Diablo® III

Is BLZ going to nerf black weapons (calamity ... etc)?

Wrong Logi! It's a collective buff. Just some people will see more benefit than others. Blizzard screwed up and everyone should be dealing more damage.

And btw this is why Minimum Damage bonuses are SOOOOO much better than maximum Damage bonuses. ;)
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We'd like to see a blue post on this ... buff? nerf? leave it alone?

This is a fundamental issue for the game.

Wrong Logi! It's a collective buff. Just some people will see more benefit than others. Blizzard screwed up and everyone should be dealing more damage.

And btw this is why Minimum Damage bonuses are SOOOOO much better than maximum Damage bonuses. ;)
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so can they retroactively apply this fix to weps already in the wild?
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So now, everybody has to take a decision :)

If you think it's nerf, you should sell your black weapon as soon as possible to buy a elemental weapon :)

If you think it's buff, you should sell your elemental weapon to buy a black one.

In the both case, we can lost or save a lot of money :) or earn if you have very big balls :)
gambling !!!
Edited by Umbrah#2672 on 1/18/2013 11:59 AM PST
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they could and might (they did nerf ias) ...

01/18/2013 11:42 AMPosted by Monsta
so can they retroactively apply this fix to weps already in the wild?
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Heu.. nan there is a third solution.
Just waiting, because if the fix affects only new drop and you bought something you will lose :)
Edited by Umbrah#2672 on 1/18/2013 12:05 PM PST
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It's just hard to me to see how this could ever be seen as a nerf, when clearly the damage calculation is wrong. We know how it's being calculated and it's clearly not right. Logically, we'd expect this to be the calculation for damage:
*Minimum Damage Range = Minimum Base Weapon Damage + (Minimum Damage)
*Maximum Damage Range = Maximum Base Weapon Damage + (Minimum Damage + Maximum Damage)

Anything else doesn't make sense, but yet right now it's:
*Maximum Damage Range = Minimum Base Weapon Damage + (Minimum Damage + Maximum Damage)
Edited by TekkZero#1963 on 1/18/2013 12:09 PM PST
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*Maximum Damage Range = Minimum Base Weapon Damage + (Minimum Damage + Maximum Damage)

why doesn't this add up?
(min(48) + 260 + 362 )*1.49 = 998.3

my top end is 1000 not 998 or 999

if max base weapon < (Min Base weapon + minimum)
then max = (Min Base weapon + minimum)+1

(309 + 362 ) = 999.79 rounds up to 1000 <-- listed on my calamity
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That would probably be the best approach to take. After the IAS nerf and resulting exodus, I would hope someone there is paying attention.


there was no exodus, only some vocal minority pretentiously stated they're leaving, only to be back few weeks/days later. hypocrites

AND most importantly you AGREED on purchase screen that you are fully aware that "item properties and values might change over time"


But I never agreed that I would not stop supporting blizzard and never buy their game again...

BTW, this issue doesn't really affect me, only my offhand is affected and that would only drop my tDPS by less than 1%, also I've got a really nice pair of Danetta and Calamity, both with more + Max than Min, would worth a lot if they make the change, but you got to stand up for what's right and what's wrong.
Edited by Rognar#1625 on 1/18/2013 12:29 PM PST
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It's just hard to me to see how this could ever be seen as a nerf, when clearly the damage calculation is wrong. We know how it's being calculated and it's clearly not right. Logically, we'd expect this to be the calculation for damage:
*Minimum Damage Range = Minimum Base Weapon Damage + (Minimum Damage)
*Maximum Damage Range = Maximum Base Weapon Damage + (Minimum Damage + Maximum Damage)

Anything else doesn't make sense, but yet right now it's:
*Maximum Damage Range = Minimum Base Weapon Damage + (Minimum Damage + Maximum Damage)


I totaly agree with you, but I will just waiting :)

I want to correct something else :
If it's a buff, I was totaly wrong when a Isaid that :
Posted by TekkZero
Yeah, it's a huge buff for EVERYONE because the base maximum damage isn't being used for estimating the maximum range, instead we're using the base minimum damage.

Not exalty :)
Only for people with blackweapon :)


Because it will affect elemental weapon as well than blackweapon :)
the difference between the two kind of weapon is the bonus(WeaponMin+WeaponMax), not the item which is the base :)

So if MaxWeaponBase increase the dps of blackweapon, it will increase the dps of the elemental weapon as well :) So manticore will not be useless :) And that can explain little bit more, why we are dropping sh.... item :)

If it's a nerf, only blackweapon will lost a lot of value :( because the max bonus on elemental weapon is much more bigger than on black one

EDIT : I forgot something else : ExtraDamage
So black will be buff, a little bit more si it's a buff, because of the ExtraDamage which is apply on the Maximum Base Weapon Damage :) As tekkzero said.
Edited by Umbrah#2672 on 1/18/2013 12:48 PM PST
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Interesting find. Hopefully they fix the calamity so it can stay at that high end dps.
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Yeah someone understood me !!!
Everybody who thinks it's a nerf think that :
the new MaxWeaponDamageCorrected will be : (MaxWeaponBase+WeaponMax)*ExtraDamage
This is what I would like to correct !

But what we think is :
MaxWeaponDamageCorrected = (MaxWeaponBase+WeaponMin+WeaponMax)*ExtraDamage;


Just so you understand, the bolded part here that you think will be the fix is actually what currently is causing the bug to begin with, and what will be fixed next patch. I already demonstrated that in my posts here.

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@Zoid: You're quite correct there's an extra +1 being added. I was simplifying it for people just getting into the discussion. It's actually (Min Base Weapon Damage+1+Min Damage+Max Damage) being used instead of (Max Base Weapon Damage + Min Damage + Max Damage). But I'm trying not to complicate the issue for people struggling to understand what's going wrong.

From a coding perspective the +1 makes 100% sense, since the person coding it just assumed that the Maximum Damage Range should be (Minimum Damage Range + 1 + Max Damage). But that's wrong, as it should be (Maximum Base Damage + Minimum Damage + Maximum Damage). At least this is how I'm understanding the issue.
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What I find odd though is not all items do this and that it may only be affecting items with the min and max damage affix. I checked basic items and they are performing the calculation properly.
Edited by TekkZero#1963 on 1/18/2013 12:56 PM PST
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01/18/2013 12:46 PMPosted by TheTias
I already demonstrated that in my posts here.


I am not sure, if i understand what you mean :)
you want to say you found what was the real issue before me ?
It's ok for me :)
If it's that I am sorry, i didn't see your post. At the begin, i was on this post :
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/7593743038?page=2
When I came here I just saw few post about the nerf like on the first topic where i was, not about de buff.

So I thougth it was better if I keep speaking here about this issue, because here is the general discussion :)
Edited by Umbrah#2672 on 1/18/2013 1:22 PM PST
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Nerfing the Calamity would be a......calamity.
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when do you guys think this change will get implemented?
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*Maximum Damage Range = Minimum Base Weapon Damage + (Minimum Damage + Maximum Damage)

why doesn't this add up?
(min(48) + 260 + 362 )*1.49 = 998.3

my top end is 1000 not 998 or 999

if max base weapon < (Min Base weapon + minimum)
then max = (Min Base weapon + minimum)+1

(309 + 362 ) = 999.79 rounds up to 1000 <-- listed on my calamity


But he is right though, maybe not on how it's working now, but on how it should work. o

On AH it's explicitly shown that +1 min damage =1 avg damage, and +1max damage = +0.5 avg damage.
Edited by Rognar#1625 on 1/18/2013 1:12 PM PST
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Posts: 6
If I understand correctly, right now maximum damage is double dipping from the max and min bonuses, except it's doing it using the minimum base instead. So really, we have two problems.

Logically, the max bonus applies only to max base, min bonus applies only to min base. But this will nerf weapon DPS.

What I think Trekk and Umbrah are saying is that Blizz should fix it so that maximum damage uses the maximum base AND still keep the same double dipping bonuses. This assumes that having the min bonus applied twice is the intended effect.

If that is true, then the same system should be consistent with bonuses seen on amulets and rings, and not just isolated to weapons.

If the min bonus is meant to be applied twice, then a ring with [+10 min] and [+10 max] rolls should be equivalent to a ring with [+10 to 20] roll. Is this correct?
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Now I might be more confused,

I understand the min > max then max = min+1
and
I understand that the affixes labeled 20-20 on a ruby is in fact 20-40 in function

but I can't be certain what is intended

weapon Max = (weapon Base max + minimum + maximum)*ed%
or
weapon Max = (weapon Base max + maximum)*ed%

in effect isn't that going to be a server-side calculation only? how could I check the actual damage calculation in the game?

isn't the DPS you guys are checking (diablo sites) client based proxy only? and not necessarily what is happening on the back-end?
Edited by zoid#1554 on 1/18/2013 1:17 PM PST
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