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You can't stack DoT but you can cast more than one Blizzard on the screen (as it has no CD). 80% slow is very good and it has a rune for Freeze which is even better than Immb.
Grasp has much smaller radius (and damage potential) and it has a CD. The skill is designed as a keep-away skill and I really don't think adding 1-2s Immobilize is too much to ask since the skill is very unpopular. The grasping hands that immobilize fit the theme so well.
As for Firebats, I'll wait and see. If they buff Fetish, Firebats will become more popular. They go hand-in-hand very well. I've used several Firebat builds for like 5 hours over the weekend and I do interrupt myself a lot due to being knocked back, feared, frozen, or simply avoiding arcane, dot on the ground. Elites that run a lot is a headache. I really have a mixed feeling about 220 start up cost. Who knows. If more WDs test it out and complain about initial cost, then maybe they'll reduce it.
Fetish has a big problem. Very low damage and having too many Dagger ones block each other. I've been using Fetish builds this weekend and if I get more than 10 of them, the extra ones just really don't add much to the battle field.
What I would prefer is a much stronger Fetish but cap at certain # (say 7?). And I really want more Head Hunter and Tiki.
Edited by Jibikao#1131 on 4/15/2013 9:32 AM PDT
Whatever they do, they need to let us have more access to Tiki and Hunter.
The two runes under Fetish Army need to give me 5 Tiki and Hunter and not just two. Two is just soooooooo lame. Two Tiki/Hunter don't satisfy my Fetish thirst.
I have timed that both Tiki and Hunter can shoot up to 16 times during 20s at the most optimal situation (when there is no running or controls that slow them down).
So at best, that's 320% weapon damage over 20s = 16% per second (laughable!!!)
Five of them? 80% weapon damage per second. Is this REALLY overpowered for a skill with 120s cool down? Oh please!!
If anything, Fetish needs the most BUFF right now! But I have a feeling that Firebats was thrown in because people really want to see some skill changes in a patch and Firebats is easier to fix than Fetish.
Edited by Jibikao#1131 on 4/15/2013 9:38 AM PDT
I don't think anymore cc is gona help GotD because the 80% slow is already good enough when it comes to holding enemies in place. I think it needs damage if anything. But with that said, I think what you suggested is not much to ask and it fits with the theme.
Btw you are grossly over estimating blizzard, it doesn't do all that you said at once. Different runes do different things, some slow, others have a chance to freeze, etc. + It's radius is the same as GotD.
I don't know how they are gona buff the damage I mean. You can usually stack 2 bears and sometimes 3 so are they gona buff it to 500% dps to compete? This is the reason why I haven't added Firebats to the opening post, it's a tough one!
I am seriously starting to consider the idea that Ghost Trance should prevent those standing in the ritual area from getting cced. It fits in very nicely, and is very needed seeing this new change for Firebats.
yes you are right. But procing darters and flamethrowers will solve this. Actually we can add this rationale to the opening post (the reason why darters and flamethrowers should be added to the sycophants is because of overcrowding of melee Fetishes). Thanks for bringin it up. :) You are awesome
@fetish cap and stronger fetish
Noooo. If we want to be able to Sacrifice fetishes we need to sometimes get lucky and get 12 of them (which happened to me once) and then explode everything on the screen. Knowing that that kind of thing is possible with Fetishes will attract people to it. If they also add in the Jungle Drums redesign suggestion, this will be super fun to play.
Plus when they fix thorns we will see more use of Fetishes for doing thorns damage.
@fetish army duration
Do they last for 20 seconds or die prematurely? I have been testing this and getting mixed results.
Edited by JangBahadur#1968 on 4/15/2013 11:53 PM PDT
One of Blizzard runes has 22 yard!!! I've tried it and it's so amazing for slow and even damage.
I don't think I am overly estimating Blizzard. Blizzard's based damage is 85% weapon per second. Grasp's base is only 40% per second. If the monsters run out of the radius, you can cast Blizzard (as long as you have arcane) again; whereas Grasp, you need to wait for the cool down. That's why I suggest 1-2s Immb because you at least can try to maximize Grasp's damage when it counts. Blizzard? You can cast it again in another area to make sure monsters are constantly slowed. Again, the main purpose of Blizzard and Grasp is to provide soft control and Blizzard is simply superior in many ways (Blizzard also has an amazing synergy with Cold Blooded tactic).
Fetish Army lasts 20s but they can die. However, it is still confusing as to HOW they die. I really wish the dev could have answered my questions during PTR when they buffed Fetish tactic to 5% chance. I don't think Fetish has "health". They simply take certain # of hits and die.
My original suggestion for Fetish Tactic is this:
1. Fire-based attacks proc Tiki
2. Poison-based attacks proc Hunter
3. Physical-based or Arcane attacks proc Dagger
I really don't know why they exclude Spirit spells from proc Fetish because as a Spirit build that doesn't want Dogs/Garg, a random distraction from Fetish is actually very welcoming. I would totally use Fetish tactic if I run a WoS build as I have no mana problem and I need some distraction for defense.
Edited by Jibikao#1131 on 4/16/2013 10:03 AM PDT
I am not exactly sure what to do with Fetish Army. It is a huge mess. The only useful one is that initial burst damage rune but even that is pathetic for a 120s CD.
Do we really want to add 5 more Fetish when you already proc 10 of them? Unless they are all Tiki or Hunter, the Dagger ones are blocking each other so much and there's whole lot of giggling, not too much stabbing.
It's a shame because when I first read about WD, Fetish Army caught my eyes the most!! It is our signature spell... sigh. Signaturally bad.
Edited by Jibikao#1131 on 4/16/2013 10:08 AM PDT
I agree with the posts on the previous page. The gibbon should be the game changing knife when it comes to fetish builds. It could reduce cooldowns for army, bbv, and chance to spawn random fetish. It would be awesome to have an army of crazy little crack head ninjas running around, tripping you and stuff.
For added variety:
Grasp of the Dead / Groping Eels: Instead of doing a flat damage boost, have it increase all damage done to mobs who are on it.
Horrify: Have a rune that heals.
Hex / Hedge Magic: Needs to scale with health or do something that is useful for level 60+.
Haunt / Draining Spirit: Now that Haunt is really short in duration, the mana return doesn't justify using it if it stops after 6 seconds.
Haunt / Consuming Spirit: Have it's health return scale with gear after level 60.
Haunt: Allow it to stack on the same target so it can be used as an effective single target spell without losing its essence.
Wall of Zombies: Reduce the cooldown. Dead Rush: Remove the cool down or at least have a knockback on it.
Gargantuan / Wrathful Protector: Buff it.
Sacrifice: (I'm not taking 0 Dogs into consideration here.) Allow Sacrifice to increase the cap beyond 3 (or 4, with the passive) and when Sacrifice is triggered, it detonates the extra dogs. Have a time limit on the extra dogs (ie, they only last 30 seconds or something). That way Zombie Dogs can still be a defensive spell while not compromising that with Sacrifice.
Edited by Cujo#1162 on 4/17/2013 2:12 AM PDT
Yes... it is mildly annoying because people who chose WDs are mostly drawn to "Pets" and maybe "DoT" style of gameplay.
We don't even have a good pet damage build except for sacrificing them. That's NOT the same.
It's sad because we do have an attack-speed build AND pet build in Fetish. The faster we attack, = the more Fetish = the more Pet damage, except Fetish damage is laughable.
A Fetish build is going to be VERY different setup than Bear build. I don't know why they aren't looking into it asap to smooth out build diversity. WD has the worst build diversity.
Edited by Jibikao#1131 on 4/17/2013 3:29 PM PDT
Could they nerf Bats more plz!
I dont care about the dmg inc with a 220 mana cost. Bats and most skills normal work best if you keep moving.
If you striff step fire1-2sec move fire again your going Oom sucker.
If you stand still your going to die sucker!
Muhahaha that will kill them bat using sob's. Should have just used Bears/Zero Dogs like good players to begine with.
@Blizzard is a pwnage skill
Yeah I agree Blizzard is awesome. GotD can definitely do more damage too. All DoTs are pretty horrible right now.
@original suggestion for Fetish
I remember reading it a while back but I don't like that idea. I'd rather have a good number of all fetishes no matter which physical spell I spam. Because if I want to summon all of them, then I have to pick a number of abilities and spam all of them and thats just making it cumbersome. It should be kept simple. + If I am running a Bats or Bear or AC build (the most popular builds), I am unnecessarily gimping my defenses by not summoning any dagger fetish, especially with the new Bat changes.
Fetishes don't fit into Spirit spells imo. But I wouldn't mind seeing this changed.
It's supposed to be a skill equivalent of a SoJ, so I don't expect it to do more damage per minute. I expect it to be useful only when fighting elites, similar to Paranoia, Slam Dance, etc. But currently its not even worth using in an elite fight. Fixing their survivability is a start but it needs more work definitely.
A Fetish build is going to be VERY different setup than Bear build. I don't know why they aren't looking into it asap to smooth out build diversity.
Edited by JangBahadur#1968 on 4/18/2013 2:00 AM PDT
Yeah Gidbinn is a piece of trash. They need to fix it, add a random affix or two. Same with Last Breath.
And spirit spells. But I'm glad they are trying.
Could they nerf Bats more plz!
We will see in PTR, and test it out like crazy, and if we hate it we will let them know. Muahahah!
Edited by JangBahadur#1968 on 4/18/2013 1:57 AM PDT
Nah man people discussing this thread have many ideas for the WD and they want to see his useless skills become useful again. And through discussion, we are constantly refining our suggestions. Just go back a few pages, you'll see what I mean. The opening post has gone through a major update and there is more to come. This thread is a gold mine for the WD developers IMO.
You are welcome to share your ideas as well.
Edited by JangBahadur#1968 on 4/18/2013 1:56 AM PDT
I love my Gidbinn :D It hits fast and got mf on it so i can max it for my runs at low PM4 (one day i'll be abble to remove my crappy mf zunni armor to fly to PM5 :p)
And balance runes
And mana regeneration problem
And primary defaults
Come on Blizz, we need a patch for us alone lol
Buff Locust Swarm and haunt dramatically (see Rend, I play a barb and rend with no rune is 3 times the dps of LS dot and is just as easy to use. Oh and did I mention that it heals for 9% of the damage dealt ?....), buff fetishes (maybe allow them to walk through each other -btw a pile on kind of glyph for fetishes with 3 or four fetishes climbing on each other, like a totem, and attacking at the same time would have been priceless :D- or just add ranged ones like said before...
Maybe increase zombie dogs damage because it is pitiful right now, but at least they serve a purpose as a meat shield and they have one good rune outside of 0dog (damage mitigation):) / garg damage is in a good place with the humonguous rune.
But seriously, locust swarm ? it has zero purpose right now, it does no damage,it is absoutely useless for high mps ( useless against elites and against white mobs I find it more efficient to run in the middle of the pack and spam ZB since globes and GI flood you with mana) and for low mps xp farming just use acid cloud as you can aim it and it will one shot everything anyway.
The funny thing is I still use it from time to time since it is what sold the class to me and it is increadible to see your swarm spread. Same as I use fetishes from time to time because they are just too adorable :D
I can't comment too much on spirit skills as I didnt use them that much, but I think everyone agrees dots and fetishes need some love :'(
Edit : Oh and I forgot the most important : make dots have a chance to crit on each tick instead of each application, it is very bad design to have dots be the most unreliable source of damage.
Edited by Gael#1476 on 4/18/2013 5:22 PM PDT
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