Diablo® III

Anybody else gear with DPS:EHP ratio in mind?

That's true, but as you add more HP it is changing the EHP values of Armor, AR, etc.. that is why you don't just stack one stat mindlessly, but try to achieve balance
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Can't argue with that since the best monk IS a balanced monk. But if you experience moderate spike damage even with 600AR and 6000Armor the best way to combat that would be to increase the size of your health pool minimizing the "spikeyness" not sure if that is even a word. So as long as your mitigation is optimal the larger the health pool the better keeping in mind the balance with DPS output.
Edited by CaptainCarl#1923 on 12/12/2012 12:09 PM PST
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12/12/2012 12:08 PMPosted by CaptainCarl
Can't argue with that since the best monk IS a balanced monk. But if you experience moderate spike damage even with 600AR and 6000Armor the best way to combat that would be to increase the size of your health pool minimizing the "spikeyness" not sure if that is even a word. So as long as your mitigation is optimal the larger the health pool the better keeping in mind the balance with DPS output.


This would likely be because it would be easier to add the desired EHP required to handle the spike with vit as was pointed out to me in another thread, its just easier to stack vit at a certain point than it is to get the other stats.
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OK I'm an idiot, so if its as simple as a 1/10 AR/armor ratio, why not just get 100 AR/1000 Armor, then just stack vit?
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Definately. After a certain point you will have to sacrifice DPS and there is a certain threshold on how much DPS one is willing to sacrifice. Some may sacrifice gold/money to keep DPS, that's another story but for the sake of argument these are perfect stat items there is only so many properties on a given character.

13 spots and each spot can have 6 properties, some a bit more if they are Legendary or Set Item/Set Bonus. In essence you have 78 properties minus the given armor or dps of an item.

EDIT: Your not an idiot man, the reason why you will not just stack vit is because it will eat into your DPS output. I see profiles out there with 150K Health but do 7k DPS. Does that seem balanced? Can I get a hell no.

But on the flip side if I had unlimited resources I think one can achieve 700AR:7000Armor and 70K Life with 250K DPS unbuffed no passives either. Now that would be something!
Edited by CaptainCarl#1923 on 12/12/2012 12:26 PM PST
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I know I'm no idiot, my entire point was: as AR/Armor/HP grow in number, its most beneficial that they grow together in a 1/10/100 ratio. Therefore, if you have 800 AR, 5000 Armor and 35,000HP, you can look at those numbers knowing its best to sacrifice some AR in exchange for more HP, and a bit more armor, etc..
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I think we are arguing the same point but the interwebs got the best of us. I like your build man and I think when we break it down my last edit kinda summed up what we are both trying to achieve. My mistake I think I added cost into the equation.
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I'm a generally nice guy and try to be positive and helpful to others, as opposed to raging my epeen all over the "noobs" in the community. D3 is a wonderful game, and as we work together, its even better
Edited by Azakiah#1996 on 12/12/2012 12:37 PM PST
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I'm sorry guys, but all of you are doing it wrong i.e you gear up your char's on what Mp level do you want to play... If you want to farm for loots than go for a full dps set-up since mp0-1 is the most effiecient... If you want to run MP 10 than a well balance Monk is the best... Until pvp comes out a full dps set-up is the best atm...
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I always gear for a balanced monks, it cost more but the rewards is worth it IMO. The majority of your dps is gained by your weapons in the end. By gearing correctly in the rest of your slot, it's saves you a headache when you are just looking to up your dps.

Pickup radius is not accounted into your EHP rating but it's a HUGE factor when it comes to facetanking stuff in desecrator, molten and etc.

As far as effective stats, I know !@#$ about the mathematics. If i hit 650 resist and 4400 armor. Since we're always getting more dex and dex = more dmg = more armor. I focus on stacking vit heavily when I hit 4400 armor.
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I just stack as much ehp as I can then worry about the dps later. Yes my monk is a tank. For those of you who decide to go crit(like my barb) you need at least 1m ehp if you don't want to be a glass cannon and waste more time dying and kiting than killing. Once you get at least 1m ehp, then try to maximise your damage without sacrifying ehp so you don't drop below 1m. Make sure most or all your items have primary+vitality+resist and +armor is a bonus. You will want at least 60-80k life pool, 600-800 resist and 6000-8000 armor. The 60/600/6000 rule.
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Maximus, amscray, was just having a hug it out moment on the forums. haha

But yes you are right but I'm not sure about the PVP part I think having max atk speed and DPS will win many wars. My speculation stems from D3 in which the best PVPers always had fast cast or incrased atk speed. Since it was a one shot type of PVP whoever hit first won. Hopefully D3 PVP doesn't turn out that way but who knows. Well I guess Blizz would.
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12/12/2012 12:38 PMPosted by maximus
I'm sorry guys, but all of you are doing it wrong i.e you gear up your char's on what Mp level do you want to play... If you want to farm for loots than go for a full dps set-up since mp0-1 is the most effiecient... If you want to run MP 10 than a well balance Monk is the best... Until pvp comes out a full dps set-up is the best atm...


I can understand that. In my mp1 farming gear, I just swap my weapon to a no lifesteal one which brings me to 201k unbuffed. I swap out my bracers for one with pickup radius. I can roll alk runs in 7-8 mins in mp1, but as soon as I ramp it up to mp2-3, I 1 shot myself to a reflect pack..

Since I geared the rest of my toon correctly. Simply swapping my 2 pieces drops me to 190k dps but I can farm mp10 ubers without a issue.

I could give a care less if you're doing 100-200k in mp1. When it comes down to it (hypothetically speaking), you can't even hang with me in mp3-4 when I want to a change of pace. You'll forever be stuck in mp1 and forced to spend the money to regear anyways down the line.

Do it right and do it right the first time.
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Ok, obviously adding all 3 will increase your EHP.

My point with the whole thing is that you want to stay near the 10:100 AR/armor ratio which will maximize the effectiveness of your life pool.

when you are at 600 AR, 6000 armor adding 80 all res (although easier) will be less efficient than adding 40 AR and 400 armor. adding only one and not the other at that point will definitely increase your EHP, but will do so with diminishing returns.

adding to your life pool on the other hand you will not experience those diminishing returns since it LINEARLY increases your EHP.

this is why staying to a 1:10:100 ratio isnt needed for efficiency - just the 1:10 ratio is needed.

all res and armor depend on each other, health pool is independent.

doesnt matter what the AR/armor combination is, doubling yourhealth pool will double your EHP.
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12/12/2012 12:42 PMPosted by Ace
I just stack as much ehp as I can then worry about the dps later. Yes my monk is a tank. For those of you who decide to go crit(like my barb) you need at least 1m ehp if you don't want to be a glass cannon and waste more time dying and kiting than killing. Once you get at least 1m ehp, then try to maximise your damage without sacrifying ehp so you don't drop below 1m. Make sure most or all your items have primary+vitality+resist and +armor is a bonus. You will want at least 60-80k life pool, 600-800 resist and 6000-8000 armor. The 60/600/6000 rule.


I disagree as a monk we utilize LS. By aiming for such a health pool, you're severely gimping your dps output. LS scales with damage and speed.

Example, the ghetto set I'm wearing has 5.0 lifesteal. Can't farm mp10 since it hits so slow. With a addition of a echoing fury +(4k dps)+ only 3.0 lifesteal, it's able to facetank mp10 elites..
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12/12/2012 12:42 PMPosted by Ace
I just stack as much ehp as I can then worry about the dps later. Yes my monk is a tank. For those of you who decide to go crit(like my barb) you need at least 1m ehp if you don't want to be a glass cannon and waste more time dying and kiting than killing. Once you get at least 1m ehp, then try to maximise your damage without sacrifying ehp so you don't drop below 1m. Make sure most or all your items have primary+vitality+resist and +armor is a bonus. You will want at least 60-80k life pool, 600-800 resist and 6000-8000 armor. The 60/600/6000 rule.


No way Jose.
that's not true at all when it comes to monk.
The required At-Least EHP, is only 350,000.
The balanced EHP is 500,000.
Lifesteal and DPS does the rest.
You don't need 60k-80k lifepool, wtf. The goal is 35k-45k HP.
550 res / 5500 armor / 125k dps / 40k HP, and you are nearly invincible.
1mil EHP is redundant, and is only 'end-game' goal for excessive luxury.

You are still in the face-tank mentality, which is only the first level of the 7 realms of monkdom.
Edited by LordRaahl#1733 on 12/12/2012 1:06 PM PST
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12/12/2012 12:51 PMPosted by LordRaahl
I just stack as much ehp as I can then worry about the dps later. Yes my monk is a tank. For those of you who decide to go crit(like my barb) you need at least 1m ehp if you don't want to be a glass cannon and waste more time dying and kiting than killing. Once you get at least 1m ehp, then try to maximise your damage without sacrifying ehp so you don't drop below 1m. Make sure most or all your items have primary+vitality+resist and +armor is a bonus. You will want at least 60-80k life pool, 600-800 resist and 6000-8000 armor. The 60/600/6000 rule.


No way Jose.
that's not true at all when it comes to monk.
The required At-Least EHP, is only 375,000.
Lifesteal and DPS does the rest.
You don't need 60k lifepool, wtf. The goal is 35k-45k HP.
550 res / 5500 armor / 125k dps / 40k HP, and you are already invincible.
1mil EHP is redundant, and is only 'end-game' goal for excessive luxury.

You are still in the face-tank mentality, which is only the first level of the 7 realms of monkdom.


yeah what he said. lol
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12/12/2012 12:48 PMPosted by scrapz
Do it right and do it right the first time.


I made this mistakes pre 1.06, in anticipation that increasing MP level increase your rewards as Blizz put it, cough, cough... Guess what? no one farms in mp 10, to put it quite frankly, you got to be a noob to be farming in MP 10... This is more for an e-peen status and yes, i can run MP10 with my other gears in my stash but why would i? since MP0-1 is the most efficient... Why upgrade your gears now when its going to be worthless in a couple of months times... Shouldn't it be more wise if you save your golds and upgrade your gears when the time arrives such as PvP..
Edited by maximus#1400 on 12/12/2012 1:04 PM PST
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Do it right and do it right the first time.


I made this mistakes pre 1.06, in anticipation that increasing MP level increase your rewards as Blizz put it, cough, cough... Guess what? no one farms in mp 10, to put it quite frankly, you got to be a noob to be farming in MP 10... This is more for an e-peen status and yes, i can run MP10 with my other gears in my stash but why would i? since MP0-1 is the most efficient... Why upgrade your gears now when its going to be worthless in a couple of months times...


I can farm mp3-5 almost as effectively as most people can farm 0-1. Some people like grinding mp1. Some people like grinding higher mp levels. It's all preference.

Most new players LOVE grinding out ubers. What happens when they step up against once in mp3-4 /w a glass cannon. They die then wonder why the hell they built their toon that way.

The way of glass cannon is long gone after the release of 1.05. With the way PvP will work(no idea when it's coming out) and it's dps matching system. Guess who will be winning those fights?

Chasing high DPS leads to wasting a ton of money. The majority of us don't have the patience to save. The generation = give me and give me now. By going glass cannon, they will continue spending their money to up their dps. It's better for them to have a good base to build their character and progress it the correct way.
Edited by scrapz#1142 on 12/12/2012 1:23 PM PST
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12/12/2012 12:25 PMPosted by Azakiah
I know I'm no idiot, my entire point was: as AR/Armor/HP grow in number, its most beneficial that they grow together in a 1/10/100 ratio. Therefore, if you have 800 AR, 5000 Armor and 35,000HP, you can look at those numbers knowing its best to sacrifice some AR in exchange for more HP, and a bit more armor, etc..

The problem is that you're adding Vitality to the 'Golden Ratio' of 1/10 and it simply doesn't belong there.

Look at it this way. If you start with 50k health, 5k armor and 500 resist (your golden ratio) you have 478,152 EH.

If you were to add just 1000 armor, you'd gain 58,669 EH. If you were to add just 100 resist, you'd gain 58,669 EH. However, if you were to add 500 armor and 50 resist (keeping the ratio intact), you'd gain 60,469 EH. The difference is small, but it gets larger as the numbers increase.

If you added 2k armor, you'd gain 117,338 EH. If you added 200 resist, you'd gain 117,338 resist. If you added 1k armor and 100 resist, you'd gain 124,537 resist.

So as we can see, you actually gain more EH if you keep the 1:10 ratio as close as possible. A lot of people say 1 resist = 10 armor, but that's not exactly true because it depends on how much of the other you have. It's better to add 500 armor and 50 resist than 1000 armor or 100 resist.

So now the question is how does health affect this? Is there a 100 ratio for health too? If there is a 100 health = 10 armor = 1 resist ratio, then we should see the same type of EH increase. As I showed earlier, adding 1000 armor or 100 resist added the same amount of EH. So does adding 10,000 health add the same amount too?

So if you had 1k armor or 100 resist to our original example, you gain 58,669 EH. If you add 10k health, you gain 95,630 EH.

Along those lines, we saw that it was better to add 500 armor and 50 resist than 1k armor or 100 resist. Does that mean it will be better to add an equal amount of health, armor and resist? If you add 3,333 health, 333 armor and 33 resist, you'd gain just 74,208 EH. This is actually less than you would get simply by adding 10k health.

Conclusion - there is no magical 100/10/1 ratio.
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