Diablo® III

*S&B Barb Q&A Thread*

@powpowboom71 you're welcome by the way.. :) I believe I persuaded you into HOTA.. :) Best SnB build IMO. I have tried them all.
@EddardStark I concur with you good sir = )

@AZsnowstorm … wow just wow @ your 2.7 mil SS =D

@powpow
Okay whatever works = )
Have fun with your Wii if we don’t see you on tonight
Ohh and I don’t know why profile is not updating with the new shield and ring and build yet but I did try HotA last night and omg I’m seeing close to 800K crit hit? O_O that’s massive dmg! (for me at least)
I just replace with the same button as WotB right now so it’s not as smooth play style… I think right click will work better

@Kalesh
I agree with powpow.. I think your current shield work best for you right now
As for me I chose to load up vit on chest, pants and boots which give me a bit of a wiggle room on my shield
Still losing the 12%life on my new shield is sad … =( … hopefully the higher strength, block rate and dmg reduction will make up for it
12/04/2012 01:10 PMPosted by Crypter
@powpowboom71 you're welcome by the way.. :) I believe I persuaded you into HOTA.. :) Best SnB build IMO. I have tried them all.


LOL...well, in all truth, i was using variations of HoTA builds since 1.0.4 was released. I even wrote this in August about the HotA variation I was using at the time:

http://diablo.incgamers.com/forums/showthread.php?838844-My-New-Build-Hammer-of-the-Ancients-and-Bash-DESTRUCTION-)

But what you did do, is remind me of how awesome HoTA is...and how OP the 1.0.5 buff is (i.e., +1 crit for every 5 fury you have). I strayed away with a bulldozer build variant, but after seeing the success you were having at mp10, i moved back to it. HoTA now is the best build for barb....dare I say, even better than WW.

So for that, I thank you ;)

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WTB 1400 dps rune sword with Str and socket
WTB 250 str Ice climbers with vit and MS
Edited by powpowboom71#1665 on 12/4/2012 1:49 PM PST
@powpowboom71 you're welcome by the way.. :) I believe I persuaded you into HOTA.. :) Best SnB build IMO. I have tried them all.


LOL...well, in all truth, i was using variations of HoTA builds since 1.0.4 was released. I even wrote this in August about the HotA variation I was using at the time:

http://diablo.incgamers.com/forums/showthread.php?838844-My-New-Build-Hammer-of-the-Ancients-and-Bash-DESTRUCTION-)

But what you did do, is remind me of how awesome HoTA is...and how OP the 1.0.5 buff is (i.e., +1 crit for every 5 fury you have). I strayed away with a bulldozer build variant, but after seeing the success you were having at mp10, i moved back to it. HoTA now is the best build for barb....dare I say, even better than WW.

So for that, I thank you ;)

------------------------------
WTB 1400 dps rune sword with Str and socket
WTB 250 str Ice climbers with vit and MS


HOTA is only good if you can stand still and survive (the whole point of SnB).

WW is still better if you base survivability is not up to par with standing still and surviving.

Also, revenge is worst skill for SnB and rend is worst skill for WW.

Reason being that revenge is worse the further you are above 1 aps. This coupled with the fact that CC has diminishing returns after 50% and that SnB has highest CC (77% perma-buffed without WoTB, Revenge - Best Served Cold, or Overpower - Killing Spree) Revenge - Best Served Cold being the best rune for Revenge along with requiring high APS to hit high DPS all collude to making it bad for SnB. Also making it worse is the fact that SnB loses 100-200 crit dmg over a 2h or Dual wield build, making the diminishing returns happen faster after 50%.

Rend being worse for WW because 1. You have to stop, defeating most of the point of the lifesteal (WW/Hurricane's effect on mob AI when you have decent run speed cannot be underestimated) 2. Also gets worse the further above 1 aps you are, but since you are WW, you are stacking APS as a matter of course, making it utterly atrocious.
Edited by TehCommunism#1537 on 12/4/2012 2:18 PM PST
Thanks for your advice!

Using Bash/Punish to build up fury and boosting all skills then just hitting packs with Overpower (Crushing Advance is very useful in MP10)

For MP5-7, do you think Overpower:Killing Spree is a good choice? Additional 10% crit chance seems help on maintaining 100% crit chance of HoTA.

and then just unleashing crazy DMG with HOTA/SMASH. All of those attacks also get boosted DMG from Punish.

Oh just didn't notice Bash:Punish dmg boost! 8% x 3 =24% is a lot! Also, in order to maintain full fury to gain the 1% cc for 5 fury bonus of HoTA, I always hit with bash every few seconds

I have not even mentioned that BR/Into the Fray and WOTB/TOC are also in play here and provide Perma WOTB.

Yeah Perma WOTB with HOTA... really want to know who much crit dmg yellow figure you made

Key stats to focus on in your gear (IMO). Stack CD as much as possible without sacrificing too much EHP, don't want to become a glass cannon (although the SS goes along way in forgiving you on some gear, look at my Lacuni's they are all DPS). After that try and get more IAS, this will help Fury gen and keep WOTB up.

I stacked a lot CD but almost no additional IAS atm. Exactly as you said, I can feel my swing and fury gen are too slow :P

Without hitting the high DPS marks you will probably need to use Bloodthirst passive to bring you to 6% LS (assuming you got 3 on your belt).

To use Bloodthirst, have to give up Tough as Nails... not sure 6000 ish armor is sufficient?

S/B guild is a good idea!


HOTA is only good if you can stand still and survive (the whole point of SnB).

WW is still better if you base survivability is not up to par with standing still and surviving.



Ya, i can agree with this. So TehCommunism, if i was to ask which one is superior for high mp's, ubers and PVP (if it ever comes), what would you say? Would you say both are equal, but just different, or would the dps tank fair better in all? Its an interesting question

------------------------------
WTB 1400 dps rune sword with Str and socket
WTB 250 str Ice climbers with vit and MS
Edited by powpowboom71#1665 on 12/4/2012 2:23 PM PST


HOTA is only good if you can stand still and survive (the whole point of SnB).

WW is still better if you base survivability is not up to par with standing still and surviving.



Ya, i can agree with this. So TehCommunism, if i was to ask which one is superior for high mp's, ubers and PVP (if it ever comes), what would you say? Would you say both are equal, but just different, or would the dps tank fair better in all? Its an interesting question

------------------------------
WTB 1400 dps rune sword with Str and socket
WTB 250 str Ice climbers with vit and MS


For pvp SnB no question. The classes do almost all their damage from things that can be blocked. and the extra 80 all res and 7% less dmg from elites that the shield provides makes that block more effective as well.

the advantage SnB has over 2h in HOTA is the ability to keep WoTB up perma, both because they are inherently using faster weapons and also stacking more aps, as well as having purely 10 more cc.

Hota is best for ubers for barbarians, bar none.

I find WT/Hota to be a good stopgap for ubers if you cant perma-WotB with just hota with low aps (this is what I do, rocking my 1.09 aps or 1.13 aps with enchantress :P)

Ultimately the goal for every SnB barb should be a 6% cold SoJ with 30% elite dmg and -5 hota cost OR 7% WW crit (for which one you are focusing you barb on). This is because of the diminishing returns on cc over 50%, and the fact that SnB barbs with Axe/Mace can perma-WoTB just fine with the loss of the 6 cc from the soj.

2h will always be better for HOTA IF you can facetank. (thats a big if, as you need some pretty sick gear to facetanks 100% of the time outside WW with 2h on MP10)
SnB will always be better for HOTA IF you CAN facetank with shield, but CANNOT do so with 2h with you current equips.

Same thing applies to WW.
If you can WW-facetank (different than face-tanking. By WW-facetank I mean having 100% of the time the mob being in your WW radius and under the effect of your RLTW nados. Even a split second of this not happening would be considered not achieving WW-facetank ability) with duel wielding with your current gear AND sustain perma WotB with your aps+cc, then duel wielding is better.

If you cannot WW-facetank (see above) while duel-wielding but CAN do so while SnBing, then SnB is better for WW. If you cannot perma-WotB with you aps+CC with duelwield but CAN perma-wotb with your aps (less than duel wielding) + cc (10 more than duel wielding) while SnBing, they SnB is better.

P.S. Cookie for you if you read this whole thing :P. +1 for literacy :D.
Edited by TehCommunism#1537 on 12/4/2012 3:49 PM PST
Dude, S&B is the only way I stay alive in MP8+. By looking at your stats and skills I'd say we have relatively similar characteristics when one handing, except that I have a 32% block SS. And I only have 28k life, but 8.8% LS thanks to blood thirst passive. I also use blood funnel on my WW, which gives LS on crits. I mitigate the need for high Vit gear by having high LS. I do get one shotted by the really nasty guys rarely. In my ideal world I would have 7k armor, 45k life, and do 150k dps unbuffed, but like you, I cannot afford it. There are so many variations to any build, it just depends on what you feel like you can sacrifice. I sacrificed vitality.

***It also helps to have a good network of constant D3 friends to share drops with. I run pretty consistently with a group of 5-6 guys and we all play different characters. Thing is, if we find something awesome when farming, we rarely sell it if it will help someone in the group. The only time we sell things is if it will most likely bring in 50mil or more. I wish there were more people out there to support the community and not the AH... :-(

2h will always be better for HOTA IF you can facetank. (thats a big if, as you need some pretty sick gear to facetanks 100% of the time outside WW with 2h on MP10)
SnB will always be better for HOTA IF you CAN facetank with shield, but CANNOT do so with 2h with you current equips.


With two handed HotA, 99.9% of barb players will think Skorn. I've got a Grandfather which I found as well as a Skorn and I find that the skorn is the dps glass cannon two hander where as the grandfather is the 2h face tanker.

Stat wise, skorn eats any other two hander. Inherent crit damage then chuck in a socket and strength scores of 300 or more means massive damage but your then relying on your gear for ehp.
Grandfather has only one variable so you have to look for socket or crit damage (which can get over 100%) but you get 150 vitality and life %. On my barb life goes over 60k with grandfather.
My dps is higher with the grandfather, but thats simply because its a godly roll (1,540 dps, 110% crit damage) compared to my self found skorn but in general, grandfather will be lower in dps than a skorn, but your ehp is much higher and given how much damage HotA does anyway, I still land 1.5 million + crits with it, it's a pretty good beat stick if you want to 2H face tank. I've done it on mp9 uber runs.

On another note, what's up with diablo progress? I loaded my profile and it's out of date by over a month, 11 paragon levels ago?
Edited by Asmodeous#1189 on 12/4/2012 4:11 PM PST
Give some love for SnB :)
This thread is a good information for those who wanna take the SnB barb route.
SnB for LIFE!!
loving this thread, another SNB barb here looking to learn from you. really amazing to see many godly SNB that really set as example and guidance for me.

i do not have godly gears for now and took me hard to archive what i have now and i am happy with that. moving forward, i am seeking some advice from all as i m looking to slowly up the dps one step at the time. what i am thinking is;

- replace oculus ring with litany comes with both CC & CD;
- get a lacuni with str and CC;
- replace hellfire with rare ring with CC, CD, Str, life% and vit;

the objective is to stack ore CC and CD with maintaining life and AR. of course i am not able to do all above at one go since i don't have hundred million gold, but a piece of advise from you are welcome.....cheers mate
SnB here, please add me in game, i want to know how to get 100k dps with it, currently at 60k dps buffed
12/04/2012 06:07 PMPosted by FriendlyFade
SnB for LIFE!!


Wow. You have a godly hell fire ring! SnB for life.
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loving this thread, another SNB barb here looking to learn from you. really amazing to see many godly SNB that really set as example and guidance for me.

i do not have godly gears for now and took me hard to archive what i have now and i am happy with that. moving forward, i am seeking some advice from all as i m looking to slowly up the dps one step at the time. what i am thinking is;

- replace oculus ring with litany comes with both CC & CD;
- get a lacuni with str and CC;
- replace hellfire with rare ring with CC, CD, Str, life% and vit;

the objective is to stack ore CC and CD with maintaining life and AR. of course i am not able to do all above at one go since i don't have hundred million gold, but a piece of advise from you are welcome.....cheers mate


@ehong, - we have the same oculus ring stats but i recently upgraded. Whenever i upgrade DPS I make sure not to lose EHP and vice versa.

You can check my right ring which has given me more EHP than my oculus ring, however it gave me RAW 8.5K DPS on top of it.

i will be doing the same thing soon to my left ring as i will replace my litany with a rare trifecta, AR, STR, VIT/life% ring which will give me more DPS and not reducing my EHP.
loving this thread, another SNB barb here looking to learn from you. really amazing to see many godly SNB that really set as example and guidance for me.

i do not have godly gears for now and took me hard to archive what i have now and i am happy with that. moving forward, i am seeking some advice from all as i m looking to slowly up the dps one step at the time. what i am thinking is;

- replace oculus ring with litany comes with both CC & CD;
- get a lacuni with str and CC;
- replace hellfire with rare ring with CC, CD, Str, life% and vit;

the objective is to stack ore CC and CD with maintaining life and AR. of course i am not able to do all above at one go since i don't have hundred million gold, but a piece of advise from you are welcome.....cheers mate


@ehong, - we have the same oculus ring stats but i recently upgraded. Whenever i upgrade DPS I make sure not to lose EHP and vice versa.

You can check my right ring which has given me more EHP than my oculus ring, however it gave me RAW 8.5K DPS on top of it.

i will be doing the same thing soon to my left ring as i will replace my litany with a rare trifecta, AR, STR, VIT/life% ring which will give me more DPS and not reducing my EHP.


can you please stop upgrading! I don't need you to pass me on the godly thread! lol
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@ehong, - we have the same oculus ring stats but i recently upgraded. Whenever i upgrade DPS I make sure not to lose EHP and vice versa.

You can check my right ring which has given me more EHP than my oculus ring, however it gave me RAW 8.5K DPS on top of it.

i will be doing the same thing soon to my left ring as i will replace my litany with a rare trifecta, AR, STR, VIT/life% ring which will give me more DPS and not reducing my EHP.


can you please stop upgrading! I don't need you to pass me on the godly thread! lol


hahaha dont worry man it's not my goal at the moment! i am still lacking 24ms and paragon score that is why im not in Cel's thread lol.

EDIT* my goal is to pass Cherry;s score in pvp dummy, he's just 40k points away from me finally!
Edited by Nikeboy1984#6661 on 12/5/2012 7:38 AM PST
hahah you godly barbs are just duking it out for top spots aren;t you =P

@powpow … too bad the SS didn’t work out yesterday = ( … if it was like 28% I would’ve pick it up .. ohh well
The hunt continues .. maybe I can snatch a deal like AZsnowtorm ;) … doubt it .. but .. worth a try anyways since I’m trying to save up for it

Questions for all you barbs …. Should I make many small upgrades or save up for 1 big upgrade?
Right now here’s my priority
1. Storm shield of around 30% block and 8CC
2. An IK boot per VeePow suggestions .. the cheapest equivalent to mine is 15 mil buyout >_< why all so expensive? Lol
It’ll add the luxury of Move Speed and combine with the IK belt it adds 60AR
3. Gloves/Bracers? IK armour? I haven’t thought that far ahead yet lol

I just got a ring with +9% life and a slightly more vit armour so switching to a SS won’t be so bad with the loss in HP ... 1 mil less gold because of that though lol
My profile is not updated yet btw

So big upgrades or few small upgrades like how I’m doing right now?

@ crypter
Since you’re the HotA master can you tell me the proper way of playing it?
Right now I bash x 3 ->killing spree -> rend -> bash and Killing spree till full fury -> then just smash until fury is out
And how do you run with WotB on all the time? … I had to switch out WotB to try HotA
The proper way to do HOTA is to either use weapon throw as your fury generator with no escape passive or to get -5 HOTA cost cold SoJ and drop all fury generators. SnB users should be fine with fury generation with WC:ITF from the 10 higher cc.
12/05/2012 09:53 AMPosted by TehCommunism
SnB users should be fine with fury generation with WC:ITF from the 10 higher cc.


sorry what is ITF? I know I'm a noob = P
WC = war cry I presume
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