Diablo® III

The Diablo 2 experience: Builds

there were no "limited" builds in D2 as you put it

You had you build your stats/skills according to your available items, sure you could google a perfect build, but that doesn't mean you have those very special items to do it

for example, there were many different types of smiters or of javazons that play very differently or are effective in different ways

(note: i gonna brag about my n00b past)

I always used to build my barbarian with some strength so he could carry different armors then enigma like forty or i could make different items rotation for different PvP scenarios, and my barb was far more efficient then most guys out there who build their barbs around enigma and vitality

My barb also had dex stat on for max block and windowmaker bow, i could swap abs items without worrying about lack of stats, all that intop of my 6400life and life/resist/damage charms

Only a necromancer or another barb like mine could be a challenge to my barb.
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Sure there was a ton of depth to the building. I wish I could recall how each of my builds was specifically unique. Even though I played multiple types of summoners for example they did all have unique qualities about them. I was just generalizing because my memory isn't good enough to be able to cite how I tweaked some stats or used certain skills to make them different. That was common to all my builds but I had too many characters to identify the specifics.
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I made probly 5 different variations of poison zon. ....actually more than that.

plague: lightningfury/guided arrow/charged strike/enigma/chains of honor/fasterrunwalk/stacked res/max damage reduction/max block/max DEA/max damage/max vitality......

did a lot of PVP with the poison zon and many other "builds". It was cool how there were so many variations of every general build. There were hybrids for everything and some classes like the poison zon were automatically hybrids with more options.
Edited by Dirk#1799 on 1/12/2013 9:22 AM PST
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70 Tauren Paladin
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I made probly 5 different variations of poison zon. ....actually more than that.

plague: lightningfury/guided arrow/charged strike/enigma/chains of honor/fasterrunwalk/stacked res/max damage reduction/max block/max DEA/max damage/max vitality......

did a lot of PVP with the poison zon and many other "builds". It was cool how there were so many variations of every general build. There were hybrids for everything and some classes like the poison zon were automatically hybrids with more options.


Excuse me, none of that around here, thank you very much. Your variety of builds was an illusion. You were forced into leveling different builds against your will and against your very character. It wasn't "fun", it was tedious and time-consuming. You almost certainly googled "D2 amazon builds" and copy/pasted the first result into your computer to create your builds.

Did I miss any? Can't remember, it's late.
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Some of those builds can be consolidated into one build. Especially the necro ones. If you count all of them as one build then Wizards in d3 "Archon" has 30 different variations alone. Let alone CM.

I specifically separated them out because the actual way they played was distinct even if I didn't list all the specific skills.

01/12/2013 08:45 AMPosted by CyberGoat
WoTB begs to hear you don't have a build for it...
So does Archon.

I've also seen 2 minute WD's that use them as well.
Oh, here's a video showing MP10 Butcher death in 9 seconds doing so.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qzpRAUgyxaU

There's 3 2 min cd skills in D3 that have builds.

I didn't say they all did. Also, there are plenty of skills with lower cooldowns that simply can't be made the focus of a build. In fact I'd say most skills are inherently unsuitable to builds if only because of the limitations in gearing and the itemization. You seem to be just looking to pick a fight. You still haven't listed your character builds from D2 so I'm having a hard time deciding why you are in this thread but I'm guessing it isn't because you were a D2 vet.


No they aren't. Most of those summon builds played pretty much the exact same way. You can argue the same in d3. An archon that uses teleport instead of improved has more mobility but does less damage. So you can use it to reposition instead of mowing things down with raw damage. An archon with scramble armor has more movement speed than ones energy armor variants but those with energy armor variants have a more tanky feel. Outside archon form those that use forked lightning kill larger groups of enemies quicker as opposed to those using twister to get into archon form even quicker but having a lower damage output.

Etc etc etc. Each variant plays slightly differently as well.
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I specifically separated them out because the actual way they played was distinct even if I didn't list all the specific skills.


I didn't say they all did. Also, there are plenty of skills with lower cooldowns that simply can't be made the focus of a build. In fact I'd say most skills are inherently unsuitable to builds if only because of the limitations in gearing and the itemization. You seem to be just looking to pick a fight. You still haven't listed your character builds from D2 so I'm having a hard time deciding why you are in this thread but I'm guessing it isn't because you were a D2 vet.


No they aren't. Most of those summon builds played pretty much the exact same way. You can argue the same in d3. An archon that uses teleport instead of improved has more mobility but does less damage. So you can use it to reposition instead of mowing things down with raw damage. An archon with scramble armor has more movement speed than ones energy armor variants but those with energy armor variants have a more tanky feel. Outside archon form those that use forked lightning kill larger groups of enemies quicker as opposed to those using twister to get into archon form even quicker but having a lower damage output.

Etc etc etc. Each variant plays slightly differently as well.

This only makes me think that you didn't play much D2. Or at least many summoners...
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I had an Aura/shout barb towards the end of D2 (everything else I made is on that list already haha)

It was more of a griefer than anything else tho. If you had enough auras going at the same time(I believe it was 18?) it would DC people and you could kill them without them fighting back. It was hilarious to do to bots.
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you forgot ww hybrid sin.
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Amazon:
2 - Lightning Fury
1 - Guided arrow/strafe
1 - Guided arrow/multishot
2 - Freezing arrow/Immolation arrow (Kuko Shukaku for good measure :P)


Tankazon
Spearazon

I had fun with the Sorbazon. Not one that was all that popular and was only something I used to play with.
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01/12/2013 08:22 AMPosted by Xoh
Utter, complete, absurd nonsense. Most builds I played worked OK with average gear, good with great gear, and amazingly with perfect gear.


Agreed. Also, they were fun.
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Maybe not the most interesting to play.... okay, if there is THE MOST BORING BUILD EVER, this is it:

Bone Spear + Bone Prison necro.

1: ensure that whole screen is packed densely with bone prisons which cost 1 mana and are generally unkillable even for hardest-hitting frenzied monsters in hell difficulty.
2: slowly peck every mob's life, one hp after another, with your pitiful 2.5k dmg spear (or 2.8k if godly gear).
3: If everything is dead, wait until prisons "dissolve", move few steps forward, repeat from 1.

And I actually farmed Hell Meph (on p8) with that. Never died, but iirc it took about 4-5 mins per run.

Fun times, fun times... I want to have such memories from D3, too!

EDIT: Just forgot to add. Altough the whole build could be used as a definition for the word "boring" in an encyclopedia, it has one peculiar... thing to it. Bone prisons attract monsters. From all over the map. Literally. If the mob has LOS to the prison, he will eventually come. I recommend trying that on cow level :D
Edited by Scharnvirk#2371 on 1/12/2013 2:12 PM PST
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I think one thing that made d2 great in terms of builds was that some builds had a non-reliance on weapon DPS, instead a reliance on the skills themselves.

For instance, you had casters running with wizspikes/HOTO which had no damange themselves, but casting spells (blizzard/hammer/psn nova) where the damage was increased by skills levels gained from gear and specs with bonuses to survival (resistance/vita/fcr)

Can't forget about fireclaws or lightening amazons, where they maxed ias with no weapon dps, all dps gained from +skills and synergy in later patches. However, both builds were viable before that.

The fact that you can have a weapon with all the same stats and use it just as effectively on a wizard as you can a barbarian makes no sense. Take a good cd/soc/black dmg/LS weapon and you can make an OP char of any kind. No class specification, and no reliance on different damage types.

So we have traded +skill level for +dps, hugely reliant on your weapon (not skills used) and have almost no gear that incentives building around a certain skill, we simply choose the skill+rune combinations with most dps, while trying to have enough vita/res to stay alive, and use all the same gear on every char.
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I loved to play "Paladin" and I can say it's one of the NightShiver's profile history during our time. Retired from D1 & D2 long time ago now and just came back recently. :)
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There were so many cool builds over the years that got nerfed or degraded by patches, e.g. synergies.

What was that one OP necro build from way back when the game first came out, like blood golem + iron maiden? And corpse explosion was ridiculous. I loved covering the ground in strawberry jam and just making a complete mess.
Edited by marshmallow#1914 on 1/12/2013 2:11 PM PST
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I had an Aura/shout barb towards the end of D2 (everything else I made is on that list already haha)

It was more of a griefer than anything else tho. If you had enough auras going at the same time(I believe it was 18?) it would DC people and you could kill them without them fighting back. It was hilarious to do to bots.


Haha, even today I'm still learning of things in D2 that I wasn't aware. All this talk of aura/shout/singer barbs makes me think I was missing out. Perhaps I'll put him on my list to try some time soon.

There were so many cool builds over the years that got nerfed or degraded by patches, e.g. synergies.

What was that one OP necro build from way back when the game first came out, like blood golem + iron maiden? And corpse explosion was ridiculous. I loved covering the ground in strawberry jam and just making a complete mess.

I'm not sure I ever made a necro that didn't take at least 1 point in CE. Truly one of the most awesome skills from the game. IM was fun even without the OP blood golem combo but that was pretty broken. I liked taking a lot of the curses just to switch it up and IM was one of my favorites if only as retribution for all of my fallen melee characters felled by it haha.
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I made probly 5 different variations of poison zon. ....actually more than that.

plague: lightningfury/guided arrow/charged strike/enigma/chains of honor/fasterrunwalk/stacked res/max damage reduction/max block/max DEA/max damage/max vitality......

did a lot of PVP with the poison zon and many other "builds". It was cool how there were so many variations of every general build. There were hybrids for everything and some classes like the poison zon were automatically hybrids with more options.

Excuse me, none of that around here, thank you very much. Your variety of builds was an illusion. You were forced into leveling different builds against your will and against your very character. It wasn't "fun", it was tedious and time-consuming. You almost certainly googled "D2 amazon builds" and copy/pasted the first result into your computer to create your builds.

Did I miss any? Can't remember, it's late.


LOL that's pretty funny you think I copy/pasted all that stuff. You're saying that it was an "illusion" that my poison zons were different? Leveling was kind of tedious but it didnt really take that long if you knew what to do and they did add respec tokens at some point.

BTW. I was not trying to make any kind of argument, the OP wanted to hear from some D2 vets about their experiences regarding builds in D2. It was just a recollection of one of my favorite builds.
Edited by Dirk#1799 on 1/13/2013 10:24 AM PST
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What made D2 great is what makes POE even better....
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I put down D3 when this last ladder season started and quickly became annoyed by all the crashes do to duped sojs being sold. So I started 10 HC characters on SP:
Summoner Nec (Skellies, Iron Golem, CE)
Bone Nec (Pure Bone Skills Nothing else)
Light/Orb Sorc (self explanatory)
Wind Druid (self explanatory)
WhirlWind Barb (selfexplanatory)
Hammerdin (self explanatory)
Smiter (100% CB build since no grief on SP)
Bowazon (Strafe/Multishot)
Kicksin (not sure whether I'll use shadow master or not)
Poison Nec (No skellies, just max poison and max CE)

It's been fun so far. My level 80 Summon Nec just made it to hell!! The rest are in between level 50-60 and have not yet started Nightmare. I level the crap out of these you say? Of course, they're all HC and I don't want them to die!!!

The fun part about SP is that you don't have all the trading and easy to get stuff. you have to make it up as you go. No insight means drinking pots and figuring out how to get mana regen.

On an awesome note I was doing Normal Baal runs all day yesterday with a couple of characters and each got a SOJ!!!! Nice. 2 in one day is awesome. I think Baal's wave 4 dropped the 1st and wave 5 dropped the second a couple of hours later.

To be clear about how I play, all of my players are lotl (Live off the land) they only use what they find....I don't even share between characters. I have cringed a bit selling items before...hahaha.

Anyways, I know I'm like a year late to this post, just saw it while playing and figured I'd comment, maybe see who else is still playing D2
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A quick comparison of the two games (for fun)

D2:LOD: My Bone Nec:

I am a currently trying to gamble a magic sharkskin belt so I can craft it into a caster belt. I am still in normal mode, because I always try to get as much as I can before moving on. I am looking for a white or gray w/ 2 sockets wand with +3 to bone spear on it so that I can socket it in the cube and add the runeword "White" when I get to Nightmare. Since I won't be able to get a Homunculus until NM Baal, I am also trying to find a white or gray w/ 2 sockets shrunken head with any amount to bone spear so that I can socket it as well in the cube and add the runeword "Rhyme" as soon as I can. I have already crafted caster gloves and boots, allthough they are normal and I have got a set of demonhides (exceptional version of both) to craft better caster boots and gloves. I am wearing the runeword "Lore" for a helm and gamble for rings and amulets whenever my gold is full. I had Just upgraded my Mercs Polearm to a Rare Partizan.

D3:ROS

My Witch Doctor will probably go out and just get whatever he finds. If i don't like one of the stats on an item i get, I will probably change it. Also, I can make the item look like something else......cause that's useful. I hate my mercs!!!

When you play D2, I mean really play it in depth, there is an art to it. Knowing how and where to find stuff, what you need to do to survive, to get an HC to level 99......D3 just doesn't compare in my book. As a stand alone game D3 is awesome. I has great graphics, it's fun, I has a cool story. But, there is not as much art to it. I have tested using different skills with the same character on D3 and came out with the same results. When you damage an enemy in D3 the question is not what skill do you use, it's when you damage someone, what do you want it to look like. The same weapons help the Witch Doctor as does the Barbarian. There is a hundred ways to create and get items in D2. In D3 you just get whatever drops and other than being able to change one line and what it looks like, that's pretty much it.
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