Diablo® III

Nerfing Crit possibly fixes everything wrong with D3.

Has anybody ever raided with an end game Rogue on WoW? Show of hands.

I did. All the way to Wrath of the Lich King (at which point I switched to DK). With Rogues, you wanted to hit the 30% Crit rate at which point it stopped being beneficial for you. You then wanted to get the highest hit rating possible so that you never miss (actually hit first, then crit), and stack Haste rating for more attack speed (which synergized with your Blade Flurry, Adrenaline Rush and Slice and Dice. At some point, you wanted to stack Armor Penetration as well (up until it's removal). And finally, you wanted to stack more Dexterity and Attack Power.

Even with a crit soft cap, (you could still stack beyond 30, but with diminished returns compared to other stats) you were still encouraged to maximize other stats and you wanted to hit every important stat to do as much damage as possible.

In this game, lets say there was a crit cap of 30. So you no longer seek crit in certain slots. Namely the Helm, Rings, Set Bonuses, Legendaries, and Passives. You only need 10 from gloves, 10 from Amulet, 5 from Bracers and 5 natural.

To compensate for the loss in CC, you want to hit faster so you are hitting crits at a rate that's required to proc your abilities. Attack speed is now the sought after roll on any source it can roll in. In other slots that do not roll CC, max survivability stats will be the new perfect rolls. For example, helm can be Main/Vit/AR/Socket/Regen/Armor. Desired gloves will still be Main/Vit/AR/IAS/CC/CD, because CC rolls 10 in that slot.

Might I add, in the process of nerfing CC, you now invalidate items that are no longer suitable with CC in it. A lot of set helms such as Tal Rasha's and IK have main/crit/socket built into it but now that crit is worthless in that slot, every item will devalue unless it has Vit and AR as well. Natalya's Embrace set bonus will either be OP or need to be removed. Another legendary rework is needed to match the new CC nerf.

Not only do you invalidate items, but passives as well. Because crit is capped at 30, Sharpshooter has to be reworked that it's cap is 30%. Grats, passive is now worthless. It's saving grace was 100% chance in 1 second.

Weapon Master will need to be nerfed to 5%. Rune choices will be affected too. Since the cap is 30, certain skills and runes will be highly valuable because it saves you from having to buy more CC, for example, Pinpoint Barrier.

Anyways, most of you guys get the idea. Next we'll have Iskra come in and say that all that can be avoided with a proc coefficient tweak, LOL


bla bla bla, rich folks were complaining on the current CC cap of 75.
Critical chance isn't the probolem, its critical damage. If you capped Crit damage a 300%, then crit chance value deminishes as well, re-balancing everything and still allowing some crit builds.
01/20/2013 02:15 PMPosted by TheClaw
I see what you're saying but your fix is too drastic. The playbase would not accept that in the least, not to mention it kills effective and fun builds. Something more along the lines of 40%crit cap before skills (so 35 from equipment) and and 400% cap on crit damage before skills (350 from equip) would probably do though. Theres no longer any reason to stack crit and crit dmg in EVERY equip slot and so every person would choose a 2 or 3 slots where they can look for other stats. At the very least crit damage should have a cap. Crit chance is more iffy bc of the interaction with skills....


i think this sounds like a much much better proposal.
People like OP are pretty brain dead, go to any calculator, and remove both CC/CD from all your gear, and take a look at your DPS, now put CC/CD back and remove only primary stats from all your gear and look at you DPS.

Think before you post.
Edited by Rognar#1625 on 1/21/2013 5:12 PM PST
Crit allows for cheese builds like sprint/ww and critical mass/wicked wind... which no matter how much Blizz claims they like these builds, you cannot look me in the eye and say it was the developer's intent for those skills to synergize in that way.


No, but even a broken clock gets it right twice a day.
WISH BLIZZ WOULD NERF THE OP SO HE CANT POST ANY OF THIS CRAP ANYMORE
LOL why don't you make your own ARPG and call it "Diablo 3: No Crit Edition"?
this is not WoW or any other mmo this is diablo
01/21/2013 06:44 PMPosted by Callpopo1
this is not WoW or any other mmo this is diablo


Sure fooled me!
Nerfing is not the right thing to do. On Buff strength and attack speed but dont allow a buffed item to have crit stats.

Example:

Gloves with 150 strength, 5% Crit chance, +50% crit damage

Gloves with 400-500 strength, NO CHANCE of rolling crit stats

Gloves with 10% atk speed, NO CHANCE OF ROLLING CRIT

Let us make a crit build, or let us make a strength/int/dex build, or let us make an attack speed build. I think they should update the game like that.
If crit was nerfed it would destroy iconic builds such as double tornado barbs or cm wiz or the cyclone sweeping wind monks, honestly your a complete troll and clearly nothing positive stems from your post. You are convoluted and refuse to put in the long hours of grind to attain this crit gear which this game was designed for; to farm for better loot. If you cannot afford the 2 billion short cut, thats not anyones problem but your own. Quit trying to ruin the game for countless people, its already heading in a good direction.

This thread should be deleted imo. Clearly the community and the game developers disagree with your opinion.

Also since when do you Nerf anything in a PVM game. Completely baseless argument.
Edited by likewater#1860 on 1/21/2013 7:29 PM PST
Crit chance is fine as it is. Alot of skills requires crit chance, and if crit chance is nerfed, these skills are no longer viable to use with the low procurement rate due to low crit chance. To gear crit chance to use these skills are a choice, not mandatory.

Crit damage is the one that needs to be looked into. Right now, the highest crit damage seen in diablo progress is 799%. which is pretty ridiculous. There should be a hardcap on crit damage , maybe max 300%, which is equivalent to 4x damage, or even lower.

While nerfing crit damage, blizzard MUST buff other currently useless affixes to promote gear diversity.
Nerfing is not the right thing to do. On Buff strength and attack speed but dont allow a buffed item to have crit stats.

Example:

Gloves with 150 strength, 5% Crit chance, +50% crit damage

Gloves with 400-500 strength, NO CHANCE of rolling crit stats

Gloves with 10% atk speed, NO CHANCE OF ROLLING CRIT

Let us make a crit build, or let us make a strength/int/dex build, or let us make an attack speed build. I think they should update the game like that.


You are stupid, see my last post, Str is already stronger than CC and CD combined.
90 Undead Warlock
5910
The day they nerf Crit Chance everyone will buy gear from RMAH again and blizz makes more money... Don't think they wont do it. This guy just a undercover Blizz tryin to convince us its a good idea!
Blizzard should of hired pre-DOTA2 Icefrog, that guy had balls and wasn't afraid to nerf and balance stuff.

People have zero sense of scaling and balance these days.


IceFrog's working in Valve now, rival company of ActivBlizzard.

Back on Topic

To restore the game, either via numerous patches, or expansion. Nerfing/Capping crit in game will make these gear ever more expensive rather than fixing anything else. Please will try to buy more crit to hit the cap. You see any price drop in ias gear when the ias nerf happens?

The first fix is to round/lower down the damage, hp, resistances, armour (ehp) for all players and monsters, then change the formula for weapon damage and primary stats benefits.

The damage from skills should scales with weapons and stats (and not just primary stats).

Lastly, skills should split into multiple category like physical and special damage, with additions instead of multiplication of base stats.

Eg. Spectral Blade deals 165% weapon damage(currently multiplies with intelligence) => Spectral blade deals 115% weapon damage + 500% of strength(physical)

Eg. Invoke a bubble of warped time and space for 8 seconds reducing enemy attack speed by 20% and movement speed by 60%. This bubble also slows the movement of enemy projectiles by 90%. =>
Invoke a bubble of warped time and space for 8 seconds reducing enemy attack speed by 4% of dexterity and movement speed by 12% of dexterity. This bubble also slows the movement of enemy projectiles by 18% of dexterity. (Agility)

Eg. Unleash a twister of pure energy that deals 360% weapon damage as Arcane over 6 seconds to everything in its path. =>
Unleash a twister of pure energy that deals 210% of intelligence and 100% weapon damage as Arcane over 6 seconds to everything in its path.(Special)

While the above are subtle changes, this split the dependency of weapon damage and reduce the reliance of base stats. Different skills depends on different stats for damage will allows the classes to 'share' and with less 'worthless' gears to each class, drops are more meaningful. Everyone will not be tunneled into one specific gears even though their skill sets are different, and dps affix (mainly critical chances and critical damage) as important as they are now, are not more significant then having base stats.


i think making cc available on more items and allow higher rolls on each item is a better solution to the price issue in AH that you mentioned


AH price isn't the issue. 50,000 white damage doing 900,000 crit damage is obscene, game-breaking, & niche-forcing. AH prices will adjust themselves with a 100% cap on crit damage (WHICH MAKES LOGICAL SENSE!) & force things like Witching Hour from not only being BiS, but NECESSARY to have real DPS. one of many examples.


hyperbole.
max crit damage from 50k is approx 350000, excluding passives.

wh 50%
dualwield + sockets = 400%
amulet = 100%
rings = 50%x2
glove = 50%
total crit dmg max for gear = 700% .

sure barbs can get to 800% perhaps using compass rose set (50% cdmg) and ruthless passive (50% cdmg) , but generally using compass rose+ travellers pledge will gimp your ias/cc instead,
Edited by chrisloup#6305 on 1/21/2013 8:11 PM PST
People like OP are pretty brain dead, go to any calculator, and remove both CC/CD from all your gear, and take a look at your DPS, now put CC/CD back and remove only primary stats from all your gear and look at you DPS.

Think before you post.


http://www.d3rawr.com/c

ooh, I just tested
480 int, 49.5%cc, 192% cdmg = 29548 dps

2195 int, 5%cc, 50% cdmg = 61445

seems to me primary stats are too powerful, nerf primary stats.
!@#$ that to late to nerf cc so many people worked hard for there gear just. Shade your lazy and do t wanna find good gear with cc doesn't mean people should accept what you think is right so you whine about something else
I wouldnt mind some re-balancing with crit stats, the entire game is now based around them, I really want a tank monk to be viable in mp10, but it is not possible, LOH, armor, res, and def build wont survive, need high dps/ls
Edited by chinchilla#1635 on 1/21/2013 8:08 PM PST
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