Diablo® III

11 Options to fix Reflects Damage

12/12/2012 06:29 AMPosted by Vresiberba
This is something Blizzard says every time they realize that they made something "overpowered".

And I suppose this is something you can back up, yes?


Yea, go read forums posts over the past 6 months. It's full of it on various abilities.
12/12/2012 06:40 AMPosted by SamChowders

And I suppose this is something you can back up, yes?


Yea, go read forums posts over the past 6 months. It's full of it on various abilities.

That's a 'no' then. Gotcha.


Yea, go read forums posts over the past 6 months. It's full of it on various abilities.

That's a 'no' then. Gotcha.


I am not going back thru the forums for your benefit. Quit being lazy and do your own research if you want answers.
The choice of stacking pure DPS and melting the pack and yourself at the same time, getting enough resists to live through it, and getting enough LOH/LS to counter it completely are all different choices.


1.) You stacked greater dps than I did.
2.) I have a far greater EHP than you do.
3.) You have 0 Life on hit.
4.) you have 0 Life steal

You're an obvious hypocrite. A character with your stats can kill themselves against a reflect damage group in less than a second unless you pop gloom before every shot. It is a problem and you're just blatantly lying and trolling for a reaction. I recommend giving up since Your side of the argument lost because:

1.) Reflects damage is currently not working as intended. See the blue post for reference ;)
2.) The dangerous forms of reflects damage (the large minion groups) and health-linked are bugged. Everyone knows this; there is zero point in arguing that it doesn't desire fixing.
3.) Something that increases offence without losing any defense is an upgrade in any fun game.

You can argue with them if you like on their design intent but you can't argue that reflects damage is working as intended, because it is clearly not.


On your original thread I never flamed you and agreed it needed to be changed for DH's. Yea yea, they cant get the same levels of defense/sustain/lifegain/steal without completely crippling the philosophy of how DH's are intended to be played (high dps/mobility).

I said it shouldn't be a problem for Barbarians though and the RMAH barb built his barb somewhat odd (completely for PVP) going high dps/high ias non-lifesteal weapons. He's relying on his bloodthirst passive (who does that?). After testing this it's true for most cases as with 5.5% lifesteal there should be no issues with RD.

The blue post is definitely correct. A few days ago there was a mob in MP8 which had RD. I hit them 3 times and was down to 5K hp. That was 1 RD pack out of around 15, so Im not sure whats up. I can carry one person as deadweight in MP10 and RD is never an issue.

I think they should fix the bug with RD but scale it back for DH/WD/Monks/Wiz. Seems to be fine for barbs apart from the bug.
Edited by FeRMi#1453 on 12/12/2012 6:53 AM PST
12/12/2012 06:22 AMPosted by SamChowders
This is something Blizzard says every time they realize that they made something "overpowered".


Being overpowered and bugged are 2 different things. Notice that no one complained about reflect damage before 1.0.5??

Reflect damage was tolerable before 1.0.5. (I still hated it but I adapted and bought more life steal/mitigation before 1.0.5)

Since it is no longer working as intended, bugged, and clearly stands out from the rest of the game I became frustrated. I came to the forums. Once it gets fixed, you will see me and the many other people creating reflect damage threads disappear from the forums. I may occasionally pop in to complain about killing tens of thousands of elites without finding anything valuable. Its just a way to vent so don't feel alienated by it. Many people have complaints, its not a bad thing, it shows that we actually care. The extreme randomization in loot is a far greater problem that Blizzard feels is not a problem and working as intended.
12/10/2012 09:03 PMPosted by Lylirra
2) After seeing a number of posts from players about RD dealing what they felt to be TOO much damage (especially from minions), we did some additional testing and discovered that Rare minions with the affix were in fact doing more damage than intended. This is an issue we have scheduled to fix in an upcoming patch.


LOLOLOLOL How many times did you CM's comment on RD posts saying that it is working as intended completely undermining everyone who complained about it and NOW you admit THE ENTIRE COMMUNITY WAS RIGHT after telling us all off multiple times?!?!?!?!

WOW. #CMfail.

This community should be in uproar over this, as this is COMPLETELY RIDICULOUS.
12/12/2012 07:08 AMPosted by Monoxide27
2) After seeing a number of posts from players about RD dealing what they felt to be TOO much damage (especially from minions), we did some additional testing and discovered that Rare minions with the affix were in fact doing more damage than intended. This is an issue we have scheduled to fix in an upcoming patch.


LOLOLOLOL How many times did you CM's comment on RD posts saying that it is working as intended completely undermining everyone who complained about it and NOW you admit THE ENTIRE COMMUNITY WAS RIGHT after telling us all off multiple times?!?!?!?!

WOW. #CMfail.

This community should be in uproar over this, as this is COMPLETELY RIDICULOUS.


Read the US forums for a bit to get a feel if you haven't already followed by the EU forums. After that you get a rough idea that NA's forums are full of special kids.
Well I guess blizz won, I lowered my DPS by 20K and upped my armor by 300, went from 2.5 LS to 2.7, went to 1300LoH...I guess RD working as "intended huh"?

that's what happened when RD kept killing my monk on MP8+...btw thanks blizz, dodge = worthless against RD...never got a reply why?
12/12/2012 06:12 AMPosted by Chillaxin
The choice of stacking pure DPS and melting the pack and yourself at the same time, getting enough resists to live through it, and getting enough LOH/LS to counter it completely are all different choices.


1.) You stacked greater dps than I did.
2.) I have a far greater EHP than you do.
3.) You have 0 Life on hit.
4.) you have 0 Life steal

You're an obvious hypocrite. A character with your stats can kill themselves against a reflect damage group in less than a second unless you pop gloom before every shot. It is a problem and you're just blatantly lying and trolling for a reaction. I recommend giving up since Your side of the argument lost because:

1.) Reflects damage is currently not working as intended. See the blue post for reference ;)
2.) The dangerous forms of reflects damage (the large minion groups) and health-linked are bugged. Everyone knows this; there is zero point in arguing that it doesn't desire fixing.
3.) Something that increases offence without losing any defense is an upgrade in any fun game.

You can argue with them if you like on their design intent but you can't argue that reflects damage is working as intended, because it is clearly not.


Yeah, l did stack DPS even more than you did and it still isn't a problem for me. You know why? Because with gloom, sacrificing stats to deal with reflect is completely unnecessary which you clearly have missed since you're one of the players that went full retard, proceeded to cry that the game is too hard, and is now begging for a nerf until it's easy mode again.

Little piece of advice to you, Chillaxin. Go reroll a Barb.
Community Manager
LOLOLOLOL How many times did you CM's comment on RD posts saying that it is working as intended completely undermining everyone who complained about it and NOW you admit THE ENTIRE COMMUNITY WAS RIGHT after telling us all off multiple times?!?!?!?!

WOW. #CMfail.

This community should be in uproar over this, as this is COMPLETELY RIDICULOUS.


I'm not aware of us ever being that aggressive honestly. Though, it's certainly possible that we've said things like "we're not aware of any issues" or "we believe that the affix is in a good place at the moment" (though the latter was probably something we said pre-1.0.5, when the bug wasn't active).

If we were vehement at any point post-1.0.5, then we were wrong and made a mistake. We hope that the bug fix in tandem with the changes we have planned for the affix will improve your experience and hopefully make encounters with RD more manageable and/or enjoyable.
LOLOLOLOL How many times did you CM's comment on RD posts saying that it is working as intended completely undermining everyone who complained about it and NOW you admit THE ENTIRE COMMUNITY WAS RIGHT after telling us all off multiple times?!?!?!?!

WOW. #CMfail.

This community should be in uproar over this, as this is COMPLETELY RIDICULOUS.


I'm not aware of us ever being that aggressive honestly. Though, it's certainly possible that we've said things like "we're not aware of any issues" or "we believe that the affix is in a good place at the moment" (though the latter was probably something we said pre-1.0.5, when the bug wasn't active).

If we were vehement at any point post-1.0.5, then we were wrong and made a mistake. We hope that the bug fix in tandem with the changes we have planned for the affix will improve your experience and hopefully make encounters with RD more manageable and/or enjoyable.


how dare you make changes based on community feedback!!! I'm in an uproar over this!!!
The thing is, the problem with RD was reported by several players even in the PTR, it took more than a month after live to the team figure out that it was actually wrong, now they admited, wich is nice since most of the bad things in this game dont even get acknowledged (see trade scams, dupping, immortal wiz, etc), at least we are going somewhere.

Now, for this and other problens, that affect the in game expirence pretty hard, they take a lot of time to fix, i cant state for other players but, i get mad because it seens that blizzard dont really put the effort in for Diablo 3 that they put in other games, ive seen lots of hotfixes come out for wow hours after a patch has been apllied, and on D3 they wait a month before fixing gem dupes!

To the developing tean take so long to make a simple fix on a current issue (not even mentioning new content, oh god PvP) they are being extremelly inneficient, they can be working 24/7 and still simple things never get fixed in any timely manner, i find the irony amusing, the tean that develop a game about efficiency dont seen to be ablte to be efficient.
Community Manager
The thing is, the problem with RD was reported by several players even in the PTR, it took more than a month after live to the team figure out that it was actually wrong, now they admited, wich is nice since most of the bad things in this game dont even get acknowledged (see trade scams, dupping, immortal wiz, etc), at least we are going somewhere.

Now, for this and other problens, that affect the in game expirence pretty hard, they take a lot of time to fix, i cant state for other players but, i get mad because it seens that blizzard dont really put the effort in for Diablo 3 that they put in other games, ive seen lots of hotfixes come out for wow hours after a patch has been apllied, and on D3 they wait a month before fixing gem dupes!

To the developing tean take so long to make a simple fix on a current issue (not even mentioning new content, oh god PvP) they are being extremelly inneficient, they can be working 24/7 and still simple things never get fixed in any timely manner, i find the irony amusing, the tean that develop a game about efficiency dont seen to be ablte to be efficient.


That's pretty fair feedback. The PTR for 1.0.5 was the first that we hosted for the game, so there were admittedly things we failed at and/or could have done better (in terms of reaction time, efficiency, etc). From the community side of things, there are a number of things we want to do differently for whenever we host our next PTR that would/should help with the issue you pointed out.

Speaking overall, though, there are some general limitations in terms of how quickly we can turn around certain fixes, but we're constantly evaluating how we can improve our processes for identifying, testing, and verifying issues, as well as finding and implementing a solution for them. I don't think we'll ever be perfect at it, but we certainly think we should strive to do better. That's an outgoing motivation for most of the company, though, and one of the big reasons why we always welcome player feedback (even if we may not be in a position to act on it right at that moment).
out of your 11 options, I like:

1.) Allow dexterity a chance to dodge ticks of reflect damage. (was originally there then they took it out :( )

5.) Cap reflects damage to only come from 1 source or allow it to only be on 1 mob in the group at a time and not every mob in the group. (I think this is what usually gets me killed, if I just attack one monster I'm OK, but when I'm fighting a new mob of 4 of them I'm getting reflect dmg back from all 4 and it's killer)
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