Diablo® III

Is D3 a good game?

He made a good game.

He didn't make a good Diablo game.


-st4cks http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/7321712207

Someone wrote this in another thread, and I believe it to be the most succinct and correct opinion I've ever read on the subject.

An analogy:

Jay Wilson was essentially handed a slightly rusty, slightly beaten up 1955 Corvette that he was supposed to restore to showroom quality (Diablo 2 LoD with YEARS of work put in on patches, fixes, and improvements).

Instead of hammering out some small dings while adding shine and polish to the great factory car already there, he decided to replace the bumpers and panels with custom models, strip the leather interior for his favorite mediocre fabric, gutted the dash board, threw out the floor mats, and added flame decals and a spoiler. Then he followed it up with a yellow-green with purple polka-dot paint job (Scrapped the skill and stat system, gave Diablo bewbs, updated the graphics but probably went overboard and now it's not dark enough. Also cut charms, runes, jewels, crafting sucks, there's no gold sink to help stabilize the economy).

For some reason, he decided to present the car as ready for the showroom with no wheels (no PvP, everyone moves rather slow), but promised everyone that attended the car show a month later via mail that the wheels are on the way - then had to text them and say, oops, wheels aren't on the way just yet (PvP blog/twitter thing).

--

And so there it sits in the showroom. It's pretty obvious that the car is a '55 Vette, but it's Jay Wilson's '55 Vette. All anyone wanted was that it look like a Chevy - the classic they all knew and loved, but with a shiny new paint job, no dings in the door, and some nice shiny new chrome on the wheels.

...dammit why doesn't this car have wheels?

This restored car is good. The engine works. You can drive it for days, and enjoy the ride. But it doesn't ride like you remember the 55 Chevy riding.

He made a good game...but not necessarily a good Diablo game.

Bear in mind that he had, what, roughly the same amount of time to develop D3 as D2 had a lifespan, and a SIGNIFICANTLY higher budget than Blizzard North had back then. Yet the end results is vastly inferior.
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D3 is worth $15 max. It's an OKAY game if you take out the word Diablo.

Not trusting Blizzard's products that are affiliated with the genre ARPG in further installments until I see vast results over a few months on release of any further installment.

Need more Rock N Roll Racing & Black Thorne
^this !@#$ was the crack of the 90s.
Edited by KradisZ#1651 on 12/6/2012 8:15 AM PST
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12/06/2012 08:12 AMPosted by KradisZ
D3 is worth $15 max. It's an OKAY game if you take out the word Diablo.

This. Summed up accurately.
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12/06/2012 08:11 AMPosted by BERSERKER
Bear in mind that he had, what, roughly the same amount of time to develop D3 as D2 had a lifespan, and a SIGNIFICANTLY higher budget than Blizzard North had back then. Yet the end results is vastly inferior.


Think about all of the things that Diablo 3 got right - graphics/gameplay fluidity/fast pace action.
These were all accomplished by throwing money at the situation.

The areas where Diablo 3 fell short - no pvp at launch and the flaws with the item system - were not able to be beaten by just throwing money at them.

The problems they face are issues with their design philosophy. Money just can't fix design flaws. (besides just paying "more better" people to help with design) That could lead to even more problems, however, and it might be one of the reasons we are seeing stalls with pvp now. They quite possibly have too many talking heads and no one with the gonads to pull the trigger.

The good news is that they have been headed in the right direction from the time it was released until now. Hopefully they can continue to do that.
Edited by Sedon#1127 on 12/6/2012 8:18 AM PST
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mediocre at best. I had hopes it will get better with the patches, but after half a year i gave up. The developement team is the same so it will not change for the better thats for sure.
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Think about all of the things that Diablo 3 got right - graphics/gameplay fluidity/fast pace action.
These were all accomplished by throwing money at the situation.

I'll agree on GRAPHICS and FLUIDITY only. GAME PLAY and FAST PACE is lacking compared to other games i've played
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12/06/2012 08:17 AMPosted by Sedon
The good news is that they have been headed in the right direction from the time it was released until now. Hopefully they can continue to do that.

This doesn't apply considering Blizzard has been off track since 2005 when they fired the whole North division.

Diablo 3 has been a farce for the past several development years and there is nothing Blizzard can do to fix the game - it is fundamentally flawed.

The only solution to bring the Diablo franchise back from the dead is for Blizzard to rehire key players from North, and bring out Diablo 4, the true successor to Diablo 2.
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First off...my Diablo 3 has wheels. Wheels are needed to run a car, otherwise, it's just a hunk of metal. I've put in at least 300 hours into the game. It has wheels. If anything, it doesn't have a passenger seat. PvP is NOT necessary, it's an extra. So right there, your claim that this is the most succinct and accurate explanation is entirely flawed.


You're confusing the quote from st4cks with my analogy. My analogy is neither succinct nor perfectly accurate (and if you knew what an analogy was, I wouldn't have to explain this). I could have just left the quote from st4cks here and I think his one liner would have sparked conversation.

Second, this person claims that Jay Wilson was handed a slightly rusty '55 Vette. I'm no kinda car expert, but I'd bet my life on the fact that most CLASSIC cars, like '55 Vettes, probably didn't undergo upgrades, patch jobs, or even get expansion packs like additional framework and add-ons, like Diablo 2 had (with Lord of Destruction). In fact...if a '55 Vette is going to be considered a truly antique classic, it needs to be pretty much untouched from when it was first released in 1955, thus this entire comparison is completely ridiculous.


Again, I don't need to defend my analogy; it's only supposed to be a close approximation, but I'm bored and have nothing better to do. Cars go through iterations. From year to year, the chevy impala looks a little bit different; and ideally, if the designers are good, a little bit better. Some years a model can be re-imagined and go through a pretty big overhaul of appearance and functionality (like the LoD expansion). So this part of the analogy actually does hold up.

Yes, Diablo 2 vanilla was a FAR CRY (no pun intended) better than Diablo 1, with better quests, more loot, more gear, NO movement grid, and a reliable skill system...however, Lord of Destruction made it what it is today, you CANNOT deny that. Certainly not by saying this...

Also cut charms, runes, jewels,


Go to this website and see exactly what LOD added to D2 Vanilla:
http://diablo.wikia.com/wiki/Diablo_II:_Lord_of_Destruction

You want to keep this analogy? It's like saying the '55 Vette on launch wouldn't have been half the car it was without some extra turbo upgrade the manufacturer released a year after the car's release. FAIL!!!


Again see my point about how cars go through iterative design from year to year. An '03 ford taurus should look a little more modern, and have a couple more functions than an '02, the '02 should have the same improvements over '01.

If the taurus was discontinued in '06, and you were tasked with re imagining it and coming out with a 2015 model, where would you start? The '01 model that doesn't have leather seats, power windows and doors, or air conditioning? OF COURSE NOT. You would start with the '06 model. The argument that "well vanilla D2 didn't have this HUR DUR" is the most lazy asinine thing I have read on the forums to date. We've learned since then. We've improved the ARPG model. The devs weren't starting from scratch - they were starting from the cumulative improvements made on D2 LoD since its inception.

Diablo 3's been out for around seven months, and while yes, it's very different from any version of Diablo 2, there are distinct reasons why Diablo 3 is the way it is. For a lot of people, the game is still hard even with the freedom to switch out and equip any skill at any time. So far, my Monk's almost beaten Inferno using ONLY self-found gear, so the need for the AH? Entirely an illusion.

People coming up with lame analogies like this expose themselves for how little they actually know about the reasoning behind Diablo 3's approach, and their failure to see anything good on the horizon (i.e., continuing to "suffer" through playing it, while looking really hip by running it down on the forums) shows how their impulsive feelings on this are entirely focused on nostalgia.

Really really sad, guys, come on...


Sorry, these feelings aren't impulsive. I've been playing the game and have been on the forums since release. And they aren't nostalgia focused.

Consider jewels. You can't name one reason that jewels weren't fun for players. And you can't name one reason that they couldn't have made the shipped version of this game.

You picking apart an analogy on the D3 forums like it's a phd dissertation or masters thesis is what's sad.
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First off...my Diablo 3 has wheels. Wheels are needed to run a car, otherwise, it's just a hunk of metal. I've put in at least 300 hours into the game. It has wheels. If anything, it doesn't have a passenger seat. PvP is NOT necessary, it's an extra. So right there, your claim that this is the most succinct and accurate explanation is entirely flawed.

You're confusing the quote from st4cks with my analogy. My analogy is neither succinct nor perfectly accurate (and if you knew what an analogy was, I wouldn't have to explain this). I could have just left the quote from st4cks here and I think his one liner would have sparked conversation.

Second, this person claims that Jay Wilson was handed a slightly rusty '55 Vette. I'm no kinda car expert, but I'd bet my life on the fact that most CLASSIC cars, like '55 Vettes, probably didn't undergo upgrades, patch jobs, or even get expansion packs like additional framework and add-ons, like Diablo 2 had (with Lord of Destruction). In fact...if a '55 Vette is going to be considered a truly antique classic, it needs to be pretty much untouched from when it was first released in 1955, thus this entire comparison is completely ridiculous.

Again, I don't need to defend my analogy; it's only supposed to be a close approximation, but I'm bored and have nothing better to do. Cars go through iterations. From year to year, the chevy impala looks a little bit different; and ideally, if the designers are good, a little bit better. Some years a model can be re-imagined and go through a pretty big overhaul of appearance and functionality (like the LoD expansion). So this part of the analogy actually does hold up.

Yes, Diablo 2 vanilla was a FAR CRY (no pun intended) better than Diablo 1, with better quests, more loot, more gear, NO movement grid, and a reliable skill system...however, Lord of Destruction made it what it is today, you CANNOT deny that. Certainly not by saying this...

Also cut charms, runes, jewels,

Go to this website and see exactly what LOD added to D2 Vanilla:
http://diablo.wikia.com/wiki/Diablo_II:_Lord_of_Destruction

You want to keep this analogy? It's like saying the '55 Vette on launch wouldn't have been half the car it was without some extra turbo upgrade the manufacturer released a year after the car's release. FAIL!!!

Again see my point about how cars go through iterative design from year to year. An '03 ford taurus should look a little more modern, and have a couple more functions than an '02, the '02 should have the same improvements over '01.

If the taurus was discontinued in '06, and you were tasked with re imagining it and coming out with a 2015 model, where would you start? The '01 model that doesn't have leather seats, power windows and doors, or air conditioning? OF COURSE NOT. You would start with the '06 model. The argument that "well vanilla D2 didn't have this HUR DUR" is the most lazy asinine thing I have read on the forums to date. We've learned since then. We've improved the ARPG model. The devs weren't starting from scratch - they were starting from the cumulative improvements made on D2 LoD since its inception.

Diablo 3's been out for around seven months, and while yes, it's very different from any version of Diablo 2, there are distinct reasons why Diablo 3 is the way it is. For a lot of people, the game is still hard even with the freedom to switch out and equip any skill at any time. So far, my Monk's almost beaten Inferno using ONLY self-found gear, so the need for the AH? Entirely an illusion.

People coming up with lame analogies like this expose themselves for how little they actually know about the reasoning behind Diablo 3's approach, and their failure to see anything good on the horizon (i.e., continuing to "suffer" through playing it, while looking really hip by running it down on the forums) shows how their impulsive feelings on this are entirely focused on nostalgia.

Really really sad, guys, come on...

Sorry, these feelings aren't impulsive. I've been playing the game and have been on the forums since release. And they aren't nostalgia focused.

Consider jewels. You can't name one reason that jewels weren't fun for players. And you can't name one reason that they couldn't have made the shipped version of this game.

You picking apart an analogy on the D3 forums like it's a phd dissertation or masters thesis is what's sad.


HOLY WALL OF TEXT BATMAN
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12/05/2012 09:28 PMPosted by Fireblade
I still fail to see why so many things that made 'diablo' 'diablo' were scrapped.


It is call marketing strategy to milk more money aka expansions.


well they got it wrong, because me and all my real life friends who play(ed) were so disgusted with the launch of this POS that there is no way they will get another dollar from me
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sure I have uninstalled this game so I cant enter game to delete characters, u know.

Going by the date on your profile, you last played on on December 3rd, which was 3-days ago, and you have multiple level-60 characters.

So basically you played the game for hundreds of hours over the past six-months, so it can't have been all that terrible. :)


Yes, this game brought me fun for a while. I played 400 hours because my friends were in game.
After level 60 (not paragon) i realized the trip was turning into a torment. I farmed everyday like working in company arduously, just for more gold to purchase better item then i could survive in A2, farmed with my friends and encourage each other: hey, buddy, I feel great weapon/armor is coming!. Can you believe my first green item came after playing this damn game for 200 hours? and it was a crap ring, almost equal to nothing. I continued playing for my friends didn't want to see me quit. I hoped Blizzard could improve this game, I hoped No.### patch could solve every problem, made this game fun. But you know, my friends were quitting. The game was still boring. I could not found fun thing to do in this game. Jay/Blizzard still want players to farm, purchase, farm, purchse......and what everyone can do in this game is farm, purchese, farm, purchase.....What do you guys play game for? fun? or farm? Sometimes I just log on to see my items in AH, then closed game windows. Now I get rid of it. I feel better.
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Blizz lot a ton of loyalty with this release. I made my money back for the game using rmah but I still won't buy the expansion. PoE is way more interesting and feels like a diablo game.
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12/06/2012 09:39 AMPosted by tameraine
HOLY WALL OF TEXT BATMAN


Its properly quoted and formatted...no walls of text. You're either bugged or trolling brother.

Long posts and back and forth discussion don't constitute a wall of text.
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12/06/2012 10:16 AMPosted by Burzghash
Yeah, because those Blizzard North guys have been making such awesome things since their departure. Clearly they were the brains of the operation.


they fired or quit ?
if fired, why?
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Diablo 3 isent a great game, this game is lost becuse of lies.

Random maps??? nop
Pvp?? ehh nop
Costumization?? rofl nop

graphics hahaha yeah right

Titan quest did all this and better many years ago and it dident take em 10 years lol

This is just a way to milk money and exploit a great game title and burn it to the ground

Epic legendary fail


http://eu.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Death-2981/

25000 elite kills, last login 5 Dec 2012, terribad game, uh OK... You guys are amazingly odd humans. Masochism runs rampant among many DIII 'fans' it seems.
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http://eu.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Death-2981/

25000 elite kills, last login 5 Dec 2012, terribad game, uh OK... You guys are amazingly odd humans. Masochism runs rampant among many DIII 'fans' it seems.


I think this game is terribad and I haven't played since July. In fact I deleted all my characters and uninstalled.

Just in case you thought everyone liked to just impotently complain while still playing a ton.
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http://eu.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Death-2981/

25000 elite kills, last login 5 Dec 2012, terribad game, uh OK... You guys are amazingly odd humans. Masochism runs rampant among many DIII 'fans' it seems.


I think this game is terribad and I haven't played since July. In fact I deleted all my characters and uninstalled.

Just in case you thought everyone liked to just impotently complain while still playing a ton.


If it is so bad that you deleted all your characters on your alt account, why are you still trolling? What is the purpose of your continued presence here?
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