Diablo® III

Manajuma Knife vs Black Dam Weapon

Ah, no wonder my Zuni Boots and SOJ still add some damage when I use Manajuma. I used to think CK is all "poison" damage.

This "elemental" damage on weapon makes zero sense for WD. WD is the only class that does not use "weapon damage" in runes. All of our runes change all the weapon damage to the specific damage type.

I really think they messed up somehow and refuse to fix it. They said "Add 8% Poison damage" on Zuni Boots is "poorly" worded when in reality, that property should be "Increasing" poison damage on our Class Specific item. I mean what's the chance of our Class set boots adding "Poison" damage and our Class set Knife has "Poison" damage and yet the synergy is really not there?

All Elemental damage really does nothing except for Cold.

Manajuma having "Poison" instead of Black damage just makes no sense as we don't rely on its "Poison" damage. We have to choose Poison damage runes to trigger Bad Medicine.
Edited by Jibikao#1131 on 11/29/2012 12:08 PM PST
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The Real question should be,

Why does +5% poison damage, only effect black damage?

It should simply add 5% damage, regardless of if you have elemental or not.

IE 5% should give the same DPS if you use 1 black 1 poison weapon providing they both have the same DPS. Of course that doesnt happen.

What i am more confused about now, is why the heck the +50% modifier on weapons, only effects black damage. Thats just crazy.
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If you have the money and patience then definitely go with a black weapon. If you're like most others then manajuma's is a solid choice. I've been looking to upgrade mine and since I've yet to see a perfectly rolled rare the damage gain is ~6k at most but generally much lower, with a price tag of 700+ mil. Certainly there are many other areas I can upgrade with a greater overall gain. Plus the knife looks really cool and one day I'd love to pickup a godly fetch to complete the set so I can hold a dead chicken.
Edited by Mouchi#1474 on 11/29/2012 12:42 PM PST
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Happy with my mace, been looking at some better spears. No problem critting over a mil even 1.5m - 1.8 (I've seen upwards of 2.5m when playing around with pile on and ubers! lol) but I do have a very wide range so it's not going to be as often like my skorn although the bonus vs elites on my mojo does make up for a good chunk of damage and that is when it counts, and I'm also critting 10% more often. I get an additional 18k vs elites just from the mojo's bonus when buffed. Which really helps make up for the lack of raw damage between my mace + mojo combo vs my skorn.

The nice thing about MC is you get OS/INT/LS/CD.. The CD bonus is huge as I can crit the same with my knife as I can with my mace since it has 90+ CD vs 220 int & a higher damage rate.

in the end it's going to have to just depend on what's available and what you can afford.. Black Damage is nice perk..but you still get some % even on a MC and you don't find your self a slave to high dollar tal rashas w/an MC those high CD rare amulets start looking better (and are a lot cheaper).
Edited by Brahm#1943 on 11/29/2012 1:01 PM PST
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I got rid of my Manajuma for some pizza rolls
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GL finding it indeed...

Just search for a weapon that has 70+ base crit, 2.7+ LS, socket 1 handed CKs... I only have like 2 rares that pop up... both of which do not have black dmg... and both of which are priced higher than the Mana's that are the same but have the +199 int roll.

Theoretically you can have a better weapon... but IF they ever pop up they will be in the billions... not worth it.
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GL finding it indeed...

Just search for a weapon that has 70+ base crit, 2.7+ LS, socket 1 handed CKs... I only have like 2 rares that pop up... both of which do not have black dmg... and both of which are priced higher than the Mana's that are the same but have the +199 int roll.

Theoretically you can have a better weapon... but IF they ever pop up they will be in the billions... not worth it.


Yes and don't look for next 24 hours I'm not bidding on anything. lol.
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Happy with my mace, been looking at some better spears. No problem critting over a mil even 1.5m - 1.8 (I've seen upwards of 2.5m when playing around with pile on and ubers! lol) but I do have a very wide range so it's not going to be as often like my skorn although the bonus vs elites on my mojo does make up for a good chunk of damage and that is when it counts, and I'm also critting 10% more often. I get an additional 18k vs elites just from the mojo's bonus when buffed. Which really helps make up for the lack of raw damage between my mace + mojo combo vs my skorn.

The nice thing about MC is you get OS/INT/LS/CD.. The CD bonus is huge as I can crit the same with my knife as I can with my mace since it has 90+ CD vs 220 int & a higher damage rate.

in the end it's going to have to just depend on what's available and what you can afford.. Black Damage is nice perk..but you still get some % even on a MC and you don't find your self a slave to high dollar tal rashas w/an MC those high CD rare amulets start looking better (and are a lot cheaper).


Was your amulet was cheaper than a tals? ._. I tried to look up similar ones and very few came up, the only few that did were bordering 1 bil+ and they were not as good. I guess you're mainly referring to really high end tals (9-10 cc). Really nice buy.
Edited by RPRNoNsum#1561 on 11/29/2012 3:00 PM PST
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The Real question should be,

Why does +5% poison damage, only effect black damage?

It should simply add 5% damage, regardless of if you have elemental or not.

IE 5% should give the same DPS if you use 1 black 1 poison weapon providing they both have the same DPS. Of course that doesnt happen.

What i am more confused about now, is why the heck the +50% modifier on weapons, only effects black damage. Thats just crazy.


Yup yup!

There is really no point in having "elemental" damage especially for WD who has ZERO runes that use "weapon damage".
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There is really no point in having "elemental" damage especially for WD who has ZERO runes that use "weapon damage".


All of our abilities use Weapon damage to calculate their damage.

My understanding is elemental damage on weapons used to do something special but then they changed it because they didnt want everyone focused on elemental damage.

In reality all they did was make us focus on black damage.

Personally i think they have overlooked something that is causing +%poison/holy etc and +%damage not to effect elemental damage, and are simply to lazy to fix it.
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Was your amulet was cheaper than a tals? ._. I tried to look up similar ones and very few came up, the only few that did were bordering 1 bil+ and they were not as good. I guess you're mainly referring to really high end tals (9-10 cc). Really nice buy.


I got mine for a 100m. All the equivalent tal rashas (damage wise) were 300-500m and had much less cc, and int... >_<
Edited by Brahm#1943 on 11/29/2012 8:51 PM PST
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If your using Swarm or of the type, 2 hander is really nice. But that's a whole new calculation, but simple.
Edited by battletag#11838 on 11/29/2012 11:41 PM PST
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I have posted this in several topics and here I tell again, what is really really bad about manajuma's is that it has really low minimum dmg and it is too fast which is bad for us as many of you agree.

1. On paper similar dps manajuma will give you tons of dps since we have lot's of +dmg from items. But it is paper dps which doesn't matter.

2.Probably with a good manajuma your max crits is going to be around the same but the thing is you will see a lot of low crits as well. The black dmg weapons have 1.5-2x more minimum dmg so you won't see any low crits on them.

My weapon has 705-1117 dmg with 1.2 speed (bought it for 350m on EU server 1.5 months ago). Next upgrade for this would be almost same minimum dmg with 13xx max dmg with int and CHD on it but ofc it would cost more than 2billion. And it wouldn't be so much necessary.

Back to topic, With self buffs I have seen 1.8-19m crits without VtP, with a monk in party i've seen 2.6-2.7m. Lately I have bought new items and didn't had time to test it with a monk so maybe I would do more than 2.7m with monk in party.

Profile: http://eu.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Hasansabbah-2914/hero/1582160
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Problem for me is manajs cant roll socket and mana regen. So even though my weapon doesn't have crit damage/INT i'd rather have the mana regen.
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Ty so much for this discussion. It's becoming increasingly more difficult for me to find upgrades and never knew about the differences and what black damage means. I keep an Mara knife and TOTD for RD elites and bosses but hated how I lose 75k dps. I can now get serious about going main and offhand and what to look for. Ty. :)
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Ok I just upgraded to a black weapon. I used to have a weap with 60% damage from holy. Now 100% black. My mojo did about 30% of my weapon damage. I run a 5% stone of jordan and 8% zunnies.

The increase was 8k from black damage (3k from stone and 5 from zunies) and about 1.5k from other sources. up from 119k to 128k.

The weapon gave me +100 vit which my char really needed, but cost me -4 mana regen.

Depending on when my profile updates you can see it equiped.

P.S. At 26mil i think it was a pretty good buy.
Edited by blackjack#1375 on 12/1/2012 1:16 PM PST
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Ok I just upgraded to a black weapon. I used to have a weap with 60% damage from holy. Now 100% black. My mojo did about 30% of my weapon damage. I run a 5% stone of jordan and 8% zunnies.

The increase was 8k from black damage (3k from stone and 5 from zunies) and about 1.5k from other sources. up from 119k to 128k.

The weapon gave me +100 vit which my char really needed, but cost me -4 mana regen.

Depending on when my profile updates you can see it equiped.

P.S. At 26mil i think it was a pretty good buy.


Interesting to see "black damage" does give quite a bit of damage boost.

Your dagger has very nice damage but it doesn't have LS. It's got excellent CD and Mana Regen. I wish Craving Knife comes with mana regen to make up the lack of "black" damage.
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My knife also lacks int, It is certianly not as good generally, but carving knife at 1k with 99% CD and socket would go for hundreds of millions and my build really needs the mana regen as I spam acid cloud.
Edited by blackjack#1375 on 12/2/2012 1:35 AM PST
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acid cloud with acid rain rune does not need spamming tho..

corpse bomb is tempting to be spammed.. imho, more mana than mana regen is better here... you burn it faster than you can regenerate..
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Boss. going off topic a bit, but spaming acid cloud because it does more damage than toads and loh better than toads, it really does work...

Now spaming corpse bomb, i just tried it, magnificent damage, but no LOH, might consider it if i had life return on damage thoughl..
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