Diablo® III

CM/WW wizard.. idea? new direction?

i realize i only have about 15 hours on my wiz, but i am a relatively smart person when it comes to learning specs quickly. i had to swap to wiz for my farm group (which is just me and a friend) as we wanted to farm mp10 and i had the budget to make a cmww build work.. here's my question to everyone.. my setup is as follows

basically the way i do it is i hold down mouse 1, then alternate my 1,2,3 (diamond, frost, nado) micro and have blast on my right mouse button and use that on CD.. this seems standard but i drop teleport as im quite good at dodging and getting out of bs, guess thats from old raiding games, and i use shock pulse > LL in its place. everything is pretty much instant even with 1 mob up due to shock pulse > LL constantly moving in between everything and generating extra crits/sns procs.

also frees up a passive slot as i'm getting more crits than a standard cm.ww who runs teleport, so i dont need evocation, currently have blur popped in there but i may test out arcane dynamo this weekend as that will help add 75% more dmg every time LL builds me up.. which could be quite nice on top of everything else.

we'll see i suppose. thoughts? ideas? criticism? has this been done already? is it successful? stupid? opinions please!

here are my stats in case you havent seen from other thread, this is what im working with.. also my orb has 14% more shock pulse dmg so that results in about 20k extra DMG towards shock pulse at my current dps level...
Edited by lameboi#1117 on 12/4/2012 11:41 PM PST
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so i tested dropping blur and grabbing arcane dynamo.. the 5 stack procs pretty quick especially in big packs, also you can cast other skills in between your LL and it still counts towards the procs.. obviously this results in quite a bit more dmg for your big hitters if you micro your dynamo correctly...

i haven't seen any posts on this yet so hopefully someone comments on this and does further testing than i am able to do tonight.. work early and probably can't play til the weekend as i'll have my son.

please critique and hopefully we can move CM/WW to even more dps together! (while maintaining the survivability obviously!)
edit- just tested a reflect pack on mp8 (phasebeasts too, with shielding) and they got shredded wiht this build.. was scared when i saw them cuz of shielding+reflect and i had just dropped blur.. but it didn't matter... froze them well and was able to take hits easily when they came! i think i may be on to something here so i'd like some of the more well known and longer played wizards to test this out!


Edited by lameboi#1117 on 12/4/2012 11:59 PM PST
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The power of the build is from using a bunch of cooldown spells that do not use an attack turn at an extremely fast pace through Critical Mass.

The only two spells on the bar that use an attack turn are frost nova and wicked wind. Explosive blast does not use a turn for massive damage output, and diamond skin doesn't use an attack turn for massive defense (and bonus damage through shards)

Living lightning uses an attack turn. Casting it will mean you get 1 less twister. This will do almost nothing for your build, and even if its a slightly advantage (its not) you are giving up an extremely precious skill slot.

Generally if you don't need teleport for whatever reason, that last spot should be used for a 'passive' bonus that doesn't require an attack turn, or meteor for an AP spending nuke (at 30 APoC).

These options are...

Meteor - Liquify or Molten Impact (30 APoC and high CC)
Slow Time - Time Warp or Stretch Time (APS or 20% Damage)
Magic Weapon - Blood Magic or Electrify (Lifesteal or huge AoE damage boost)
Hydra - Your choice (not my bag, but can be helpful)

Don't use Force Weapon, knockback sucks.
Dont use Star Pact, DPS/Proc isn't high enough to justify not just casting another twister
Dont use any sig spell cause they use attack turns in all forms/runes and are worse than a twister.
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appreciate your feedback shand! was hoping you would respond!

with the 75% from dynamo micro'd to our hardest hitter, do you think it's still not worth it seeing as there are no problems with ap/freeze?

want to test this on ghom, if you have time, can you? just for my own personal knowledge?

if it turns out to be a sig loss ill probably just go back to a passive as you suggest (the life leech being my favorite option as that was my biggest turn off to this build before realizing how well the LOH works.. i like life overkill :D)

also, i realize it takes a hit, but lets say im getting 1 LL out on every GCD (for lack of a better word) and im going LL > nado > LL > nado > LL > nado.. if my LL ticks for 2-3 per mob with my crit rating on top of nados..i don't see how that can be less dmg especially with dynamo up and using the 5 where available.. which is pretty much constant. so you're giving one of your skills 75% more dmg on top of the tooltip.. seems like a big boost to me. (on paper)
Edited by lameboi#1117 on 12/5/2012 12:06 AM PST
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you know what.. after thinking more about this in bed.. i think you really need to test this as i firmly believe this is a dps boost over the current cm/ww variant, and it's easier to maintain AP with the slow moving LL/nado combo. couple that with a nice shock pulse orb (12%+) and you're setting yourself up quite nicely to deal with the lesser dmg, (as is stated before, im getting 20k more paper dmg from my orb on shock pulse alone).

trying it with and without shock from the start my life has been much easier by incorporating shock pulse into my rotation. i will do some timed kills this weekend if you decide against it though.
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The LL procs CM so much less over the course of its lifetime than WW. By a large margin. It also deals less damage overall. This is ofc assuming a full 6 seconds. You are giving up a passive(evocation) to do it as well. So you are drastically reducing the cast rate of explosive blast.

I'll test it after work ofc, but off the top of my head the math isn't going to be even close DPS wise, and you'll definitely lose LoH return, freeze strength, and diamond skin uptime. All three things will mean many more deaths even if somehow the dps is a bit higher.
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appreciate it,if you dont get around to it by the weekend ill be on checking stuff out.. tbh i'd be testing it if the wife wasnt sleeping so close to my desk haha.. don't feel like micro-mashin' and smashin' this late at night (east coast)
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I tested it quite carefully, and the freezelock is not as good as standard SNS. I think the main reason is WW proc better than LL, and they share the attack turn, so instead of using WW, I just use the inferior LL in its turn. The frequency of mobs breaking my lock is very noticeable. WW due to its much longer duration can return more CM proc for you, and on top of that it doesn't travel and ticks very fast, so while I appreciate your idea very much, my opinion is this is not as good as standard SNS.
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thanks novice! i appreciate it. i will test standard again when i get time but if you and shandlar say so, it probably is RIP for LL :P time for magic weapon!
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Nah, SNS is just too good for anything to catch up. This build is usable, I can clear Mp 10 with it (moar deaths though). My guess is that it's more suitable for Wiz with AP problem (run out of AP too often). If you can sustain AP, just go with SNS I think. A fun build for lower Mp though, not bad :)
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Just for the record, I use this:


Prodigy gives you SO much AP back that you need to dump it into something, meteor is the best thing.

You can get a pretty good stutter lock going. Honesly I love this build but hate shocknadoshards.

I have the gear to get to 2.79 APS, 49.5% crit with 650 resist all and 4300 armor (not great I know), and to be honest, shocknadoshards just isn't doing it for me over my current build, with higher mitigation. I just hate twisters is all... They have never been "fun" to me.

With LL + evocation and cold snap you can get pretty decent crowd control, but yeah nowhere near WW/CM with godly attack speed, but since you don't need godly attack speed, you can wear some reasonably priced mitigation.

TBH the best part about LL is it is more entry level. WW doesn't work at all under about 2.5 attacks per second. People can claim it does, but they are deluded. LL +123 +meteor can work with 1.8 APS if you really need it to.

Oh and forget Dynamo. If you can use dynamo, you are not casting enough frost novas, end of story.
Edited by Shaggy#1317 on 12/5/2012 7:03 AM PST
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