prowlers from 1 to 63, rolling affixes from 1 to 257... That applys to the other items I've mentioned as well... (you can add manticore on the pool too).

IMO, a legendary should be something to be "proud of". A legendary should be, by definition, an item better than a rare, no matter how it rolls. Reduce the legendary drop rate and grant that they will ALWAYS be useful for somebody and not only to occupy a stash slot.

I'm sorry if I went offtopic, but I believe that "my point" only applies because of the problems OP is trying to solve with his suggestions.
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Blind/Fear/Knockback/Slow/Stun/Immobilize on Hit:
There are a few items that goes above the range of 15%-30%, and it makes a huge difference. IMO those high range of CC should only be on selected few items. They will be fun to use, but it wouldn't make sense to have high CC on every item.

That range is mainly an example and probably not optimal, but regular rolls of this sort shouldn't be comletely negligent.

Crowd Control Reduction - Should receive a slight buff and cap at 85%-90%:
I think CCR currently is working fine as it as after 1.0.5.

This was adressed, and my suggestion was changed:
Crowd Control Reduction - Should roll on fewer types of items, and recieve a buff to compensate.

I don't think the PR on items needs a buff, but instead I think the default "0" PR needs a buff. I would like to have a default PR of, say 2 feet instead of 0. It's pretty ridiculous sometimes that you need multiple pass to pickup a pile of gold.

I believe that this idea is valid, even more so than mine, but that is more of a "quality of life" improvement.
Edited by HATOTAH#2129 on 11/22/2012 8:25 PM PST
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Merovingian, I agree with everything you said except this:
IMO, a legendary should be something to be "proud of". A legendary should be, by definition, an item better than a rare, no matter how it rolls. Reduce the legendary drop rate and grant that they will ALWAYS be useful for somebody and not only to occupy a stash slot.

I agree with blizzard, rares should have the chance to roll better than any other legendary, otherwise there is no reason for them being in game.
On the other hand, legendaries should always be somewhat useful. Right now they are rarely useful, with some of them never being more than vendor trash.
But you did raise an important issue: right now, even more than before, people are looking for the same item. this patch has, unfortunately, been a step back in terms of itemization diversity. And although it's off topic, I have to admit that fixing items with OP stats is just as important as fixing those with useless stats.
There should never be so many items that are the best for all classes.

1- Name a Helm: Mempo of Twilight
2- Name a Shoulder: Vile Wards
3- Name a waist: The Witching Hour
4- Name a wrist: Lacuni Prowlers
5- Name a Leg: Inna's Temperance
6- Name a boot: Zunimassa's
7- Name a 1h Weapon: Echoing Fury

This.
Edited by HATOTAH#2129 on 11/22/2012 7:25 PM PST
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am i the only one who thinks tc is basically asking for easy mode here... if you give even half of these fixes much less all of them.. complete noobs will be farming mp10... does that sound like changes you want in this game.... does it?

Yes, you are the only one who thinks that. It's becouse you either misread or misunderstand. there is no way any of these changes will make the game that much easier. In my opinion, it won't make the game easier at all; it will only effect your enjoyment from it.

btw though your ideas are nice.. but your numbers are overly exaggerated...

My post has been changed in accordance to the discussion. there is hardly any numbers in it now, and i can't see how you could object to the ones there.

and some ideas i jsut dont agree with... like combining gold find and magic find.

Gold find is usless, and magic find lost it's charm after the addition of paragon levels and MP. Combining them is what you call "killing two birds with one stone". Plus, that is only part of the solution I offered.

If you have better ideas to combat this issue please share, I would like your opinion.
Edited by HATOTAH#2129 on 11/22/2012 7:50 PM PST
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-1

The OP does not have a good grasp on the mechanics of Diablo 3 which is why he posted what he did. All the information needed to understand those mechanics is available on the web which leads me to the conclusion, OP is just lazy. Have fun with your auto pilot WW barb.

To all the people who +1, really? OP basically posts "I have no clue what I am talking about" and you respond +1. Good to know.

Let's just educate the OP a fraction...

OP calls Chill/Feeze on hit useless since we already have immobilize and slow on hit. Chill reduces all animations. Slow only reduces movement. Immobilize only stops movement. Frozen stops everything. They are completely different effects. Further, many skills do extra damage to specific or a set of specific effects that monsters are under. Try playing co-op with a barb using a chill on hit weapon and a wizard using the cold blooded passive. Also say you trying to determine if your wizard is going to buy a +immobilize on hit item for 500k or a +frozen on hit item for 5m...that depends...if you're ranged go for the 500k item, if your melee go for the 5m. There are many factors to consider when dealing with these affixes, it just takes some ability to search the web and read about them...or just call them "completely useless" +1.

Sigh.
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So, Nivik, let me get this straight: you had a problem with one of my suggestions so you decided to completely ignore all the other ones? in a thread where I specified that, no, I don't have all the answers and this is why I openes this discussion. this is the equivalent of bashing me over the head with a brick becouse I farted... relax.
On another note, now that I'm more informed I can see that you are right. I will delete that suggestion. With the suggestion to buff "chance on hit" stats I offered this is adressed anyway.
Now that that is out of the way, have you any other thoughts on the matter?
Edited by HATOTAH#2129 on 11/22/2012 8:20 PM PST
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So, Nivik, let me get this straight: you had a problem with one of my suggestions so you decided to completely ignore all the other ones? in a thread where I specified that, no, I don't have all the answers and this is why I openes this discussion. this is the equivalent of bashing me over the head with a brick becouse I farted... relax.
On another note, now that I'm more informed I can see that you are right. I will delete that suggestion. With the suggestion to buff "chance on hit" stats I offered this is adressed anyway.
Now that that is out of the way, have you any other thought on the matter?


No, your statement on freeze on hit is indicative of many other aspects (but not all) of your OP. Am I going to waste my entire night pointing everything out to you instead of actually playing diablo 3? No. Some affixes are under powered, such as life on kill, that is true (and Blizzard is currently working on buffing that one). But calling some things just "completely useless" does absolutely nothing to remedy the situation. Take the durability affix for example, your idea is to use it as a garnish...awesome...here's mine:

http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/7004697229

The part about ignores durability loss is in my 4th post in that thread.

Go play with a 15% http://us.battle.net/d3/en/item/azurewrath for awhile and then tell me it would be a good idea to put up to double that amount on a 1h 1k DPS 250 stat 95 cd socketed item. Many of your ideas are asking for god mode.
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But calling some things just "completely useless" does absolutely nothing to remedy the situation.

I'm not just calling them useless, I'm offering ideas on how to improve them, and in the cases where I do call them useless and suggest to remove them from rare stat rolls it's because I feel like they go against an important game mechanic.
Your suggestion to make Indestructible an attractive stat by introducing a new mechanic into the game, allowing you to basicly gamble on item stats may work (although, with how Blizzard has handled crafting I have my doubts), but if Blizzard considers the idea and goes against it, do you think items should still roll with this stat?

Go play with a 15% http://us.battle.net/d3/en/item/azurewrath for awhile and then tell me it would be a good idea to put up to double that amount on a 1h 1k DPS 250 stat 95 cd socketed item. Many of your ideas are asking for god mode.

Do you really believe that "chance on hit" stats on rares is in a good place right now? They roll a max of 5, and on top of that there is a big range to it. Legendaries are an exception, as they can roll with stats that could never be on rares. I wasn't talking about them at all.
Edited by HATOTAH#2129 on 11/22/2012 9:05 PM PST
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11/22/2012 08:55 PMPosted by HATOTAH
if Blizzard considers the idea and goes against it, do you think items should still roll with this stat?


Yes, but they should find another method to improve it's desireability. Not all affixes are or have to be the greatest in the world but they should retain some attraction. Ignores Durability Loss, with the current cost of repairs, has close to zero attraction for the player base. It needs to be addressed somehow, and I highly doubt it will be addressed in the manner that I described in my link, but I do not think it should be outright removed.

If they do absolutely nothing with it beyond it current implementation...oh well. A lost opportunity imo. I understand that there needs to be trash affixes in order to maintain the loot distribution but there's trash and then there's Ignores Durability Loss. Even if you get a +str roll on what would have been a perfect Wizard item...at least that gives you a sliver of armor.

11/22/2012 08:55 PMPosted by HATOTAH
Do you really believe that "chance on hit" stats on rares is in a good place right now?


For the most part yes, I do. What I think you are failing to take into account is the aggregate effect that the cc affixes can have. If you could only have a cc effect on your weapon for example, then I would agree that a max roll of 5% is a bit low. But you can have cc effects on most (if not all) of your 13 gear peices. You add up all those effects (even though they are not the same effects) coupled with the new implemenation of cc in 1.0.5 and I start to feel bad for the demons. I feel that cc is in a good place in 1.0.5 and if anything it is a bit overpowered but not so much that it requires a nerf.
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Oh and an easy way to make Ignores Durability Loss desireable is to crank up repair costs...but we all know how that turned out -> Waaaaaahhhh!!!
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Agreed, either buff the useless stats and/or add a bunch more to make things more diverse.

As the game stands right now, it revolves around All Resist, Crit Damage, and Crit chance. Remove those 3 and pretty much every player is destroyed unless they are happy running around nightmare.
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Agree except pickup radius, fine as it is, cc reduction, should be removed, and mf/gf.. just remove the paragon. Similar thread there http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/7004456699?page=1#3
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hmm i wonder

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OpAiBFq2U2k
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Indestructible - Completely useless and counters the idea of a gold sink in game. Should only be on some legendary items as garnish.


It maybe useful if the rumor of the new crafting system in the next patch which there is a chance to break the item.
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singel resist roll up to 200?~!?!?!?

Are you Crazy ?!?!?!!? do you know that monks have "One with everything" passive??
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