Diablo® III

TL2 "more rewarding" drops: the lie

It is pretty easy to cut all things about maths that i posted and sentence that TL2 is better even if end-game is completly unknow to all of you. You can't just compare the "rewarding" system of two games considering D3 inferno after 600 hours and more of gameplay and TL2, for just the levelling part.It's just fanboyism. Come on.


The math doesnt matter. TL2 has a far better and rewarding item system than D3 does at the moment. Heck the entire game is just more fun. D3 was fun at first until I figured out what it really was come inferno.

D3 has been slowly moving in a better direction, Blizz is very good at that but the itemization in D3 is nothing compared to TL2 and right now TL2 has far more to offer.
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01/21/2013 03:51 PMPosted by Suedomsa
D3 was fun at first until I figured out what it really was come inferno


What have you done in TL2?
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01/21/2013 04:16 PMPosted by ILGiudice
D3 was fun at first until I figured out what it really was come inferno


What have you done in TL2?


NG+ etc and mapworks to play around with. I think the most important thing ive done is kill a dragon.
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01/21/2013 04:29 PMPosted by Suedomsa
NG+ etc and mapworks to play around with. I think the most important thing ive done is kill a dragon.


Based on your profile i assume that you have maybe around 200 hours of gameplay in Diablo 3, and if you are in NG+ maybe you have no more then 20-30 hours.

My point is that it's easy to make a mistake if we talk about the "rewarding" feeling between two games that we don't know in the same way.

You say:

01/21/2013 03:51 PMPosted by Suedomsa
D3 was fun at first until I figured out what it really was come inferno


I think it's obvious to think that TL2 is better after only 20-30 hours. After that time most of people was still crazy about Diablo 3 too.

This is the point most people don't want to get. These type of ARPG requires a lot of end-game knowledge before we can make a sentence about what is better, not just few hours.

I'm playing both games and while levelling i'm still get upgrades in the same way. TL2 has more affixes, but if i want to stack 2 or 3 affixes and not just change every item after every drop i can find upgrade at the same frequency as in Diablo 3. Indeed i have many items 20-30 levels behind me. Exactly as in D3.
Edited by ILGiudice#2597 on 1/21/2013 5:22 PM PST
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01/21/2013 05:16 PMPosted by ILGiudice
Based on your profile i assume that you have maybe around 200 hours of gameplay in Diablo 3, and if you are in NG+ maybe you have no more then 20-30 hours.


Actually 106 hours in TL2 and more than 200 in D3, Im not sure exactly though since I dont have D3 installed at the moment.

Either way I feel TL2's item system is far superior either way. D3 needs more gear in it period and like ive said an overall itemization overhaul.

edit: Ok about 250 hours in D3.
Edited by Suedomsa#1857 on 1/21/2013 6:27 PM PST
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It's not really objective to sentence in forums that TL2 is more rewarding only after few hours of gameplay.
It's not fair, and maybe it's wrong.


I'm not going to hold your English against you since it's not your first language (I hope...) but I'm not sure I'm following you here. You're saying that it's not fair that I'm saying the time spent playing doesn't matter?

Okay, for the sake of argument I'll buy that (I really don't though).

I have ~400 or so hours in D3. I have ~100 or so hours in TL2. Do I seriously have to play for another 300 hours to be able to judge whether loot is more rewarding in TL2? No and that's a ridiculous position to take. I could even take it in hour long segments. Grind for 1 hour in D3, then grind for 1 hour in TL2 and finally compare what I have from both games. 9 times out of 10 the drops will be much better in TL2. That's just the way it is. Blame D3 for it's piss poor itemization and randomization of stats.

It is pretty easy to cut all things about maths that i posted and sentence that TL2 is better even if end-game is completly unknow to all of you.
You can't just compare the "rewarding" system of two games considering D3 inferno after 600 hours and more of gameplay and TL2, for just the levelling part.


Can easily compare leveling and max level in both games.

I primarily play alts and level characters in D3 because the max level grind is so atrocious. TL2 is flat out better in every regard with loot for leveling. The stuff I did at max level was ALSO better than D3. I regularly find GOOD gear for myself or future alts. I have a nice stash of gear for future use. In D3, it takes forever to find decent stuff for myself OR an alt. I've tried the self found thing and it's an exercise in frustration and tedium.
Edited by Ringo#1617 on 1/21/2013 6:34 PM PST
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http://i.imgur.com/SWgOloQ.jpg
the point is that loot in D3 will never be 4-barrel pistol "cool". And that pistol shoots all different elements (ice, fire, poison and electricity i guess), perhaps based on which barrel it uses. This synergizes with my elemental damage build (remember poison showers from post before ! also that is the summoned tank thing in the background) that, while enhancing poison damage the most, also biffs up other elemental damage. It is FANTASTIC for what this toon was made to be, and would be pretty damn bad with most other builds even for the same class.

and ALL my gear actually is GOOD for my specific build. coz there is a lot of it in TL2 and I selected that which suits me the most. in D3, if the gear is decent, it is decent. It would work for all classes and builds, just change main attribute from STR to Dex or int. amiwrong ?
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01/21/2013 08:00 PMPosted by Vladis
http://i.imgur.com/SWgOloQ.jpg


Gotta love it.
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The itemization in Torchlight 2 IS better than Diablo 3, but that doesn't mean there aren't any garbage items. After awhile, I stopped looking at green named items, grabbing them just to vendor to get the gold to enchant/buy maps/socket items. I barely look at blue named items now (level 70ish), and the vast majority of blue items I find only have one or two properties on them. The only interesting items I'm finding at the higher levels are the uniques or the blue set items, and those can be a crap shoot as well.
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01/22/2013 09:52 AMPosted by Begaria
The itemization in Torchlight 2 IS better than Diablo 3, but that doesn't mean there aren't any garbage items. After awhile, I stopped looking at green named items, grabbing them just to vendor to get the gold to enchant/buy maps/socket items. I barely look at blue named items now (level 70ish), and the vast majority of blue items I find only have one or two properties on them. The only interesting items I'm finding at the higher levels are the uniques or the blue set items, and those can be a crap shoot as well.


Yea, there are definately lots of garbage items, at least we have interesting things to do with gold in TL2.
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01/22/2013 09:52 AMPosted by Begaria
The itemization in Torchlight 2 IS better than Diablo 3, but that doesn't mean there aren't any garbage items. After awhile, I stopped looking at green named items, grabbing them just to vendor to get the gold to enchant/buy maps/socket items. I barely look at blue named items now (level 70ish), and the vast majority of blue items I find only have one or two properties on them. The only interesting items I'm finding at the higher levels are the uniques or the blue set items, and those can be a crap shoot as well.


I find that increasing amount of useless items is normal in any loot grind game. with more time spent, more items picked up, larger amount of items is being siifted through to pick out the best item possible. Thus your perception of a lot of crap drops will just increase over time. But if i were to give "crappy" unique i dropped on my lvl 87 ol to my lvl 40 self, even if i were to scale it down to appropriate level, i would choke on tears of happiness.
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01/23/2013 09:47 AMPosted by Vladis
The itemization in Torchlight 2 IS better than Diablo 3, but that doesn't mean there aren't any garbage items. After awhile, I stopped looking at green named items, grabbing them just to vendor to get the gold to enchant/buy maps/socket items. I barely look at blue named items now (level 70ish), and the vast majority of blue items I find only have one or two properties on them. The only interesting items I'm finding at the higher levels are the uniques or the blue set items, and those can be a crap shoot as well.


I find that increasing amount of useless items is normal in any loot grind game. with more time spent, more items picked up, larger amount of items is being siifted through to pick out the best item possible. Thus your perception of a lot of crap drops will just increase over time. But if i were to give "crappy" unique i dropped on my lvl 87 ol to my lvl 40 self, even if i were to scale it down to appropriate level, i would choke on tears of happiness.


Yep, its the way of the action rpg, the thing is TL2 also does a very good job a replacing gear at a good pace and provides lots of interesting choices.
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The fun thing about loot in TL2 is that altough it is so much better than in D3 - varied, with interesting affixes, with sets and alll...

...last 20 or more backpacks of my blue+ loot were entirely vendored. Just like in D3.
Edited by Scharnvirk#2371 on 1/23/2013 2:33 PM PST
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Are you really comparing a 700 hours experience to a 80 one?

This is the main mistake you all commit.
It's pretty easy to say that is "more rewarding" after 1/10 of time played compared to Diablo 3.


What are you not getting? TL2's itemization rewards players in less than one tenth of the time it takes for D3 to begin to feel rewarding.

I think a lot of us, myself included, continue to invest time into D3 because we see the massive potential it has and hope things will get better. Plus it's Diablo 3. I've waited a decade for this, I want satisfaction!
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yeah in TL someone gets a purple item from every elite and their like "ewww wow a legendary" if they took the time to compare the stats with other player found items (which is impossible because of no AH). they would find all these items actually suck and make d3 items look godly. You just don't realize this cuz of no AH. (cave man stuff no AH.. how can games like PoE and TL2 even be compared to d3 ugh)
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01/25/2013 01:56 PMPosted by darkthrone
yeah in TL someone gets a purple item from every elite and their like "ewww wow a legendary" if they took the time to compare the stats with other player found items (which is impossible because of no AH). they would find all these items actually suck and make d3 items look godly. You just don't realize this cuz of no AH. (cave man stuff no AH.. how can games like PoE and TL2 even be compared to d3 ugh)


Um, this may have escaped you while you were busy dragging your knuckles up from the ground to try typing--and hey seems the ins and outs of grammar were too much for you this time, but A for effort--but Legendary items in TL are red and extremely hard to find. Infinitely harder than in D3.

Troll harder.
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And if you don't get the loot for pure drop rates, you can use the enchanters or the myriad of gems to make a worse weapon significantly better. On top of that, gold in TL2 matters significantly more, because you can actually SPEND it on something. Face it, if you don't use the auction house in Diablo 3, your gold is basically useless.

In TL you spend it gambling or paying for enchants -- and they get very, very expensive, and you can have 3 enchants per weapon, and there are number of different types of enchanters (though admittedly, to various decrees of usefulness).

The fact is: in TL 2 your don't have to invest a HUGE amount of time to obtain a max level character or obtain fairly decent gear. The game has easily obtainable break points. $20 for even 100 hours of game play would be well worth it.

Don't get my wrong, I like D3 as well, but once I played TL2 it is really, really hard to go back. The endless dungeon system makes it appealing, and in a few runs you find a few interesting pieces of loot.

D3 has far better graphics and more fluid combat, but that's about it. The real game, what makes you come back and play and play and play just isn't there.
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TL2 ARPG of the year 3 years development: indie company
Diablo 3 Disappointment of the year 12 years dev: rich well-established company.
/thread
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TL2 and POE items are useful

now, try to finish d3 with white items, you cant
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You forgot how there's 1000+ "affixes" for other gear, so you're never going to find anything that really optimizes your stats. And uniques have terrible stats as well.
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