Diablo® III

How It Went Terribly Wrong, Because They Listened To Us

01/20/2013 11:50 PMPosted by Sojubomb
none of your links work btw


i know i keep clicking but nothing, pls fix
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Kids will be kids, everyone complains they don't get enough drops


Nobody complained about this. You, like a few others, like to twist these words around, and quite frequently i'll add.

People complain about the quality of drops. The fact that class specific items are dropping with non class stats. Items dropping 4-6 levels lower than what they are, and many useless affixes just to name a few.

Go look at the "D3 is missing something important" thread. That sums up what people are saying. You'll notice one glaring thing there that completely refutes what you say... NOBODY has ever, currently is, or will ever ask for more drops.
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How it went terribly wrong: bad ideas by clueless team that doesn't know Diablo.

Of course listening blindly to majority requests can kill any game. That's why a SKILLED development team can filter through 99% of bad requests and internalize good ones.

This game was doomed before the seed was planted back in 2000 something. Not because they 'listened to us'. It has nothing to do with them listening to us, it has everything to do with having no real vision for the game or a means by which to realize it in staying true to Diablo. This thread infuriates me.
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90 Undead Rogue
6900
Also, I see a lot of people still attack the AH/RMAH as part of what is wrong with D3. In truth those elements were a success in that they preformed how they should. It was only perceived as such a negative because gear and itemization was completely linear in that upgrades consisted of more of the same universally good stats. Only items with lottery winning rolls had any value and everything else was trash. In a proper action RPG character specialization should have been able to provide value to the other stats.
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01/21/2013 12:30 AMPosted by Hackusations
Also, I see a lot of people still attack the AH/RMAH as part of what is wrong with D3. In truth those elements were a success in that they preformed how they should. It was only perceived as such a negative because gear and itemization was completely linear in that upgrades consisted of more of the same universally good stats. Only items with lottery winning rolls had any value and everything else was trash. In a proper action RPG character specialization should have been able to provide value to the other stats.


Bigger numbers were only important in that you need a base amount of EHP and DPS to be viable in 1.0.2 inferno. This is no longer an issue, thus increasing drops quality or quantity will not really solve the problem.

The problem is the lack of gear and skill synergy. In D2 you can base a character off a single item. In D3 the closest we have it is in the form of legendaries that remove cost or cooldown from specific skills. I'm speaking of zero dog/weapon throw/pile on etc.

What we need are more items with interesting and even OP properties which opens up build options. Example:

1. Reduce all skill cooldown by 1 sec.
2. Increase resource regeneration by 30%.
3. Increases movement speed cap by 12%
4. Thorns deal 100% more damage and procs bleeding
5. Enemy under snare effects (from you) also attacks 30% slower
6. Enemy under stun and frozen effects (from you) cannot dodge (PVP)
7. Enemy been knock backed (by you) also gets stunned for 1 second
8. Increase 200 fire resistance, lose 100 cold resistance
9. Reduce resource regeneration by 30%, increase 5 CC.

And these are just 5 minutes of thinking of what could have being.
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things that went wrong :

1) nerfs to monsters

2) made all drops ilvl 63 and legendaries BIS

these IMO are the 2 main reason why the game is in such a state right now
everyone remembers the 1st 2mths of diablo right , such huge playerbase , trading , interest.

how and why did it come to this SO FAST.

these are the reasons :

A) with buff to skills , items drops , items ( legendaries )
most gamers are able to clear content with average items. there is no need to trade , ask for templates and tips on how to beat content.

legendaries with only 1-2 random rolls on most easily became BIS.
economy basically tanked really fast.

add in nerfs to monster while buffing items/skills ... really doesnt add up does it.
gamers get bored really fast and they cant even turn to trading/making money

nothing sells , only top end BIS sells.
once the rich purchased their BIS legendaries , they stop spending
sellers cant sell when buyers stop buying ... the sellers stop farming.

so what does it all mean?

B) it means that if diablo3 was kept at the real inferno level , gamers will still be playing , farming and spending.

the tradeoff of helping casual vs gamers is totally not worth it.
casuals come and go , dont spend the time to farm and upgrade items , dont spend the money.

when the gamers leave to the next game .. this is where d3 suffers.
they take their spending power , power gaming , youtube skills somewhere else and u better hope its another blizzard product.

ideally u want the gamers to slowly upgrade and keep trading up/spend on sidegrades.

and the only way people will spend time farming for upgrades or spend money on items is when .... they actually DIE ALOT in the game.

they will never admit its a lack of skills ( look not everyone does the youtube , server 1st , gladiator skill ) but rather a lack of items.

so with this mindset , they either farm more and spend time trading OR they spend money on sidegrades.

so with all these in mind blizzard should actually :

1) make PVE harder
2) bring back more random rolls on items ( legendaries badly played )
3) screw ilevel 63 type items everywhere.
4) stop duping , botting and even scammers.

thanks lol :)


exactly. I have 4 sets of wiz gear all can roll this game ez with vaious builds. no point in upgrading. Not like i want to farm for another 200 hours anyway to buy the kinda items i need (2b) to call it a real upgrade anyway cos nothing sells anyway. so we are at a stale mate.

i have like 1b gold ATM collected over holiday break and prolly should just cash it out. I aint spending 500m for a better wand and like 12K dps just to roll 5% faster.
Edited by Aimless#1700 on 1/21/2013 1:07 AM PST
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In the many years before Diablo 3 release, the community suggested every manner of stupid feature. I have seen every stupid suggestion from making it first person, to having it take place in Napoleonic Europe, to mixing it with elements of Pokemon. I dare say that in all those years not a single fan requested the game to have a P2W auction house. So no, they don't listen to us.
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You're looking at it from a customer point of view.

They designed the loot RNG around the RMAH point of view.

Your ideas are in conflict with the ability of the RMAH to make money.

It would be REALLY EASY to make drops good, design algorithms that made sense, etc.

They DON'T WANT TO. The whole point is to get you scratching off your lottery tickets and buying (or selling) that gear on the AH.

That's the point of the game, every game mechanic funnels you toward this.
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You're looking at it from a customer point of view.

They designed the loot RNG around the RMAH point of view.

Your ideas are in conflict with the ability of the RMAH to make money.

It would be REALLY EASY to make drops good, design algorithms that made sense, etc.

They DON'T WANT TO. The whole point is to get you scratching off your lottery tickets and buying (or selling) that gear on the AH.

That's the point of the game, every game mechanic funnels you toward this.


You got it right,exactly what's wrong with this game and it will never change as long as the RMAH exists.Very well said and spot on,thank you.
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01/20/2013 10:16 PMPosted by familia
I'm convinced any experienced developing team knows more than you.


I'm pretty sure his criticisms and suggestions are better than any praises you've ever come up with.

Everything you've ever said amounts to "I like what D3 currently has to offer and think it will only get better." without any reasoning.
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Do you still play Diablo III as much as you did when you first started?

I don't, but I wish I did.

This is the part that baffles me. Judging by your profile, you have put a substantial amount of time into this game, probably dozens of hours a week for at least the first several months. Did you really think you could sustain such an excessive amount of play time without getting burned out? Is that a reasonable expectation for any game?

My advice: play with moderation, and if necessary, take a break so you can come back eager to play again.
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Blizzard failed to realize that increasing the drops in quantity and/or quality could never change the situation that drops of millions of players in AH are and will always be far superior to drops you get yourself. With estimated 80% of the players (or "kids") constantly glaring at the "Diamons House" (AH) they will never be satisfied.
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More loot equals better loot. If instead of get one lottery ticket, you get ten every purchase, the odds of wining the lottery is increased significantly. But the payout is also similarly divided by the increased number of winners.

What was a $250 dollar item is now vendor trash. The benchmark on what is good keeps rising regardless if they give more loot or better loot. So no, drops are fine, itemization is the problem.

If you learned math enough, you'll slowly understand that you can balance everything. If you make more drops, but devalue all of the potential rolls it has, you can make it so nearly all the items are still crappy. On the contrary, you can make items drop less, but have a higher chance of rolling actual useful stats, making it both rewarding to see and drop due to it's rarity, and rewarding because they are actually good items.

It's kids like you that whined for more drops and consequently made them listen and ruined this awesome game, shame on your ignorance and not even understanding how math works.

If they were to make white and blue items drop, with a large amount of flat dps for example, that could serve as the majority of junk drops rather than how the majority of rare and even Legendaries are now. It would balance the usage of different, actually unique abilities to be given to these items.


Exactly. I dont mind LESS drops but more QUALITY with the items.

its alright if rare items are VERY random going from very bad to really great. But some legendary items should not have that high random stats on them. It can mean that you find a skorn that is a brimstone or worth 1 billion gold.

THough I dont know why people think its "good" to have so many expensive items in teh game. I mean seriously, we are talking here about items that are worth 200, 300 and a lot more dollar in Gold ... thats not reasonable. And no, I dont care about the economy or a handfull of people that flip, or what ever.

Items should not be THAT rare so you cant afford them with USUAL playing. pretty much all games out there, good games (see world of tanks) give you at least a chance to reach the content with enough time. Not so in D3. Which is pretty sad.
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Imo every change they make besides a few have been good for the game. I think they just need to keep doing positive changes and listening to the community but actually listening not just reading and this game will go on for as long as d2 did.

Tbh diablo 2 didn't even get super popular until LoD and a bunch of changes to the game like synergies and better legendarys / runewords. This game really feels like d2 all over again for me the only reason I didn't play it more at the start is because there are so many other games now to get into. That I think is the biggest reason why people are asking for more from d3 when diablo 2 came out it has almost no rival games that could compare to it.
Edited by Calamity#1271 on 1/21/2013 7:17 AM PST
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